2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission 94-01 steering wander guys!!! look here...

[THUREN]

94-01 steering wander guys.....

With all the post's lately talking about horrible dodge steering, I thought I'd really get you guys to focus on the caster issue, and try to get everone to understand it better. Caster's importance get's mentioned very often, but usually in the middle of a thread, and does not get noticed being how important it is... If you've tried everything, your allignment is in spec by the "so called" book, or your truck just drives all over the road, this is where you REALLY need to focus... .



Caster is a strange thing and it's main purpose is drivability. It is also the sole reason your steering returns to 100% center after turning a corner, so if your truck does not return all the way to center, there is your first clue something is wrong. Caster requirements can also be different for different trucks so if your allignment guy says you are in spec but your truck wanders all over the freeway, don't listen to him and don't pay him anymore cash, fix this yourself...



What you will essentially be doing is rotating your axle a small amount so that the weight of your truck makes the steering center itself. To do this on a Dodge you will be LENGTHENING your LOWER control arms buy rotating the cams in the axle. Mark the cams first so you can go back to where you started and for future reference. Go just a little at a time and feel whats best without going to extreme and back pedal a bit if there seems to be no progress in feel. You will be AMAZED with the new truck you have...



This is NOT a cure for worn parts and out of ballance tire's but it's my personal opinion that Dodge's factory caster "spec" is way off... .



Hope this helps some of you!!!



Don Thuren...

 

[muchsnow]

With all the post's lately talking about horrible dodge steering, I thought I'd really get you guys to focus on the caster issue, and try to get everone to understand it better. Caster's importance get's mentioned very often, but usually in the middle of a thread, and does not get noticed being how important it is... If you've tried everything, your allignment is in spec by the "so called" book, or your truck just drives all over the road, this is where you REALLY need to focus... .

Caster is a strange thing and it's main purpose is drivability. It is also the sole reason your steering returns to 100% center after turning a corner, so if your truck does not return all the way to center, there is your first clue something is wrong. Caster requirements can also be different for different trucks so if your allignment guy says you are in spec but your truck wanders all over the freeway, don't listen to him and don't pay him anymore cash, fix this yourself...

What you will essentially be doing is rotating your axle a small amount so that the weight of your truck makes the steering center itself. To do this on a Dodge you will be LENGTHENING your LOWER control arms buy rotating the cams in the axle. Mark the cams first so you can go back to where you started and for future reference. Go just a little at a time and feel whats best without going to extreme and back pedal a bit if there seems to be no progress in feel. You will be AMAZED with the new truck you have...

This is NOT a cure for worn parts and out of ballance tire's but it's my personal opinion that Dodge's factory caster "spec" is way off... .

Hope this helps some of you!!!

Don Thuren...

Also... ... .


https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114584&page=1&pp=10

 

[THUREN]

Also... ... .





https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114584&page=1&pp=10

Good call...



My main concern though is not with how tight your steering is, but more the fact that no matter how tight, a lot of dodge trucks are ALL OVER the road. When you let go of the steering wheel the truck should stay going strait as long as the steering parts are in reasonable shape...



Here's some food for thought... . For the most part, a solid axle, is a solid axle. Most Dana produced axles have the same measurements so it's reasonable to compare caster specs between truck brands. If an old solid axle Chevy, a newer superduty, and a leaf sprung Dodge all track strait, what the heck is up with the coil sprung dodge's???? I think I found some good stuff... .



Here are some ranges for different trucks... .



1978 Chevy 1ton 4x4= 8* caster +/-1*

2002 Ford super duty 4x4= 3. 5* +/- 3*

1998 dodge 2500 4x4 = 3. 1* +/- . 25*

1992 ford F250 4x4 = 4. 25* +/- 2*



If the high number for a solid axle rig is near 8 degrees I don't see how the factory dodge spec is near 3 degrees??? It would be interesting to throw a true 5-6 degrees in and see how it drives...





Don

 

[JPittinger]

Here's an issue I haven't found an answer to: I tried increasing the caster when a small case of DW left finger dents in the steering wheel. It seemed like the the coil spring pocket put a bind in the coil spring, causing it to arc with the center of the spring towards the rear of the truck. This made the DW worse. I backed off the caster and set it where the springs were not bound up and haven't had issues since. I don't even know what * they are, but the center of the cambolt is towards the rear of the truck. Could it be that the coil spring alignment has more to do with it???



It wouldn't surprise me if the factory error was more than the +/-. 25* since I just found out my rear spring shackles are more than 2" off from where they're supposed to be (at the frame!) causing me some leaf spring issues.



