04 dually bottoms out the suspension

[sag2]

Had a customer that is complaining about their new 04 dually bottoming out on bumps with their six horse Featherlite (14,000 lb GVWR) trailer. They have an 01 dually and there are no indications on the snubber that they have ever hit. I know the suspension is much softer on the 3rd gen trucks, but has anyone else had this problem with theirs? By the way, the dealer replaced both rear springs at 500 miles, and they said it made a little difference, but the snubber on the new truck show obvious signs of hitting. The GAWR on the 04 is 9350# compared to 7500# on the 01, so you would think the new truck should handle the weight better than the old one. We wre thinking about adding another leaf, but just wanted to get another opinion before that.

 

[MMeier]

sag2, I would imagine it has the camper package with the overloads on it, right? If its hitting he bumpstops something must be wrong then!

 

[y-knot]

The newer trucks are sprung softer. I also believe they have longer, 52" rear springs. This is there effert to improve ride quality, I would think a good set of air bags might be your best route. I have run them for years on several trucks, and had very good luck with them. If you do go that way a on-board air source is a very wise and usefull investment, I would recomend Quick Air. They have several models out, but the II and III series are great, much better then anything Air Lift or Firestone has to offer. Good luck

 

[Bill Stockard]

Originally posted by sag2

Had a customer that is complaining about their new 04 dually bottoming out on bumps with their six horse Featherlite (14,000 lb GVWR) trailer. They have an 01 dually and there are no indications on the snubber that they have ever hit. I know the suspension is much softer on the 3rd gen trucks, but has anyone else had this problem with theirs? By the way, the dealer replaced both rear springs at 500 miles, and they said it made a little difference, but the snubber on the new truck show obvious signs of hitting. The GAWR on the 04 is 9350# compared to 7500# on the 01, so you would think the new truck should handle the weight better than the old one. We wre thinking about adding another leaf, but just wanted to get another opinion before that.

What he is hearing is the ends of the overload springs "slapping" frame mounted overload spring bumpers, not the axle bump stops. I had the same thing when loading our 4,000+ lb. Lance camper on our '03 3500 dually. The rear suspension is so robust that with the camper on board the overloads barely touch the frame mounted stops, in fact the truck doesn't even level out! On rough pavement the overloads "slap" the stops and make a banging noise. I use air bags to raise the rear of the truck slightly to stop the noise.



Bill

 

[Sherman]

Originally posted by sag2

Had a customer that is complaining about their new 04 dually bottoming out on bumps with their six horse Featherlite (14,000 lb GVWR) trailer. They have an 01 dually and there are no indications on the snubber that they have ever hit. I know the suspension is much softer on the 3rd gen trucks, but has anyone else had this problem with theirs? By the way, the dealer replaced both rear springs at 500 miles, and they said it made a little difference, but the snubber on the new truck show obvious signs of hitting. The GAWR on the 04 is 9350# compared to 7500# on the 01, so you would think the new truck should handle the weight better than the old one. We wre thinking about adding another leaf, but just wanted to get another opinion before that.

How much wt is on the goosen eck,if the axles are well back on the tr then your wt on the pin might be too high,I don't think the springs on the 04 are as stiff as the 01. On my o4 I changed out the overload bumb stops to 21/2" bump stopsto help with this problem,check the overload spring while the tr is being lowered onto the pin and see how much preload that the overload spring is taking up,then check how much distance that you have between the frame and axle,also ask the driver under what situation is the truck bottoming out,mine would do it on county back roads but was good on the interstates. The bigger bump stops workedfor me. I would suggest changing out the stops,it's an inexpensive place to start,and they are is to change out. I am about to move up to a bigger tr(16000#) so my problems may come back.

 

[sag2]

We are going to get the goosneck hitch weight. I suspect there is way too much weight on the rear axle. The overloads are well on the snubbers with just the trailer weight, and when you add the six horses, there is only 1 1/4" from the snubbers to the axle. I'm sure on the first good bump, the snubbers are bottoming on the axle. The old truck was probably overloaded also, but the springs are much stiffer, hence the snubbers never hit. The total drop when loaded measured at the spring hanger bolt at the rear is four inches.

