2WD performance in snow

[klenger]

I am considering trading my current truck (see sig. ) for a 2001. 5 2500 LWB 2WD ETH/DEE 4. 10 LSD for daily transportation and for towing the 5er. I am well aware of the pros and cons of 2WD vs. 4WD for normal driving and for towing, and am considering the 2WD based on the advantages the 2WD offers (primarily lower height and weight and better fuel economy).



I would like to hear from experienced owners of 2WD trucks how the 2500 2WD with LSD performs in the snow and ice both empty and towing. I realize that the 2WD will not perform like a 4X4, but is the traction sufficient to get around with normal traffic like front wheel drive cars? I do not plan to use the truck off road, but do travel some unpaved back roads when camping.



9-17-01 Update:

Thanks for all of your responses. After talking this over with the wife, doing a reality check, and reading all of your input, I have ruled out the 2WD. If I do trade, it will be for a 2001. 5 2500 LWB Quad Cab ETH/DEE 4. 10 LSD Atlantic Blue/Agate as described on this invoice. It's not a good time to be making large purchases, but the deal is very tempting, and I don't think I'll have this opportunity again for awhile. It seems to be the best Dodge 2500 package for towing our 5er.

 

[Coop]

I've just moved up here, and been asking many people the same question. I'm told that my 2wd should perform adequately in the snow and ice around here, as long as I'm just around here. They've said that if I go up in the mountains I could have a little more trouble. I'll see this winter for myself... .



Most of the people I've talked with are from where I work, not other TDR members.

 

[Cooker]

I know I don't fit the profile of responses you are looking for, but I'll share my $. 02.



I have lived in a relatively urban ares my entire life, and I have always had a 4x4 (but FWIW I have had a few rear wheel drive cars as well). In the winter I very rarely (read almost never) use 4wd to drive around town. Some may think it's kind of stupid that I don't use it, but I don't drive a 4wd to get me around my daily driving. I have found a good set of rear tires and some weight in the bed goes a long ways.



I always wanted to buy 2wd (for the better fuel economy) and put a lift on it to make it look like a 4x4, but there are them few occassions a year when 4wd is necessary (at least for me), which included getting back to a friends cabin, towing a snowmobile trailer into unplowed stagging areas, and towing friends out of the ditch.



Just my $. 02,

Ryan

 

[illflem]

Since I have one of each I feel qualified to answer. As long as you have good tires, weight in the back and stay on maintained roads a 2WD LSD is fine. If it's a heavy snow and the plows get behind a 4WD is much better. Backing up on a slight, slick incline is almost impossible with my 2WD. If you plan on driving dirt forest roads with a camper or trailer even in the summer the 4WD wins just because of low transfer case range. If I were to have only one it would defiantly be a 4WD, as it is now my 2WD is parked most of the winter, I like the extra insurance of the front drive.

 

[roadranger]

2wd will work, IF...

I had a 2wd pickup before trading for my 4wd CTD, and have been thru 5 winters with it in Colorado.



The 2wd pickup was OK for getting back and forth to work as long as full snow tires were mounted, and about 200 pounds of sand bags placed over the rear axle(NOT behind it). I had been caught a couple of times without the weight in the back, and had a difficult time getting started from any traffic lights located on hills. Also had a set of chains which were used 2-3 times a winter with the weight to get home thru the unplowed residental roads in this town. Chains are an immense help in the frequent icy conditions also, it's just a PITA to put them on.



Also, watch out for the anti-lock brakes! Once you slide the wheels, it'll take 5 city blocks to get stopped. You CAN steer into whatever you are about to hit, though.



Haven't been thru a winter here yet with the 4x4 CTD. Got the stock Michelins mounted (buying 4 tires at a time gets expensive), saved my sand bag weights, and have one set of chains for it. We'll see.....

 

[TDickerson]

4x4 is so cool though.