Opinions welcome,

JJ

 

[muchsnow]

caster

Good call... #ad


My main concern though is not with how tight your steering is, but more the fact that no matter how tight, a lot of dodge trucks are ALL OVER the road. When you let go of the steering wheel the truck should stay going strait as long as the steering parts are in reasonable shape...

Here's some food for thought... . For the most part, a solid axle, is a solid axle. Most Dana produced axles have the same measurements so it's reasonable to compare caster specs between truck brands. If an old solid axle Chevy, a newer superduty, and a leaf sprung Dodge all track strait, what the heck is up with the coil sprung dodge's???? I think I found some good stuff... .

Here are some ranges for different trucks... .

1978 Chevy 1ton 4x4= 8* caster +/-1*
2002 Ford super duty 4x4= 3. 5* +/- 3*
1998 dodge 2500 4x4 = 3. 1* +/- . 25*
1992 ford F250 4x4 = 4. 25* +/- 2*

If the high number for a solid axle rig is near 8 degrees I don't see how the factory dodge spec is near 3 degrees??? It would be interesting to throw a true 5-6 degrees in and see how it drives... #ad



Don

I agree, caster spec for these trucks is not right, but play hell trying to find a alignment shop that will accomodate "trying" something different. The only one within 25 miles of here that could fit my truck on their rack and raise it (nothing special, 2500 qc 4X4 w/8' bed, CTD) charges extra for trucks, and charged me more for having to break into and adjust camber in my wifes CTD IFS 2WD 2500. Getting violated and knowing it sucks, kinda like buying diesel in Florida. They're not doing alignments, they're seeing if they're in specs and pushing them out the door.

How many people have an extra alignment rack laying around that they can use to verify quality of paid service?

Waddayadoo... ... ... ... ?

1. Do a lot of tire rotating.
2. Buy stock in whatever tire company you're currently supporting.
3. Make your own recording of "it's in spec, what can I say".
4... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... .....
5. ... ... ... ... .....

 

[sljohn]

Just curious why the post is titled "94-01 steering wander". What about 2002 models? I just started doing searches on the front alignment stuff since I'm buying larger tires in a few weeks.

 

[muchsnow]

Typo probably, 2nd gen is 94-2002.

 

[FATCAT]

How 'bout some pictures of what were talking about, where the adjustment nut is and where the adjustment nut/bolt is pointing to now (if there is an alignment mark on the nut/bolt).

 

[pwerwagn]

How many people have an extra alignment rack laying around that they can use to verify quality of paid service?

I dont exactly, but Kinda. the hobby shop here on base has an alignment rack. They are SUPPOSED to do it for you, but with some persuading I think maybe they can be talked into a little "experimenting. "

Let me talk it over with someone and see what they think.

--Jeff

 

[LOtero]

im in the same cage as pwerwagn and i have alot of experience with our base hobby shop, they are just like me/us just older :-laf and although it may be against the regs they will more than likely let you tinker on their alignment rack, so it may be the same where you call home if your lucky. worth a shot in my book.

 

[THUREN]

We'll, slap 5 degrees of caster in there and report back... If you mark where the cams are before you start it will be 2 seconds to go right back. Heck, mark where 5 degrees is, split the difference, and you should know where every spot is in between...



I bet it makes a WORLD of difference but really, caster is all about steering feel so if you rotate the caster cams(driver/passenger side) an equal amount, see what feels best, and there is your setting... . without going TOO wild...



Don

 

[THUREN]

How 'bout some pictures of what were talking about, where the adjustment nut is and where the adjustment nut/bolt is pointing to now (if there is an alignment mark on the nut/bolt).

Here ya' go... . this is the cam in question...

 

[Ereynolds72]

I agree with this approach. I've told my story on a couple different threads but in short, my steering felt sloppy and was all over the place. I was ready to start replacing everything under the front end or sell the truck I was so frustrated. I ended up buying the nittos (load range E) and I have adjusted the caster as far positive as the cam allows. I cannot put into words the night and day difference these two items made. Adjusting caster is very easy. You don't have to lift the weight off the front end either. The axle will rotate with the weight on the tires. Be mindful of the changes you do make though. At the same time you are adjusting caster positive (lower ball joint leading upper ball joint) you are also changing your pinion angle. For you '01 and older guys, this isn't an issue but on the '02 and newer trucks, the front driveshaft turns constantly.

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Thuren, Not to steal the thread but I put your track bar on my 01 3500 quad cab last week, and all I can say is it seems great so far. I have the 2 inch over front springs and have no issue with contact. Install was real easy and I've now centered my axle but now the steering wheel is off. Gotta fix that soon. Thanks Don, great product.