3" brakes on W-250

[Case500D]

Well I now have the rear brakes completed on the Dodge and I really like them. I put 3" pads and 1-1/8" wheel cylinders on it. Now it stops like it should. I found a broken adjuster cable and a frozen up adjuster on the driver's side brake. The brake pedal now feels totaly different. It is soft at first and gradually gets more firm. It travels almost 2" before the brakes get real agressive. Does this sound normal? The pedal is firm and holds well at a stop. It does not bleed off and go to the floor. The reason I am concerned is that it doesn't feel like it used to. It only used to travel an inch or so before it became agressive. Or maybe my mind is playing tricks on me.

I would strongly suggest any 1st generation owner do this when they redo the rear brakes. I have $180 invested in parts and turning the drums. I can provide NAPA part numbers if anyone is interested.

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Jeremy Sweeten 1992 Dodge W-250 4x4 Cummins Diesel, Intercooled,LE Package, 168K, 518 AT, Warner Hubs, Dana 60HD 4,060 lb. front axle and Dana 70 6,084 lb. limited slip rear axle with 3. 54 gears, NPG 205 transfer case, 3. 5" Banks exhaust straight pipe, K&N air filter. Tekonsha Voyager XP electric brake controller. Una-Goose 30,000 lb. gooseneck hitch.
http://home.earthlink.net/~sweeten1/index.htm

 

[Paul Herioux]

Jeremy,
Sounds like your shoes might be adjusted a little loose. Try some firm stops in reverse and see if the pedal comes up some.

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The smiling ex-dealer technician
89 w250, 47rh trans, cleaned up exhaust, Dynomax bullet muffer, 3" lift, unknown oversized injectors

 

[sam peterson]

Case--the most likely problem of the low pedal is the arc of the shoes to the drums. If the drums were turned and you used pre-arced shoes out of the box you probably have too much heal & toe clearance. Only time will help this & some frequent adjustments. If you were close to my shop I would arc the shoes to fit the drums. You can check to see if this is the problem by clamping off the rear brake hose to see if the pedal comes up. Good luck---Sam

 

[AlK]

Jeremy,
I will need to do a complete brake job in the near future. Can you give me the part numbers?
---
Al

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92-LE,4x4,5spd,3. 54,Borgeson steering shaft, Tach,Isspro Pyro & Boost, 16cm2, PW injectors

 

[hdm48]

Jeremy, one thing i need to ask is, if you pump the peddle once does it become firm and near the top? if it does, you have a bad ABS valve. actually it is the accumulator solinoid in the valve. most brake shops will tell you this part does'nt go bad but I have proof that it does. It's sitting in my driveway! an easy way to check this is [the way I did] is to remove the valve and make a spacer to replace the spring in the accumulator. NOTE: spacer to be equal to spring ' installed height'. THIS WILL DISABLE YOUR ABS VALVE!! but it cured my spongy peddle. do this only after you have tried all other tests. good luck.

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late 91, 4x4,pump+25%,pw's,16cm,fresh air,3 1/2 exaust,trans-boost-exaust-oil temp guages, pumped auto,180. 000m,all black

 

[Case500D]

I have been away to southern Indiana for a couple of days and am suprised to see the number of responses. When I got the drums back, I laid the shoes in the drum and they seemed to fit very nicely. I am not sure how to tell if they are arced properly. I just found out that the passenger side adjuster is now turning in both directions, so I wonder if the adjuster cable broke or something like that. It did work when I put it together. I have tried several times adjusting backup/pull foreward. I am going to bleed the rear lines off one more time and then take the passenger side apart to try and fix the adjuster.

The brakes do firm up if pump the pedal once while braking. Right now though, I can make the rear brakes lock up just with pushing the pedal once (so I think they may be adjusted up OK). My wife said she has had no problems while driving the truck the past couple of days. I will see what I can find this weekend. Thanks for all of the advice and help.

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Jeremy Sweeten 1992 Dodge W-250 4x4 Cummins Diesel, Intercooled,LE Package, 168K, 518 AT, Warner Hubs, Dana 60HD 4,060 lb. front axle and Dana 70 6,084 lb. limited slip rear axle with 3. 54 gears, NPG 205 transfer case, 3. 5" Banks exhaust straight pipe, K&N air filter. Tekonsha Voyager XP electric brake controller. Una-Goose 30,000 lb. gooseneck hitch.
http://home.earthlink.net/~sweeten1/index.htm

 

[Case500D]

Okay, here is an update. The adjuster cable on the right side came unhooked. I rehooked the cable and now have a firm brake pedal and now really have great stopping power. Thanks for the ideas and help.

