Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) advice on turbo upgrade??

[RDuncan]

i am currently looking to upgrade my turbo---egts are too high and would like more hp thanks ron:-laf

 

[PKemp]

Which Injectors? Stock Exhaust? Timming?

Check the High Tech Turbo web site.

 

[6btsmoker]

i am trying 2

 

[Erniek]

I too am looking to upgrade. I have a 97 5spd, with a #10 plate, boost elbow, stock injectors, timing at 16*, 4" exh, and a K&N air filter in the stock box, and a 13" SB con-o clutch to hold the power. I tow a moderately heavy 28' toy hauler (truck and trailker scale out at 20 to 21k) and I have to constantly keep an eye on the egt guage and need to back out of the throttle quite frequently when passing, or climbing even the slightest grade to keep the temps below 1250/1300*. I know I could back the plate off, or go to a #11 for less fueling, but I don't want to. I put the #10 in because I want, and enjoy the power. Does anyone else tow with the same or similar configuration, and have any suggestions on what turbo to get that would lower my egt's, while allowing me to use all the power available?? I have been to several websites and "looked" at many turbos, almost all of them claim to lower egt's. I am looking for some "real world" info on what works, and what doesn't. Also, is it worth installing the water/meth inj. system to help cool things? Anyone got any other ideas?? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Erik

 

[CogginsP]

I too am looking to upgrade. I have a 97 5spd, with a #10 plate, boost elbow, stock injectors, timing at 16*, 4" exh, and a K&N air filter in the stock box, and a 13" SB con-o clutch to hold the power. I tow a moderately heavy 28' toy hauler (truck and trailker scale out at 20 to 21k) and I have to constantly keep an eye on the egt guage and need to back out of the throttle quite frequently when passing, or climbing even the slightest grade to keep the temps below 1250/1300*. I know I could back the plate off, or go to a #11 for less fueling, but I don't want to. I put the #10 in because I want, and enjoy the power. Does anyone else tow with the same or similar configuration, and have any suggestions on what turbo to get that would lower my egt's, while allowing me to use all the power available?? I have been to several websites and "looked" at many turbos, almost all of them claim to lower egt's. I am looking for some "real world" info on what works, and what doesn't. Also, is it worth installing the water/meth inj. system to help cool things? Anyone got any other ideas?? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Erik

Erik -



I have a setup similar to yours, except my timing is at 18 degrees. It is true, almost all aftermarket turbos over stock will lower your EGTs because you will be flowing more air. Only thing is that since you will be flowing more boost, you will need to make some upgrades to your engine head. O-ring and head studs will do the trick. Same with water/meth injection, it will definetely lower EGTs but you need to watch the HG. The stock HG is only good until 35 PSI.

 

[Erniek]

Erik -



I have a setup similar to yours, except my timing is at 18 degrees. It is true, almost all aftermarket turbos over stock will lower your EGTs because you will be flowing more air. Only thing is that since you will be flowing more boost, you will need to make some upgrades to your engine head. O-ring and head studs will do the trick. Same with water/meth injection, it will definetely lower EGTs but you need to watch the HG. The stock HG is only good until 35 PSI.

Coggins,

Are you running a stock turbo, or aftermarket?? I was hoping not to have to "O-Ring" and stud the head. Can I lower my egt's without exceeding 35 psi of boost?

Thanks for the info.

Erik

 

[pwerwagn]

for starters, boost is not what cools your EGT down, oxygen density does. You dont have to run 50psi to lower EGT's, and in fact, most turbos are pointless to run that high because they are very efficient there.



for your setup, Id say a hybrid upgrade would do the trick. around a 60mm compressor wheel. I currently run the city diesel hybrid, with a 14cm housing, and I can tow pretty big hills with teh 0 plate and huge injectors. and I tow moderatley heavy, my 5th wheel/boat combo weighs right at 21,000lbs (with the truck) and with the jeep, closer to 22,500.



Another good option is the S300g (or HTBG) if your stock turbo is worn out.

either way, give HTT a call, or city diesel if you want the hybrid.

you dont need head studs or orings to handle high boost. I run well over 40 psi regularly (in-efficient for my turbo. . I know) and I have 200+K miles, an stock head gasket (not reccomeded. . just saying).