I had to have a 4x4 mainly because it was just cool to have. I mean how often do you use 4 wheel drive in San Antonio. I did ***** about the extra maintenance though and the times we went to Corpus Christi I had a chance to use it on the beach just to get the 4 wheel drive unit good and lubed up, figure it was good to do this once in awhile. Now, one time I was pulling my 22' travel trailer down to Corpus and was checking out different camp sites. It had rained previous to this and the camp grounds were pretty saturated. I went into one and got to a point that I had to turn pretty sharp to get out and got caught into some mud and the back wheels started to dig in. My wife said use the 4 wheel drive. Duh, hell I never used this for this type of situation. So I put it into gear and pulled me right out and kept on going. I'm sure that without it I was going to have to be pulled out. What a pain that would have been. So, is the 4x4 worth it, hell yes. My next truck, 2003, will be a 4x4. Just in case I need it again.

 

[klenger]

After talking to the wife (who prefers that I don't trade at all), she feels that it would be foolish to get the 2WD.



The dealer also this 4X4 2500 ETH/DEE 4. 10. Current incentives on 2001 2500 trucks is $2000 rebate or 3. 9% financing for 60 months. That helps offset the Ouch from the trade-in.

 

[hammersley]

Don't mess with a 2wd

Ok OK all of you 2wd's start yelling - but if you live in snow country you can't gp wrong with a 4X4. Certainly the resale alone is worth the extra $$. One place where a 4x4 comes in handy in the city is on hills and they don't have to be very steep - even off ramps on flat terrain with an icy glaze, those just from folks driving on snow, means when traffic stops and you are on the hill - well - there you are - stopped on the hill! Even front wheel drive cars will do better than you will, especially with all that weight of an ISB upfront. My . 02 - pony up the extra dough - or move to, well Texas!

 

[willyslover]

please remember to TIE down the sand bags

hurts like helll when they hit ya in the back o the head !

 

[Straight6Jeff]

2wd definitely takes a little more finesse in the snow. First thing I did was ditch the factory tires and put some BFG A/T on it. Also, the LSD in my rear acts more like a locker. It chirps, chatters the tires, and makes all kinds of racket, but both tires spin. Momentum is key in the snow, as is wheel speed to keep the tread clear.



Oh yeah, I always carry a shovel and gravel just in case.

 

[SlyBones]

Originally posted by VeeTenJeff

Momentum is key in the snow, as is wheel speed to keep the tread clear.

I used to go all over the place in my 2wd gasser ( 96 Dodge 1500 5. 9L ), before I got the diesel. It did not have the LSD either. Drove around many 4wd on our way up skiing ( morons I'm sure ). Similar to using friciton modifier in the diff, there is a fine balance between enough power to maintain the monentum and too much power and lost traction. -- Throttle control is where its at. The ability to carefully control and feather the throttle.



For me listening to the engine speed and wheel spin is the key. Waiting until you feel the loss in traction, or see the rear end start out, you have already lost many split seconds in throttle control. When the rear end is already part way out before you even begin to feather the throttle is way too late. Unless you are just going too fast, there were signals before that.



Compared to many friends who always have the stereo playing, or are talking up a storm. I turn off the stereo and have the cab quiet when we hit the snow zone. Listen to what you truck is telling you and control the throttle well. -- When that fails put the chains on. -- In 4 winters with my gasser, going skiing all the time I only used them like 2-3 times. Mostly to get started. Once rolling I never had a problem.



And of course this is from a guy who lives where they dont know how to drive in snow, so take it as you like.

 

[jeepit]

Lkenger, Where did you hear about $2000 cash back? I only see cash abck of $1000 on 2500 models!!!

 

[klenger]

Heard about the $2000 rebate at Boradway Dodge yesterday.

 

[Wheaties]

Originally posted by willyslover

please remember to TIE down the sand bags

hurts like helll when they hit ya in the back o the head !

Amen to that. DavidVT told me a story about a friend of his who put a load of sandbags in the back of his truck and then went off the road. What you've done is build a big slide hammer. The sand slid forward and pushed the whole bed up against the driver's seat, I think this was a quad cab. Dave was concerned because I had put sand in the back of my truck, and justifiably so, his friend was badly hurt.



