? About Inverter Generators

[SWC]

I would like to buy two of those Honda 2000 watt inverter style. Crazy thing is in Canada our CSA will not allow Honda to sell them to be paired. Princess Auto, our version of Harbor Freight has some 2000 watt inverters for sale for half the price of the Honda's. I presume these are Chinese knock offs and I am well aware of the risks involved in these.

My question is what is involved in pairing two of the inverter generators together? Could I rig up something that would let me do this?

Stan

 

[champspa]

yes , I have tried the China junk 2000 watt generator and they are junk mine lasted 3 weeks .

 

[SWC]

Champspa, thanks for relating of your experience with your generator. My question really is can I make something that I can link two inverter style generators together. This is not specific to just those made in China. I know there has been some discussion about making one up for the Honda's which is cheaper then the unit purchased from Honda. I did some searching the archives but only found some references to one of the RV forums for information on how to build one of those cords. The link was to the forum in general not the thread.

Still searching.

Stan

 

[CKelley1]

it would be hard to do if the inverter does not have the electronic interface built into it. you have to lock the 60 hz oscillators in sync. there are some china made inverters made that are good, with parallel capabilities. kipor is one of them. we are testing a single one from boliy that produces about the same output as the two honda's and has the rv plug on it, only had it for four months, no problems but to early to tell

 

[Skydiver]

Crazy thing is in Canada our CSA will not allow Honda to sell them to be paired.

.

Do I understand that you are saying in your area that it is illegal to run 2 gens. together?

 

[Curious Dave]

He is referring to the function of running them in parallel. I would think that if the Honda 2000's are sold with the face of the unit blocked so as to not be able to plug the parallel kit into them, you may be able to find a wiring schematic and build your own harness that you can make as a quick disconnect. If you make the quick disconnect harness then you should be able to hard wire the non-parallel capable generators while leaving an external pigtail with a grommet in the case to allow the harness to go thru to the inside.

Like I said though... you will need a schematic to do all of this.

 

[Curious Dave]

On second thought... . It may be as simple as opening the case and seeing if it is simply a matter of them putting a blank face on the exterior and still having all the needed connections or at least wiring inside. They may have gone so far as to make them specifically for Canada, w/o the wiring... But, I kinda doubt it.

 

[SWC]

The face panel on the Honda's for sale in Canada are different then those for sale in the US.

I am looking at several different options. I prefer to buy up here to support the Canadian economy, but things are usually priced higher here then the US. The fact that it is not available here I have nothing against buying two of the Honda's in the US. We are coming down this summer anyway and I am leaning strongly towards buying them there. As usual the same unit would cost more in Canada then the US. Our dollar is worth less then the US $ right now, and the difference usually is 10 to 20% beyond the dollar difference.

The other thing is how cheap do I want to get. The Boliy CKelly1 referred to is interesting as well. Up here there is a different name on it. I did a bit of checking on the net about that unit and I am not convinced that is what I want. Weight is a big issue to me and that is why I will not go with 3000 watt units from Honda or Yamaha. Onan has a 3000 watt sold through Cummins that is priced right $2100, but again that is something I cannot lift onto the back of the truck.

Thanks for responses and listening to my thinking out loud.

Stan

 

[champspa]

I don't think you can link the sine angles together without the interface

 

[georgej]

Honda recently came out with a 2000 "companion" model that is paired with the standard Honda 2000 genny and has a 30 amp plug in.

 

[SWC]

Champspa, that is what I was wondering if that interface or whatever is required to coordinate the sine waves of the two inverters. I assumed that something is required to put the two units in sync. How complicated is this, what do you hook up to what on the two generators to make this work?

Georgj, I have seen that companion model on the US Honda page but not on the Canadian. When I was at the Honda dealership up here they said nothing about that unit being available in the future.

Stan

 

[SSell]

parallel 2000's

I've got a pair of EU2000's and a (gentran?) parallel kit. Figuring I"m going to sell them because I don't need 'em anymore, but wanted to peek inside the parallel box to see how's it's done (in case I want to build my own down the road). I'm leaning towards saying the electronics on-board the generators take care of any summing or shifting that need done, but will try to get a better answer soon.



for what its worth...

 

[Allnew2Me]

I have a pair of Honda eu2000i and built my own parallel kit, actually two versions. You have to get the shielded banana plugs which can be hard to find locally but I ordered mine online. You have to use the shielded plugs to prevent the danger of electrocution. Don't use a suicide cord with exposed plugs!