 

[Bill Stockard]

Originally posted by sag2

We are going to get the goosneck hitch weight. I suspect there is way too much weight on the rear axle. The overloads are well on the snubbers with just the trailer weight, and when you add the six horses, there is only 1 1/4" from the snubbers to the axle. I'm sure on the first good bump, the snubbers are bottoming on the axle. The old truck was probably overloaded also, but the springs are much stiffer, hence the snubbers never hit. The total drop when loaded measured at the spring hanger bolt at the rear is four inches.

That trailer has some serious hitch weight! They should be towing it with a medium duty truck!



There are quite a few horse ranches in our area. Many of them have torn up one ton truck trucks trying to tow big horse trailers with them and been forced to use medium duty trucks. The one ton suspensions, drivelines, and brakes won't handle the load.



Bill

 

[Sherman]

6 horse

Originally posted by sag2

We are going to get the goosneck hitch weight. I suspect there is way too much weight on the rear axle. The overloads are well on the snubbers with just the trailer weight, and when you add the six horses, there is only 1 1/4" from the snubbers to the axle. I'm sure on the first good bump, the snubbers are bottoming on the axle. The old truck was probably overloaded also, but the springs are much stiffer, hence the snubbers never hit. The total drop when loaded measured at the spring hanger bolt at the rear is four inches.

There are a lot of dually's pulling 6 horse tr's that are not over loaded but for some reason this one is. I suspect the tr axles are too far to the rear of the tr,check to see what is in the front of the tr,ie full water tank some guy's have a double tack and have them overloaded with every thing under the sun!!!!!Is this tr 8ft wide or 6-10,is it 8ft or 7 ft high?Is there a living quarters in the front?If the pin wt is at the max for the truck then you would have to add a spring to the stack,but if you are over the max wt then you PUNT.

 

[Casey Balvert]

I had a similar problem with my heavy fifth wheel. Felt like it would bottom out. I installed Timbrens and that took the harshness out of it when it tried to bottom out. The Timbrens replace the hard rubber snubber on the bottom of the frame.

 

[tgrfan2]

air bags

A friend has a 2003 3500 SRW pulling a fiver with 2700# pin wgt and his overloads barely touch. You must have a very high pin wgt. I would recommend air bags so you don't get the harshness of extra leaf springs. Ever followed an unloaded F550 down the road? They bounce over the paint stripes!

 

[sag2]

Here are the weights. I do not think they are fully loaded, but should be close.



Truck and trailer 19,220

Truck 6,920

Trailer 12,300

Axles 8,720

Tongue 3,780

 

[Sherman]

wts

Originally posted by sag2

Here are the weights. I do not think they are fully loaded, but should be close.



Truck and trailer 19,220

Truck 6,920

Trailer 12,300

Axles 8,720

Tongue 3,780

This truck is not overloaded including the pin wt at 3780#,the problem is that Dodge has gone after the light duty dually market with the much improved ride when empty but has sacrificed the loaded end, I have the same problem as you but not as bad ,at least not yet,I talked to my dealer with no results. I would suggest the overload spring bump stop change as previously discussed and then adding a set of Timbrens between the the frame and axle if the 2 1/2" bump stop doesn't do the trick. Air bags are also an option,I don't like them because of the sway in the corners. To reduce the sway you need heavy duty shocks,the oem shocks are not stong enough. If the wt's for the tr are empty then when you start putting 1000# horses up in the front of the tr then you could be over loading the rear axle of the truck,with 3 horses in the front 3 stalls assuming it's a slant load, you will add at least 1500# to the pin wt. Does the empty wt include water?Is the water tank in front of the tr axles?Thewater tank is usually in the front of the tr if it has a tank. I would suggest if these are empty wt's that you load the tr with horses ,water and show equipment the way that you would normally load and head back to the scales,you may be in for a surprise. The 03-04 is not sprung as heavy as the 01-02. Good luck Rob PS-I'm looking forward to the loaded wt's.

 

[John - K5AWO]

IMO air bags would be the ticket.



Add more leafs and they won't be able to ride in it empty. Will feel like a box wagon and no springs.