5,000 RPMS on 3rd gen.

[DerekW]

Hey I have a 3rd generation and I really want to run 5 grand so I could hold second gear and make a really good pass down the track with the sled. I know a guy who wins everytime in the CATPA with his 12V he does 5 grand and my formulas to sled pulling are indicating thats one of the things thats helping him. I want to run 5 grand or close to it so I can stay in same gear all the way down the track. I need to run 2nd gear the whole way down cuz second gear gives me the right speeds off the line and at cruise with the sled. Can anyone help me run 5 grand or tell me how I can modify my truck to run it. What ever modification is done to run 5 Grand will be removed for street and installed at the track the long night before along with the rest of my "race only package". I know this will be considered 1 off work but I have gotta get it done or change engines and so much more. would rather just make my 3rd gen run it

 

[zstroken]

What are these formulas you mention?? Are you talking track speed/rpm? What are you figureing wheel speed at? What do you plan on doing to the truck? Why do you think you need second gear the whole time? What is wrong with starting in first and shifting to second? What turbo do you plan to run?

 

[Bodie]

Hey I have a 3rd generation and I really want to run 5 grand so I could hold second gear and make a really good pass down the track with the sled. I know a guy who wins everytime in the CATPA with his 12V he does 5 grand and my formulas to sled pulling are indicating thats one of the things thats helping him. I want to run 5 grand or close to it so I can stay in same gear all the way down the track. I need to run 2nd gear the whole way down cuz second gear gives me the right speeds off the line and at cruise with the sled. Can anyone help me run 5 grand or tell me how I can modify my truck to run it. What ever modification is done to run 5 Grand will be removed for street and installed at the track the long night before along with the rest of my "race only package". I know this will be considered 1 off work but I have gotta get it done or change engines and so much more. would rather just make my 3rd gen run it

WOW..... 5,000rpm... ... I think you need to talk to your buddy and see what he thinks about you running 5grand in a daily driver... ...



To turn that out of a 3rd gen you need to start with pulling the motor and balance and blueprinting everything, then get some custom rods and crank made. You WILL have to p-pump your truck for sure. P-pump coverstions have been done (powerbypool) but have not been dialed in to make a worthwhile power increase. They make just as much power as a CP3 truck on the 3rd gens.



I am not sure you know exacly what all entails for 5000rpm in a common rail. The bottom line is you better have a unlimited budget, and forget about driving it everyday... .....

 

[WUnderwood]

TSterner runs a heck of a lot of RPMs in his Common Rail; he is working on a kit to P pump the Common Rail motors, and is running a P pump on his truck, it is a dark blue 1 ton dually



hope this helps

 

[BSwope]

TSterner runs a heck of a lot of RPMs in his Common Rail; he is working on a kit to P pump the Common Rail motors, and is running a P pump on his truck, it is a dark blue 1 ton dually



hope this helps

I was gonna say if ya want those type of R's u might get ahold of TSterner and P-pump that thing! Have fun!

 

[NDaniels]

Here is a thread on his truck with a few links to video: https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144345&page=1&pp=15 Check it out

 

[jwilliams3]

Derek,

You would be suprised how a good 3rd gen runs with 3100-3500rpm down the track.





Have you pulled yet with your truck? Any video?

 

[supersonic]

The technology is out there. You wont "have" to do anything internally. We run mod engines over 6000 rpm on a stock crank and marine rods, which arent supposed to be as strong as the cracked cap rods your engine allready has. I would suggest running heavier rod bolts and main studs for the extra insurance. You will need a cam that is matched to your intended operating range, roller lifters wouldn't hurt, you will need to go through the rest of your valvetrain as well. Other than that, its just a matter of setting up a custom computer to run everything. Its doable, just not cheap.

 

[JFaulkner]

Its doable, just not cheap.

Those are the key words!

 

[DerekW]

What are these formulas you mention?? Are you talking track speed/rpm? What are you figureing wheel speed at? What do you plan on doing to the truck? Why do you think you need second gear the whole time? What is wrong with starting in first and shifting to second? What turbo do you plan to run?

I am figuring tire speed off the line, and tire speed vs travel speed down the track. I will start in second then run it the whole way down the track any gear changes will take away valuable RPMS and cause loss of momentum. I need to make around a 5. 86 second run (full pull 300 feet) if I remember what I wrote on the wall. Then in the pull off need to run 1st gear locked locked converter (simple wiring)

 

[DerekW]

WOW..... 5,000rpm... ... I think you need to talk to your buddy and see what he thinks about you running 5grand in a daily driver... ...



