6.7 won't run, possible turbo issue, need input.

[fireplanner]

2008 6.7 deleted. Basically have had a lot of issues on this truck, bought it new in late 2007. Lately here are the issues. Started bad black smoking, and lost all power, wouldn't drive past 15-30 mph. Code was p0108 MAP sensor. Changed sensor and problems mostly went away, old sensor was fairly sooted and dirty. Truck starts to stumble when highway driving occasionally, and get an immediate dead pedal for 2 seconds then clears up. Take to mechanic buddy because still smoking and Snap on scanner showing too much boost at idle and wont change, power brakes the truck and turbo vane unsticks and starts running normal for 2 weeks. Cousin is a Matco tool man with one of those $8,000 scanners, scanner says bad right battery cable. Sure enough its loose and clamp is cracked, replaced all heavy cables with kit from Genos. Problem goes away again for a day. Driving down road and truck dies coming off the highway, refires just fine just to die again in 30 seconds, refires again and drives back home no issues. Drive for 2 weeks no problems, no CEL. Go to leave last week and dies 9 times in the driveway. Played with it for several days and sounds like fuel issue, changed fuel filter and truck fires right up. Drove for 2 days and dies again and gets towed back home. Doesn't want to start or will start and runs for a quarter second and die, or run as if its "dieseling" with heavy black smoke and will eventually clear and idle but won't build any RPM past 1000 and heavy smoke while doing it. Put the scanner back on it yesterday and nothing really out of the ordinary. Fuel pressure is good, Injectors are firing good. Did flow test on lift pump fine, injector pump good pressure to 10-12000 but can't get engine to rev any more, still No CEL. Checked new MAP sensor, still clean and good parameters. All seems to point to turbo and or actuator. Can a turbo prevent just starting and idling if its stuck open? I don't have any whistle like its stuck closed for exhaust brake. AlsoFYI, engine was replaced at 70,000 miles due to an exploded oil filter, had new injectors done then also. Now truck is at 99,500 miles. I don't want to drop 3k on a turbo and actuator if this isn't it. Any suggestions on problem and a possible turbo supplier?

 

[petersonj]

Doesn't want to start or will start and runs for a quarter second and die, or run as if its "dieseling" with heavy black smoke and will eventually clear and idle but won't build any RPM past 1000 and heavy smoke while doing it

My experience is limited with common rail engines, but this part of your symptoms sounds like it could be an injector leaking fuel into a cylinder continuously - especially the "dieseling" sound with heavy black smoke. An inexpensive way to isolate each injector would be to use a block-off tool that allows you to run the engine while blocking off fuel to one cylinder at a time.

Have you checked engine oil for fuel dilution?

- John

 

[fireplanner]

My experience is limited with common rail engines, but this part of your symptoms sounds like it could be an injector leaking fuel into a cylinder continuously - especially the "dieseling" sound with heavy black smoke. An inexpensive way to isolate each injector would be to use a block-off tool that allows you to run the engine while blocking off fuel to one cylinder at a time.

Have you checked engine oil for fuel dilution?

- John

View attachment 128601

Yes, oil is fine and its not a stuck injector, check that yesterday.

 

[Mikey-KE7LBB]

Not sure how the delete was done, but it could be the butterfly valve in the intake is closing up and starving it of air.

 

[cerberusiam]

Have you checked the air filter to make sure it is clean and not imploded into the TQ tube entry? Turbo should give a CEL and DTC if it is such anywhere in its range. That leaves air and fuel as the source of the problem. Depending on what you used for injectors when they were replaced do not discount a bad injector in they were remans.

 

[fireplanner]

Injectors were new bosch.

Have you checked the air filter to make sure it is clean and imploded into the TQ tube entry? Turbo should give a CEL and DTC if it is such anywhere in its range. That leaves air and fuel as the source of the problem. Depending on what you used for injectors when they were replaced do not discount a bad injector in they were remans.

 

[Ozymandias]

Have you checked the air filter to make sure it is clean and not imploded into the TQ tube entry? Turbo should give a CEL and DTC if it is such anywhere in its range. That leaves air and fuel as the source of the problem. Depending on what you used for injectors when they were replaced do not discount a bad injector in they were remans.

CEL and DTC on a deleted truck?

 

[cerberusiam]

Not deleting the turbo, all those DTC's should be on unless they get turned off by mistake.

 

[fireplanner]

CEL and DTC on a deleted truck?

The delete was done in 2011 and has been fine over the years, No CEL other than the one for the MAP sensor earlier in this process which was cleared after the new MAP. I probably do need to check the butterfly as I dont remember now if it was removed or just unplugged, I believe it was removed as there was a concern it may move on its own over time.

 

[Ozymandias]

If it runs, does the EB work normally?
It really sounds like your vanes are sticking closed. Means turbo builds pressure to early at idle but non if it should spool.
I'd disassemble actuator of the turbo and verify by hand if that stuff moves freely.

