Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) 370's vs DD3's vs BD 80's

[Bhale]

I need new injectors.



OK, OK i WANT new injectors.



But which ones should i get?



I've been reading tons of old posts and most folks seem to go with the 370's but the smoke and haze make me a bit uncomfortable with them so the DD3's might be better, but they're an additional $300. I don't mind paying for quality if they're worth it Are the DD'3 reworked 215 or 370?



What about the 80 HP BD injectors? At $800 they should be something special but I've not heard anything about them

http://www.bullydog.com/sale.pl?item=212080



See my sig... . Mostly my rides a daily driver but about 5k miles a year are with the camper and boat. Right now, if i push it hard, my EGT's max out at ~1200 loaded.



BTW, I'll be bumping the timing and adding a 16cm housing when the injectors go in.



..... or am i just putting too much thought into this...



Thanks for any input!

Brian

 

[RHARVEY]

Guessing from your signature that you have a 180 pump??? If you dont want to start turbo changing to keep the egts down... might I suggest a set of 215 injectors. With the stock HX35/14 gated housing you should be able to turn the heat down with the plate.

Also a suggestion would be to change out the #4 to a #10... That way with the #10 plate you can fine tune the fuel.

With my 215 p-pump truck,PDR HX35/14 gated housing it was a runner.



Just a suggestion... .



Rick

 

[Bhale]

Thanks Rick...



May sound like a silly question but if i swap out a #10 for my #4 won't i be loosing power? Or are you suggesting a #10 with the higher hp injectors?



Brian

 

[RHARVEY]

The beauty of the #10 plate it is so tuneable. The power ramps in nice and smooth. There is no ledges to hang up on and then you get a bust of fuel. I ran my #10 plate about 65k forward of stock with the 215 stock injectors. . and I have seen 1400+ if I held it down. If I would be it off to stock. . temps would stay now.

All the trucks that I have put them in. . I tune them to fit the truck. One truck I did a couple of weeks ago. . is running a stock clutch and the plate is 40k behind stock location. . The truck runs great and the clutch is happy.

No if you change to the #10 plate. . you wont drop in power. . its that you can control it more. .

Use the # 10 plate with any set of injectors that you like!



Rick

 

[Cooker]

DD3's are reworked 215's



Your setup will be pretty hot with a #4 and those size injectors. The 16 housing will help a little. If you tow much wieght you might want to consider a smaller injector or a valet switch.

 

[RHARVEY]

215s,#10 plate,PDR HX35/16 and pulled 11k. On long hills I drove by the pyro but on flat or hill country it would stay down. Now I did back the plate off to stock position. I really didnt like that 16 housing because it didnt spool as quickly as I wanted to get on top of the egts. I have since replace the 16 with a wastegated 14cm housing in preps for what shows in my signature now. They are in the process now...



Rick

 

[ndurbin]

My 370s only haze on the cooler/colder mornings until the engine warms up. As for EGTs I can bury it pretty easy towing up a moderate hill but a turbo swap or water/meth injection could fix that pretty easily. The smoke personally doesn't bother me at all, it's one reason I got bigger injectors in the first place, SMOKE.



Nathan

 

[Bhale]

I should have said the smoke bothers my better half more then me (environmental engineer for DOD) so I'm trying to keep her happy also.



I considered the 215's at first but thought I'd happier with the added power from the 370's or DD3's. I don't drive it hard when loaded but enjoy the sound/acceleration when empty.



If the DD3's are reworked 215's will i get the power of the 370's and the smoke/EGT's of the 215's?



As for the #10 plate... . My #4 is basically flat with a rounded bump at the bottom as opposed to the stock one which has several sharp ridges. Is this what your talking about when you say a sudden burst of fuel? I had a #10 in it for a couple weeks and swapped in a friend's #4 to test it. I really liked the feel and power of the #4 so i bought one but I'm running it with stock injectors... .



Thanks for all the input!!!



Brian

 

[tURBOdIEZEl]

i agree with nathan, i too also get a haze ONLY when its a little cold/cool/humid. 370's provide sufficient fuel and lots of smoke , but will create EGT problems if you dont go with a bigger turbo, or get a 16cm2 housing. good luck in your search for bigger injectors. bigger is always better! :-laf

 

[Bhale]

So will the 16cm housing keep the temps down enough? I've had it sitting here for over a year but i keep hearing how slow it builds boost from idle.