Tie the sand down!!



For my $. 02, a 2wd drive will get farther than a 4wd in 2 because of the additional weight of the front axle. But once the 4wd is in 4, the situation switches in a big way. Some regard it to be a license to get really stuck



klenger, I'd stay with the 4x4 until after you've spent at least one winter in CO, then you'll have first hand knowlege and can make an educated decision.



Matt

 

[Straight6Jeff]

SlyBones, it must be something with the people who live in Everett. I live in Everett, MA, and I have witnessed first hand my two neighbors hit their house with tires wildly spinning in snow. I completely agree that the stereo is off when the snow is falling. You have to be able to "feel" what the tires are doing. I also use the side mirrors a lot to see if it is dog-tracking or if ice is on one side.



Personally, I have a blast in the snow. .

 

[Hammer]

2wd vs 4wd

My . 02 worth,,Before I had ever been explained to about the TDR and its benefits I myself owned 3 2wd CTD's,,My first was a 89(Tundra brown-Sand Metallic),second was a 92(Intense Blue) third was a 95(FLame Red-Driftwood),,I had no problems till another person got my into BOMBing mode on my 95,,Making a long story short,after a TST plate,injectors and a convertor swap my 95 got quite adventurous in the small Pa winter storms,,I even tried the old studded snow tire trick with sand in the back(properly anchored),,See where i live in my develpoment its all hills to my house,,One particular storm a few years ago I really got a lesson in snow driving a BOMBed 2wd when on a trip upstate for my sons JBT bowling tournament we got slammed with a Noreaster,,Hit the snow in Hazelton and had it all the way in,till I got home 12 inches had fallen and NO amount of getting me up the hill would work,,Seems too much torque and 2wd mixed with snow equaled me walking up long hill after we tried to burn our way up,,Thing that really jacked me up was,as I sat there spining my A#^ off a Powerpuke 4x4 passes me laughing his A** off,,Well needless to sayaway goes the 2wd and in comes my 4x4 and I'll never purchase another again,,Better resale value for 4x4 and the stance is the deal,tall and nasty,,Incedently,the tears from the studs STILL show proudly in the street till this day and evry time I run over them I get a chuckle...

 

[klenger]

mwheaton



Actually, I have lived in Colorado for 25 years now. My question was regarding the 2WD performance. If I make the trade, it will be for the 4WD.

 

[David_VT]

Tie down ballast!!

Three warning about properly securing a load in your bed is probably enough. I want to talk 2wd / 4wd.



My experience is with driving my 4WD LS in 2WD. There may be some slight difference between a real 2WD and using mine as a 2WD.



Heavy trailer: Backing up even the slightest grade on anything other than perfect asphalt. Challenging.



Slick (snow/ice) road with LS rear: Deadly combination if the 4wd lever was not there to reach for



Slick (snow/ice) interstate, crawling behind a plow train: I've gone sideways going up slight grades and watched others with only 2wd do the same. Difference, I can reach for the lever and they can't.



Steep grade driveway made of staymat or packed gravel: Walk up



etc etc etc...



Our trucks are way heavy up front and it is a shame to not have the ability to tap into the readily available traction when you have a geared axle under the cummins beast.



Just my . 02

 

[ftb87]

Klinger,



How much fuel do you think you'll save vs. 4x4? I have gone been through a heavy wet snow (last spring) and tried to make it out of my father-in-law's drive way couldn't make it in 2 wheel drive.



My . 02 worth... . keep the 4 wheel drive. You could be up in the mtns in late June and hit a big snow storm.



Frank

 

[Wheaties]

Oooops!

klenger,



I don't know how I missed that! You already have a 2wd and are thinking about the 4wd?



Now I understand your plight! It makes sense, but it's going to cost... This is a tough choice.



If it were me, I'd probably go for it and get the 4wd, but I'm not you. Good luck.



Matt