351 VGT Turbo Assistance

[Surefire89]

I took my 2011 6. 7 to the dealer to have my turbo cleaned as it was under warranty. I don't understand how one can get gummed up with carbon enough to stop working when my truck has been deleted since day one. Anyway. I got the service performed and it didn't last but 100 miles before becoming stuck on again in the closed position I'd call it.



So at this time I'm changing my turbo out with a new 2009 model 351 Vgt and there are slight differences. Does anybody know if they will self calibrate or do you have to take it to the dealer?

 

[RVTRKN]

I'm no expert, just learned from prior posts. 1st, the earlier turbos didn't have cleaning ports. 2nd, it was common for Dodge to clean first then replace turbo's on the early versions, I not sure about the newer models or policies. But with the deletes I imagine the carbon still builds up, always keep your EB on unless in icy conditions to keep the VGT from heavy buildup of carbon.

 

[DieselLady]

Drive it like you stole it and it won't soot up nearly as bad. last year, I worked 1 block from home. After a month of 1 block at a time, my turbo was sooted up. Even with full deletes. You still need to drive it hard to keep it hot enough to burn all the soot away.

 

[rscurtis]

Stupid question, but why didn't you just walk to work?

 

[DieselLady]

I road my bike for a while till the weather got bad. Plus it was straight up and down. LOL
Besides, I like bringing my 2nd cup of coffee with me to work. ") haha

 

[Surefire89]

Oh trust me this is my race car and I drive it like I stole it every day. I always drive with my EB on even on sheer ice it actually works very well to slow down. Just be ready to get a little western with it if it engages above 2000 rpms. IMO the turbos are junky to small and should have never been put on.

 

[cerberusiam]

The sliding collar runs in the exhaust stream, it will always carbon up no matter what. Doing the deletes and getting rid of the factory tune just causes it to happen faster. Will always be a problem with them, even worse for modified trucks. At some point a non-VGT turbo just makes sense.

 

[DieselLady]

The sliding collar runs in the exhaust stream, it will always carbon up no matter what. Doing the deletes and getting rid of the factory tune just causes it to happen faster. Will always be a problem with them, even worse for modified trucks. At some point a non-VGT turbo just makes sense.

No necessarily, If you don't tune the crap out of it, they surprisingly run very clean. And it has been proven that if you drive em like you stole them, they tend to not get sticky turbos as much. The heat keeps the soot and carbon burned off the ring in the turbo. So Yes, and no to that. You really need to drive the you know what out of them to keep them running good.

 

[seafish]

The sliding collar runs in the exhaust stream, it will always carbon up no matter what. Doing the deletes and getting rid of the factory tune just causes it to happen faster. Will always be a problem with them, even worse for modified trucks. At some point a non-VGT turbo just makes sense.

Cerb, just curious if you know if thye soot up less when used on a 5. 9 with less EGR??

 

[Jim W]

Cerb, just curious if you know if thye soot up less when used on a 5. 9 with less EGR??

I maybe wrong but I do not believe the 5. 9L engine had a VGT turbo the VGT's were on the 6. 7L engine. They were fixed geometry turbo in the 5. 9L ISB Cummins. Depending on year of truck they could have been either Holset HY-35 (98-02) or a HE-351cw (03-07) model number of the turbo.
Jim W.

 

[cerberusiam]

No necessarily, If you don't tune the crap out of it, they surprisingly run very clean.

My point exactly. If one does the deletes and adds the programmer all that goes out the window. EGT's are reduced and soot increases. If the EGR and sensors are deleted but no tuning done then they will work better but soot still increases without the EGR. The high EGT's and minimal soot of the factory tunes is what allows them to work. Retune for engine efficiency and it messes up the turbo control.

Cerb, just curious if you know if thye soot up less when used on a 5. 9 with less EGR??