 

[fireplanner]

If it runs, does the EB work normally?
It really sounds like your vanes are sticking closed. Means turbo builds pressure to early at idle but non if it should spool.
I'd disassemble actuator of the turbo and verify by hand if that stuff moves freely.

No, I didn't notice any brake at idle with it turned on.

 

[Ozymandias]

With cold engine and EB on it should engage immediately after start up, it is designed as a warm up feature.
If it doesn't - it's broken, from my point of view.

 

[fireplanner]

With cold engine and EB on it should engage immediately after start up, it is designed as a warm up feature.
If it doesn't - it's broken, from my point of view.

That was another reason we are leaning to a turbo/actuator issue. Just can't figure out the excessive smoking at idle and refusal to start. And turbo specs didn't show anything wrong on the scanner.

 

[Ozymandias]

Well you run a delete software right?

They can make all kinds of funny things.

If the vanes are stuck closed then your exhaust is partly blocked that explains the black smoke, not enough oxygen to burn all the fuel.

I remember the old days when one could stomp an the throttle and on the EB at the same time and produce a black wall behind. Good ol' days...
Back then the EB was also the way to shut down a running diesel engine, by plugging the exhaust, it just died then.

 

[cerberusiam]

Well, vanes stuck partially closed is gonna spool more air thru the turbo and into the engine. Not gonna cause black smoke if it sticks at or under 10 cm cubed and off EB, I can vouch for that. In EB mode it is NOTICEABLE, have noise under the hood an out the exhaust. Probably would smoke if one tried to drive it at that setting stuck but very NOISY. Still should have codes, mine did when it stuck in the middle and way open. If the air filter is good and no blockage from the EGR valve then look at the CAC and possibly turbo seal pushing oil into it.

 

[Ozymandias]

I'd pull that actuator and check that this thing is free moving. That's not a big deal and costs nothing.

 

[cerberusiam]

Unless you get it out phase when it is put back together. When those get pulled apart the calibration really needs run and passed or it just sits in one spot. Need software capable of doing that. Have to be really careful it gets put back together carefully just like it was or it will code and sit in one spot.

 

[fireplanner]

I think i will go ahead and pull the actuator and do an actuator test as well as moves the vanes manually, how far should i be able to move the block? From what i can seen it only about 1/2" from start to stop.

 

[Jim W]

OK, I have been gone for a week glamping in MI, with limited WIFI and an I-pad which is not the same as my PC.

The back ground on my truck. I have a 2008, 6.7L Cummins with 140,000 miles on the OD and the original turbo, with a Smarty S67 on the truck and gauges. MY EB is on about 95% of the time.

So, a couple of questions first: What delete program are you using on your truck? Was this transferred or kept intact, when the engine was replaced? What is the type of scanner are you using? Have you ran the EB all of the time when operating the engine? Just a side note have you ever changed the CCV filter under the cover on your engine? This shouldn't be the issue, but I was just wondering what maintenance you have done on this truck.

If you are deleted there should be no EGR valve working with the correct programmer! So, that should not be an issue as far as the engine running!

I notice that you stated that you changed the fuel filter when this all started to happen, correct? Have you changed the fuel filter again. Of the first fuel filter what did the filter look like as far as condition? You are using a Fleetguard filter also?

Ozzy, yes a deleted engine will throw codes, I get one once in a while, but no big deal to read and clear after checking out issues.

 

[fireplanner]

OK, I have been gone for a week glamping in MI, with limited WIFI and an I-pad which is not the same as my PC.

The back ground on my truck. I have a 2008, 6.7L Cummins with 140,000 miles on the OD and the original turbo, with a Smarty S67 on the truck and gauges. MY EB is on about 95% of the time.

So, a couple of questions first: What delete program are you using on your truck? Was this transferred or kept intact, when the engine was replaced? What is the type of scanner are you using? Have you ran the EB all of the time when operating the engine? Just a side note have you ever changed the CCV filter under the cover on your engine? This shouldn't be the issue, but I was just wondering what maintenance you have done on this truck.

If you are deleted there should be no EGR valve working with the correct programmer! So, that should not be an issue as far as the engine running!

I notice that you stated that you changed the fuel filter when this all started to happen, correct? Have you changed the fuel filter again. Of the first fuel filter what did the filter look like as far as condition? You are using a Fleetguard filter also?

Ozzy, yes a deleted engine will throw codes, I get one once in a while, but no big deal to read and clear after checking out issues.

Originally I deleted with a Smarty, in later years it was reprogrammed and the Smarty removed when the engine was replaced. The scanner is a Matco maximus 3 or 4 I don't remember if he was using the new one the other day. CCV has been replaced about 15k ago. This didn't start with the fuel filter, but was recently replaced as a last resort. All fleet guard used on all my trucks.