To turn that out of a 3rd gen you need to start with pulling the motor and balance and blueprinting everything, then get some custom rods and crank made. You WILL have to p-pump your truck for sure. P-pump coverstions have been done (powerbypool) but have not been dialed in to make a worthwhile power increase. They make just as much power as a CP3 truck on the 3rd gens.



I am not sure you know exacly what all entails for 5000rpm in a common rail. The bottom line is you better have a unlimited budget, and forget about driving it everyday... .....

I plan on going through a few modifed short blocks. My buddy runs this truck around his hometown but he says he keeps it under 3 grand cuz once he hits 3 grand his redline box takes him all the way to 5 theres no stopping it. I think he is legally insane for running that race box on the street, but he hauls it more than he drives it.



The computer is limiting me from running strong at 3 grand and starts sucking power at around 25 or 2600. I simply want to be able to cruise with the sled at 4500 (on the first pull) and have 500 rpms off worthless restricted power above that.

 

[DerekW]

There is so much more to it that I am not explaining. but regardless I was wondering if there are any electronic modifications I can do to achieve the RPMS such as an aftermarket Computer instead of the factory one or a shop that can do custom work to my stock computer to go 5 grand. Now I know it would live forever so I plan on having a cummins bottom end to handle it but also plan to eat a few short blocks. the heads will be raymac with zz fab intake. I honestly want to run dual CP3 with this truck. I just want to remove the rpm limiter to achieve my target. I plan on spending some g's to get there. I just want to know of a company that can get electronics right to run around 5 grand.

 

[jwilliams3]

Please post a video of the 6 second full pull when you get it running!!

 

[zstroken]

I am figuring tire speed off the line, and tire speed vs travel speed down the track. I will start in second then run it the whole way down the track any gear changes will take away valuable RPMS and cause loss of momentum. I need to make around a 5. 86 second run (full pull 300 feet) if I remember what I wrote on the wall. Then in the pull off need to run 1st gear locked locked converter (simple wiring)

Are you talking 4 low?? first gear locked with 3. 73 and 37 inch tires at 4500 rpm is only 19. 93 MPH, no where near fast enough. The automatic shifting is gonna loose very little speed, if you get the right box and charger you should be able to pull 3300 or so pretty easy. What turbo(s) you gonna run?? I really think the 5k is not needed. People shift the autos while pullin all the time. If you ahve enough full and a small enough charger you could probably hit 3rd gear with 33" and a 4. 10 rear end. Typically 30 mph is a good wheel speed to shoot for. We need more info stil.

 

[jwilliams3]

Derek,

Why dont you do some research on who already hooks WELL with an Auto transmission?

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

You will need a cam that is matched to your intended operating range, roller lifters wouldn't hurt, you will need to go through the rest of your valvetrain as well.

Are you saying there are roller lifters for the common rail?? Last I knew roller lifters do not exist and are not possible for the Cummins B series because of the mushroom tappet design.



Besides the injection system the valvetrain is the biggest limiting factor turning 5000 RPM. Gotta upgrade the valve springs, and probably do something about those heavy pushrods. It's easier to take care of the valvetrain on a 12-valve because of the simpler design.



Vaughn

 

[TSterner]

Are you saying there are roller lifters for the common rail?? Last I knew roller lifters do not exist and are not possible for the Cummins B series because of the mushroom tappet design.







ive had them in my common rail block for over two seasons. great design. way better than the rollers for the older blocks.



5000rpm??? why so low?



ted

 

[JasonCzerak]

So what software will allow these motors to turn 5000? Smarty moves things up to 3500. Can it do 5000? Or is this going to have to be for an EFI Live style programmer?

 

[supersonic]

Not using the factory ECM,. Complete stand alone system. Like Ted said, the roller lifters, upgraded push tubes, and better valvetrain have been around for a while. The trick to higher rpm is to put a mechanical pump on it like Ted did or build a stand alone engine management system.

 

[DerekW]

Derek,

You would be suprised how a good 3rd gen runs with 3100-3500rpm down the track.





Have you pulled yet with your truck? Any video?

Hooked up plenty, done plenty video analysis of others, lots of math and planning, lived in mooresville,NC learned alot from race teams. I have a few Ideas that would revolutionize sled pulling today as we know it. one of which is not allow in the street classes in most series, because tech inspectors would understand the purpose along with so many others but once somebody saw some of the ideas run the track they would see that they could put on a more exciting show for the fans. I think sled pulling setups in the street classes are going in the wrong direction personally and I have many ideas That will work some of which I plan to implement this upcoming season. Some of which I have to get my reputable source (sponsor/champion in other racing sports and many other credantials) to see beyond his "old school" ways so that he can help me and his son get a pass down the track to show everyone. what we need is for him to talk to the tech inspectors to get them to allow it to pass tech for one not legal run on the clay.