They are a PIA on a turned up 12V, that much I know for sure. They work great but they will stick frequently. On a clean running and emissions compliant 5. 9 they would be much better, but, you would have to drive the snot out of them all the time to keep the soot burned out of the hot side of the turbo.

 

[seafish]

I maybe wrong but I do not believe the 5. 9L engine had a VGT turbo the VGT's were on the 6. 7L engine. They were fixed geometry turbo in the 5. 9L ISB Cummins. Depending on year of truck they could have been either Holset HY-35 (98-02) or a HE-351cw (03-07) model number of the turbo.
Jim W.

Yup... you are correct, right now my 2005 has the HE351cw (non-vgt) turbo, but I have been collecting parts and controllers to replace it with the HE351ve turbo in order to upgrade to a quicker spooling, better flowing turbo with the exhaust brake feature.

 

[seafish]

They are a PIA on a turned up 12V, that much I know for sure. They work great but they will stick frequently. On a clean running and emissions compliant 5. 9 they would be much better, but, you would have to drive the snot out of them all the time to keep the soot burned out of the hot side of the turbo.

Thanks, that was what I was hoping to hear... I kind of drive that way anyway. lol

 

[DonFitzwater]

Surefire, are you and your truck in Juneau?

 

[cerberusiam]

Yup... you are correct, right now my 2005 has the HE351cw (non-vgt) turbo, but I have been collecting parts and controllers to replace it with the HE351ve turbo in order to upgrade to a quicker spooling, better flowing turbo with the exhaust brake feature.

Well, you get sort of an exhaust brake and depending on settings it will spool a little better, but, better flowing is highly questionable. They are efectively the same thing as HE351 with an adjustable housing size form 3 cm to 21 cm.

 

[seafish]

Well, you get sort of an exhaust brake and depending on settings it will spool a little better, but, better flowing is highly questionable. They are efectively the same thing as HE351 with an adjustable housing size form 3 cm to 21 cm.

Of course, that's all true, but the housing on an HE351cw is only 9 cm with an a/r of . 68. Please correct me if I am wrong, but I have read that the HE351ve, with it's 3cm to 21cm variable housing has an a/r of . 31 fully closed to almost 1. 8 fully open. That has GOT to flow better then the HE351cw with its a/r of . 68, plus the Fleece controller is fully prgrammable, both in the amont of closure for the EB, as well as how far it opens over the operating range of the turbo. It even has an adjustment knob that can change the pre-programmed vein settings up to 25% in each direction, while you are driving, so it is possible to lessen drive pressure at highway speeds for better mpg, yet still retain quick spool-up, simply by turning a knob in the cab.

I DO realize that there are better spooling and better flowing turbos that can run with a turbo back exhaust brake that will easily outperform the VGT, but I also like the idea of simply incorporating Cummins parts from the 6. 7 onto my 5. 9. And at this point in time, I have found ALL the parts that I need for the conversion (He351ve, 6. 7 exhaust manifold with delete plates, and Fleece VGT controller) all with LOW mileage and in great condition, for less then $700, which is MUCH less then a turbo and exhasut brake would cost me. I am NOT saying there won't be drawbacks to this system, but it is definitely something I want to pursue, though NOT necessarily if the turbo is sooting up all the time.

 

[cerberusiam]

I thik the HE451VE makes a better performance turbo to swap in but the HE351VE should work. A lot will depend on the Fleece controller and how it works. Be interesting to see what your results are.

 

[seafish]

I thik the HE451VE makes a better performance turbo to swap in but the HE351VE should work. A lot will depend on the Fleece controller and how it works. Be interesting to see what your results are.

Yeah... I'll start a thread on it when I start the work sometime this winter. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Surefire89]

Surefire, are you and your truck in Juneau?

Yeah sure are! Why?

 

[Surefire89]

I thik the HE451VE makes a better performance turbo to swap in but the HE351VE should work. A lot will depend on the Fleece controller and how it works. Be interesting to see what your results are.

Good luck getting the 451 to fit. .