The first version of the kits has the 30 amp RV plug which is the only way to get the full 26. 6 amps out of the generators (continous) to one outlet so you can plug in your trailer. The second is just 12GA wire with the banana plugs that link the two together but only allows 20 amp max from the panel outlet which has a 20 amp breaker restricting the output on each generator. You can still get the rated output but not from a single outlet. Using the simple cord allows the full 13. 3 from one and the difference from the second unit. The banana plugs bypass the 20 amp breaker and use the internal electronic regulation built into the generator.



All the kits do is join the hot to hot, neutral to neutral and ground to ground, the inverter electronics do the rest as far as sync goes. Some add a gauge and a breaker to the mix.



With the two generators paralleled before starting, the first one to be started becomes the master because it does not sense any voltage on the other one. When you start the second one it senses voltage present and becomes the slave. The master will always take more of the load, letting the slave make up the difference. You can test this by starting them in different order and then apply a load and watch them surge. If you have them on ECO you will see the difference in RPMs between the two.



The companion is the newest version and allows you to use just the simple banana plug cord and still pull the maximum amps out of the pair through one 30 amp outlet, but it is now built in instead of being added by the parallel kit. You lose one of the outlets on that generator in its place

 

[AABEN]

Why not by a good 4. 000+ will cost less and if you do not need 4. 000+ it will run under lese load last longer.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I have a pair of Honda eu2000i and built my own parallel kit, actually two versions. You have to get the shielded banana plugs which can be hard to find locally but I ordered mine online. You have to use the shielded plugs to prevent the danger of electrocution. Don't use a suicide cord with exposed plugs!



The first version of the kits has the 30 amp RV plug which is the only way to get the full 26. 6 amps out of the generators (continous) to one outlet so you can plug in your trailer. The second is just 12GA wire with the banana plugs that link the two together but only allows 20 amp max from the panel outlet which has a 20 amp breaker restricting the output on each generator. You can still get the rated output but not from a single outlet. Using the simple cord allows the full 13. 3 from one and the difference from the second unit. The banana plugs bypass the 20 amp breaker and use the internal electronic regulation built into the generator.



All the kits do is join the hot to hot, neutral to neutral and ground to ground, the inverter electronics do the rest as far as sync goes. Some add a gauge and a breaker to the mix.



With the two generators paralleled before starting, the first one to be started becomes the master because it does not sense any voltage on the other one. When you start the second one it senses voltage present and becomes the slave. The master will always take more of the load, letting the slave make up the difference. You can test this by starting them in different order and then apply a load and watch them surge. If you have them on ECO you will see the difference in RPMs between the two.



The companion is the newest version and allows you to use just the simple banana plug cord and still pull the maximum amps out of the pair through one 30 amp outlet, but it is now built in instead of being added by the parallel kit. You lose one of the outlets on that generator in its place

Good info - and a big help to us do-it-yourselfers - thanks!

 

[AMink]

Why not by a good 4. 000+ will cost less and if you do not need 4. 000+ it will run under lese load last longer.

Weight is the main issue. It's hard for one person to lift a 4,000 watt gen. The two Hondas together let you pick one up at a time, plus you can store them in tighter spaces. I have an EU2000 and think about getting the second someday, but I wouldn't need it enough to justify the cost. If one fell in my lap, I would though. :-laf

 

[p-Bar]

My dad was going to go that route talked him into an Onan 4k . Best thing going.

 

[JCarlisle]

Honda is now making a 6500 watt inverter generator for about the same cost as the two paired units and it has electric start Bolt it down in the bed of the Truck and Go

 

[Allnew2Me]

On many of the RV forums the debate still lives regarding the better way to go, the Honda eu3000i or two eu2000i generators. The big benefit of the twins is that they only weigh 49 pounds each and can be easily moved around compared to the 3000 which is electric start and weighs in at 134 pounds. And you get more power from a pair.



Yes you can buy a contractor-type generator for a fraction of the price but they are heavy and the bigger issue is that they are really loud. The cheap ones have to run at 3600rpm all the time regardless of load whereas the inverter-type Hondas/Yamaha etc. can be run at whatever speed is needed to match the load, saving your ears and fuel. And they are just quieter to begin with.



Honda just came out with a new 3000 Handy that weighs more like 80 pounds but you can still buy a pair of the eu2000i for less money and have the advantage of using one or both.



If you really want to learn a lot about these great little machines, join this yahoo group and read for hours. Lots of great info on auxilary tanks, propane conversions, the internal workings and maintenance, all is covered in good detail.



Honda_EU2000_Generators : Honda_EU2000_Generators

 

[SWC]

Allnew2Me, if I understand you correctly could you run 3 8 - 10 gauge wires to their the same poles from one inverter to the other and have an RV outlet T'd in the middle? That is very simple. This should be done after the breaker on the hot I presume?

AC wireing I respect very much and want to be very certain of what I am doing before I harm to much like my camper.

Stan