Al, here is a list of part numbers for you, they are all NAPA part numbers and I got all of the lifetime parts. Here goes:

(2) Oil seal: 28746, ~$23
(1) Set of 3" brake pads: AE-358R, ~$60
(1) 1-1/8" wheel cylinder: 36057, ~$32
(1) 1-1/8" wheel cylinder: 36058, ~$32
(1) Brake spring kit: 492243, ~$8

I hope this helps you out. I am nt sure why the wheel cylinders have different part numbers, unless they are for left and right sides. I could not see any difference in them when I installed them. I am sure anyone that makes this upgrade will absolutely love it.

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Jeremy Sweeten 1992 Dodge W-250 4x4 Cummins Diesel, Intercooled,LE Package, 168K, 518 AT, Warner Hubs, Dana 60HD 4,060 lb. front axle and Dana 70 6,084 lb. limited slip rear axle with 3. 54 gears, NPG 205 transfer case, 3. 5" Banks exhaust straight pipe, K&N air filter. 3" rear brakes with 1-1/8" wheel cylinders. Tekonsha Voyager XP electric brake controller. Una-Goose 30,000 lb. gooseneck hitch.
http://home.earthlink.net/~sweeten1/index.htm

 

[Big Don]

Tell me more. I like the sound of this. 'Ol Blue has the 2. 5" shoes. I printed the part # list, but will this work with my drums or do I need wider drums??

thanks
Don

 

[fastmark]

Don, the drums are the same. Just swap the 3" shoes. Now for the ultimate question. Why didn't Mopar put the 3" shoes on the trucks in the first place?

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Mark Faught, 92 ext cab service truck and a 84 crew cab one ton dually with a 91 cummins and NV 4500.

 

[Shrimpy]

Hey Case, good job on the brakes!!! I had the same thing happen on mine with the adjuster cable comming "unhooked". On mine the little piece that acts like a runway for the cable to lay in came unhooked from the backing plate. I also had to slightly bend the piece of metal that is suppose to keep the adjusters from spinning backwards. It is about three inches long and as you turn the adjuster wheel it clicks by. The teeth in the adjuster wheel are cut one way and will fall in place like a "dog bar" on a large winch to keep it from back spinning.

I was like you with the wheel cylinders, they looked the same but the guy at the parts house marked them left and right???? I had to put the 1" wheel cylinders on mine because the rubber groumants that protect the pistons, rubbed and were pooched out from hitting the backing plate when I tightened them down. Not sure why this happened.

I did mine in January, and have to adjust my brakes about every 3000 miles (once a month). This is a pain in the a$$ but I like tha idea of beeing able to stop when I need to!!!!!

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92 Ext. Cab, Auto trans. , 3. 54 Non-LS, Isspro Tach, 16 cm housing, PW injectors, no name 3 Gauge cluster, 230,000+ miles, straight pipe, old and abused but still running strong!!!!

 

[Case500D]

I had my rear drums turned down and it cost me $30 to have it done. The 3" shoes would not have fit otherwise. As for the wheel cylinders, the rubber boots on mine made contact with the backing plate, but it didn't really distort them. Anyway, aren't the rubber caps just dust covers?

Also, I "think" I have heard or read somewhere on TDR that Dodge issued a TSB (about 1994 or 1995) stating that all of the 1st gen trucks should have 3" brakes installed if they came back to the dealer for a rear brake job. I hope someone can verify this, if not sorry for spreadying a rumor.

It only took me 20 minutes to rehook the adjuster cable. My adjuster was turning in either direction and it was really anoying. I just hooked the cable back on and made sure the adjuster was ratcheting. As for the cable "runway" on the brake shoe, mnan those things are a pain in the butt to move from the old shoes to the new shoes. Especially when you put it on the wrong end of the shoe, then on the wrong side, dang it all anyway! It was late, what can I say? Those things sure aren't meant to be bent a lot, so be careful. But now the pedal is firm and everything works fine.

 

[fastmark]

Yes, there was a TSB on the 3" brakes for the old trucks.

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Mark Faught, 92 ext cab service truck and a 84 crew cab one ton dually with a 91 cummins and NV 4500.

 

[RDBuck]

Regarding the 1 1/8 wheel cylinders fitting too snug- Raybestos makes a 1 1/16 cyl. , part # WC37538 that fits just fine.

 

[sam peterson]

all of the wheel cylinder sizes from 7/8 to 1 3/16 will fit in the backing plates. different manufactures castings are sized a little different but they will all work. It doesn't matter if the dust boots contact the plate a little.

 

[Case500D]

Check this out and let me know what you guys think.

http://home.earthlink.net/~sweeten1/1992_trucks.htm

[This message has been edited by Case500D (edited 05-24-2001). ]