--Jeff

 

[Erniek]

Jeff,

Thanks for the info. I'll be calling those two places and discuss my options with them.



Anyone else with the similar setup have suggestions?? Also, not to say that cost is no object, but I don't mind spending the $$ if what I buy actually works well. (Though I would like to keep it to a single turbo set up)



Erik

 

[pwerwagn]

Erik,

with just a plate in a 215 pump you dont want to go to big on turbo selection. 12V's like big injectors when it comes to spooling bigger than stock turbos.

Twins are also not necessary with just a plate.



If you like the stock spool characteristics, you might try water meth. It should help your egt's some. Ive tried it on a few trucks and some people love it, and so-so results on others.



--Jeff

 

[Forrest]

for starters, boost is not what cools your EGT down, oxygen density does. You dont have to run 50psi to lower EGT's, and in fact, most turbos are pointless to run that high because they are very efficient there.



--Jeff

Remember the post by Don M some time ago on this subject? He was dyno'ing using a repeat setup, but noticed his boost was down. It was down to something like 38psi, I think, instead of >=50. Anyway, he beat his previous numbers!!!! Cool air

 

[pwerwagn]

Exactly. I tried the same thing on the dyno. Made 2 pulls at 44psi, made 540. 5hp the first pull and 540hp the second pull, with both right around 1177 ft-lbs.

I then let the wastegate open sooner, and saw a larger hp/tq average, and 6 more peak hp and 11 more peak tq. 2 pulls in a row, 546/1188.

So 6psi less boost and I gained 6hp and 11 ftlbs..... and more across the board.



--Jeff

 

[Erniek]

Thanks for the info and explanations guys! It is certainly making some sense to me now. Another question. Are there any injectors out there i. e. DDp's that would actually make more power and lower the egt's?? I was reading in one of the last TDR magazines(i think) that they tried some extrude honed DDP's (pulled the stock injectors and put the DDP's in) in one of the newer 24 valve motors and the numbers were higher HP&TQ and lower egt's. It was a 24valve though. Could I expect similar results with my 12 valve??



Thanks, Erik

 

[Forrest Nearing]

application? towing? hot rodding?

 

[Erniek]

I believe it was just on a dyno run. ?. I am looking for improvements when towing.



Thanks to all who have replied, I have found the information very usefull.



Erik

 

[Forrest Nearing]

you have a fairly mild setup. I would keep an eye out for a 35/40 hybrid in the classifieds or something like an s300 based 62/12 or even an s300g (57mm compressor)



without studs, I'd keep the boost under 40psi in the name of head gasket health.



water injection really helps EGT's, but you'll want a pretty big tank if you're using it for towing, and I wouldn't run any methanol with stock gasket/head bolts

 

[Forrest]

I am looking for improvements when towing.



Erik

Oh shoot Erik, that's easy. Here's my history on that one. I had Marine 300 injectors, stock turbo & a #11 plate slid. 1500 degrees @ 32psi here @ 5k' elevation. I put on a 16mm HX40 & temps went WAAAAY down. Couldn't even get that high anymore. I don't recall exactly, but I was way in the safe EGT range.



Loose some spool up, of course. But the turbo was lighting off @ 1700 or so, no problemo with the 5 speed. Then you up the injector size & the low end picks back up.



I've got the PDR40-16 on there now, set up by PDR for twins. Compared to the new stuff out there, this is old school stuff. No doubt there's faster spooling & better cooling available in a single. You shouldn't have a problem finding a "new school" single ... as long as you're not looking for the "holy grail"



I'd like to experiment with a new single that would spool better AND cool better, which I'm sure is available, but is it worth the $ ... don't know, not going there, only to be disappointed & spend lots of $, when my fueling might be too high for that spec of single.



If I was going to put $ into spinny things for towing, it'd be looking @ pairing up something to the PDR40, like a K31 as a primary & following the lead of the guys that have bazillion hours into twins, like RonA, that have focused on spool up with OUTSTANDING results.

 

[Erniek]

Thanks a million guy's for all the information. This really helps get me pointed in the right direction!!



Erik