 

[JGK]

Unfortunately, you're not likely to get the definitive answer you're looking for. Only what others have experienced and they are all just a little different. At some point you're going to have to jump in the water and take a few laps. If its not quite right, change something!



In general, here's what I can add (to the confusion): The 16 cm housing will help exhaust flow, thus lower EGTs, but you'll sacrifice low end spool up. Probably a fair amount. A 14 might be better on your HX35.



The #10 plate is a wonderful plate that can add all kinds of fuel as the revs rise. Joe Donnelly designed it, I believe, and it works great. But temps will rise quickly at upper revs. Slide the plate back for reduced heat. You may want to upgrade your turbo down the road to keep temps in check and properly burn the fuel you'll be adding with injectors and a plate.



While the 370s are not the ideal design for our engines, they are nearly impossible to beat for the price, particularly when you can get them from Piers on sale. I can get smoke if I jump on it down low in 3rd, 4th or 5th until the boost builds. A lot of smoke! But I don't drive it that way except when I want to produce smoke. Daily driving - its just fine. I get a little off the bottom when I get into it from a stop, but then I have the AFC pushed forward, a softer spring in it, and the wheel backed off. But I can tune that out if I need to.



-Jay

 

[Bhale]

Very thoughtful response Jay, and I think your right, jump in and test the water. I guess if i go with the 215's and don't like them/want more power i can sell them and get the 370's or something.



Hmmm now who has a sale going on.....

 

[Cooker]

If the DD3's are reworked 215's will i get the power of the 370's and the smoke/EGT's of the 215's?

Very similar in power to the 370's but not quite as minimal smoke of 215's.



IF you do the 370's and 16cm at the same time I doubt you will ever feel the added lag of the 16cm because the 370's will make up for your off the line lag.



Now if you run the 370's with the 12 you will most likely think the 16 is really laggy

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

BHale, another injector to throw into the mix are the new units DynoMite Diesel is offering (DDP). I think they're their own design. Here's a couple threads:



http://www.nwbombers.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=12242

http://www.nwbombers.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=10993&hl=

 

[JAmos]

My 370's smoke very little as long as i keep my foot of the pedal. If smoke bothered me then I would put all the pieces back into my afc and adjust it to control smoke. They make great power and I believe that they can be tuned to control smoke if you wish.



Jordan

 

[KennyM]

Bhale, You can borrow my 215's and try em out. They have 148k on them. Not sure if I want to sell them, but your welcome to borrow them. I'll be in the area around 2PM on Sat, as I'm going to the trailer show.

 

[CATCRACKER]

i like my 370 alot but only issue is on cold mornings the haze. even on cold mornings sitting at redlights they haze white. most people think its like anyother car in the cold blowing water out so it does not bother me to much. now with that said my gasket on the intake horn is split so i might be losing some air and also i need a new thermostat b/c my truck never sees 180 deg. it fluctuates from 140-170.



despite all this i would never buy the 215's i would go straigt for the db370's from piers. if you install them yourself a good tip is to use a lug nut of your truck with a 2" X 1" piece of pvc threaded onto the injector to pull them out it works great

 

[vssman]

I'm running 370's with a #4 plate. It was definately smokey until I advanced the timing. It still has a decent haze at idle but will not poor out black soot with normal driving. I can still soot the road like a coal train if I hit it hard when rolling through a stop or just after TC lockup. My turbo seems to keep EGTs in check but I can get hot if I really try. That's without towing anything.

 

[Bighorn1]

Hi Brian



It’s easy to learn how to control the smoke with 370s. Stay out of the pedal when boost is low and you’ll stay smoke free. I never use more than 20% of the pedal in everyday traffic and I’m still in the fast lane even with the trailer.



Ed

 

[bmoeller]

With the 370's, you can control the smoke pretty well. BUT, you will get smoke at 4(o/d) lock-up, with a tight convertor. Even if you are light on the throttle. If you really get on the go pedal, let the smoke roll, even in first gear.