6-speed Lube: Red Line the Answer?

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Is anyone running Red Line Synthetic MTL in their 6-speed? Here is what their website says:



MTL® Manual Transmission Lubricant

a 70W80 GL-4 gear oil (SAE 5W30/10W30 engine oil viscosity) designed for use in manual transmissions and transaxles. Provides excellent protection of gears and synchronizers and its balanced slipperiness provides a perfect coefficient of friction, allowing easier shifting.

http://www.redlineoil.com/products.htm



This looks like a great option for those who don't want to spend $$ for the Texaco lube from the dealer, and who want peace of mind running a genuine gear oil synthetic in their transmission. I am running the Amsoil 5W30 right now but I'm not comfortable with it.



Vaughn

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I'll admit to being lazy - haven't specifically read the section in my owner's manual on the 6 speed transmission in my new truck in regards to recommended oil change intervals or conditions - so how often in moderate/heavy usage are we SUPPOSED to change the oil, and how expensive IS the stuff from the dealer? I notice in the post above, the reference to GL4 spec - and have run into the mention before that trannies spec'd for GL4 should NOT attempt to use GL5 due to chemical incompatabilities with some internal parts - the brass in particular, as I recall...



The 6-speed is DEFINITELY *one place* where *I* would wanna be absolutely certain to use the right, and BEST available stuff!

 

[dmann]

Which Amsoil 5w-30 are you using? You shoul use the Heavy Duty Diesel oilin your 6 speed.

 

[n7gxz]

Vaughn,



I switch to Redline MTL last fall and the transmission is running as good or better then with the OEM lub. I set an email to Redline with the Texaco number and they said that the MTL is equal to or better then the Texaco. I can try and find the email if you would like?



Kevin

 

[Posm]

I would give Standard Transmission in DFW a call and get their recomendation. They rebuild the the 5 and the 6 speeds and they are a great resource for information.

I know they say ONLY use the Syntorq in the 5 speed, but it is a different beast all together.

 

[Mad Max]

Howdy Vaughn!

Good to see ya again Vaughn.



If you call up Redline and talk to David, he's one of the big dog engineers there. Done business with him for a while, good guy. I'm running MTX in my box right now, bought a 5 gal bucket, when it's gone I may try MTL.



My passed experience with MTL is this, it flows well could, worked great in my BorgWarner T45 and my camaro's T56. In the camaro, which I autocrossed/raced the fluid was pretty warn out by the end of the season, so I changed it annually, which seems excessive for a pricey fluid, but while in service it performed great and the fuild changes were a lot cheaper than new synchros!



Redline's MTL, Torco's MTL and Swepco has a good manual transmission lube too in the same viscocity range, but other than Redline, I'm not sure any TDR member have tried the other.



MaX



http://www.redlineoil.com/contact.htm (jus plain popular)



http://www.torcoracingoils.com/products/product_detail.asp?intProductsGroupIDPK=95 (heard this is a popular gear oil in open wheel type cars)



http://www.swepcousa.com/lubesite/lubeprod.htm



(porsche boys like this one, they feel it is less prone to leaking out compared to Redlines MTL)

 

[Roger rodbolt]

Vaughan,

I havn't used Redline but I did use Mobil 1 5w30 after I did my 6speed conversion. I used a broken case NV5600 out of a 2002 wreck and when I got it apart it was full of brass from a totally wornout reverse syncho cone. I cleaned everything up the best I could but after buying the Mopar lube decided to run the Mobil 1 to flush it out. The trans worked well with the Mobil 1 so I ran it for a 1000 miles, by that time reverse syncho was out again so I installed the Mopar fluid and a Geno's filter. The Mopar fluid seemed to shift a bit better but what really helped was a few runs at Muncie Dragstrip ... ... ..... I just found a 5quart container of Mobil 1 5w-30 on clearance at Walmart for $16. 00 and may use it for the next change. Larry

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Goin' for Redline

Hey thanks you guys for your suggestions/input. I'll spring for the RedLine and see how that goes. Found it in Spokane for $7 a quart, the best price I've seen so far.



Just for the heck of it I'm going to run a sample of the Amsoil HDD 5W30 when I drain it and see if the viscosity dropped very much. Someone posted a while back they did a sample and it dropped from around 10 to around 6 in about 20K as I recall (not good).



Thanks again,

Vaughn

 

[Roger rodbolt]

Re: Goin' for Redline

Originally posted by Vaughn MacKenzie



Just for the heck of it I'm going to run a sample of the Amsoil HDD 5W30 when I drain it and see if the viscosity dropped very much. Someone posted a while back they did a sample and it dropped from around 10 to around 6 in about 20K as I recall (not good).



Thanks again,

Vaughn



Vaughn,

It will be interesting to see how the Amsoil motor oil held up. Thanks in advance for sharing the info. Larry

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

TTT

This subject came up again in the 24v forum. . .

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"6-speed Lube: Red Line the Answer?"



Problem is, I'm not really sure what the QUESTION is...



IF the redline stuff is suggested due to better price, what IS the price difference between it, and the stuff that is clearly specified by Dodge and New Venture - and if there WAS a known better lube, *I* would sorta think THAT would be what they would spc for their trannies...



But, if the Redline - or any OTHER synthetic - is thought to be better due to actual performance and extended life for the transmission, how - scientifically - do we arrive at that conclusion?



Under normal usage and decent maintenance, a transmission like the NV 6-speed will outlast even the Cummins in front of it... How much "improvement" do we really NEED over that?



Sometimes, we get so carried away in attempting to obtain the last tiny droplet of advantage or benefit in a product, that we seek a solution where there REALLY isn't a clearly defined "problem"...



Could THIS be one of them?

 

[Rob Thomas]

Just to stir more *****, which I never have so I'm due, I switched to Amsoil in my 6-speed, 'cause some were sayin' it made it shift nicer. Well, I didn't think so, not worse, just not any better, I'll try somethin' else now.



Later, Rob

 

[rjones]

Rob Thomas



Hey Rob CONGRATSOo. On the trophy in Muncey, Just found out..... Rick

 

[Rob Thomas]

Thank You, Rick





Later, Rob

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Gary, like one of those "problems that don't exist" theories?



I said "answer" because many complain about the cost of the stuff from the dealer, and I don't think it is synthetic. So it's the "answer" to lower prices and possibly (not known for a fact) better than the MTX stuff from the dealer due to it being synthetic (does not automatically mean it is better).



Rob I have the Amsoil in still but while shifting was a little better when I put it in, now about 10-15k later it shifts noticeably worse.



Vaughn

 

[Rob Thomas]

Vaughn,



I've only have about 10K on the Amsoil in my trans, did you get the lab results back yet? Just curious what you have found, you can PM me, if you don't wanna ruffel any feathers.



Later, Rob

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Haven't gotten to it yet Rob, haven't been able to get a hold of any RedLine lube yet. . . plans fell through. Closest avail. place is 150 miles away & it is a retailer who doesn't ship



Will keep ya posted. . .

Vaughn

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

OK Vaughn - if the "problem" or "question" is related to PRICE, what IS the difference in price between a quart of the Texaco stuff and whatever Red Line suggests as replacement?



By the way, I'm familiar with Red Line - have used their stuff, and it's manufactured over in Benicia, just a few miles from me...

 

[Riflesmith]

Here is my oil analysis report on Amsoil 5W-30 Heavy Duty Diesel Oil after 22,000 miles in my six-speed:



Date Sampled-----------01/14/2002

Miles on truck------------56,000

Miles on oil---------------22,000

Viscosity @ 100 deg. C 7. 7 (11. 4 for new oil)

%oxidation--------------14. 4

%nitration--------------- 5. 7

Iron-----------------------104

Chromium---------------- 2

Lead---------------------- 37

Copper--------------------46

Tin------------------------- 0

Aluminum----------------- 20

Nickel---------------------- 1

Silver----------------------- 0

Manganese--------------- 6

Boron---------------------- 23

Silicon----------------------42

Sodium---------------------19

Magnesium----------------39

Calcium----------------- 4312

Barium--------------------- 0

Phosphorus------------1281

Zinc----------------------1382



The lab stated "No corrective action required. Oil is suitable for continued use. " The spec sheet for Texaco MTX shows an out-of bottle viscosity of 9. 08 centistokes at 100 deg. C. This places it in the 20 wt. range. The 7. 7 reading on the Amsoil analyzed places it in the 20 wt. range. This is the same range as the Texaco fluid.



Also consider that the Texaco lube will shear down in viscosity during use, just as any oil exposed to meshing gears will. The Amsoil stays within range to properly protect these transmissions.



Redline MTL is or was being used by TDR Member Diesel Freak. PM him and he might provide details on how it is working for him.

After examining the spec sheet for MTL, it looks like it would work well. Oo.

 

[jlccc]

Originally posted by Riflesmith

Here is my oil analysis report on Amsoil 5W-30 Heavy Duty Diesel Oil after 22,000 miles in my six-speed:



Copper--------------------46

Zinc----------------------1382



Copper + Zinc = Brass = material that the synchros are made of.

Are these numbers indicative of synchro wear?