Aisen and 68rfe trans

[Big P]

Does anybody know why DC would develope two 6 speed autos for the 6. 7? The Aisen is already used with the cab/chassis, why not with the pickup?

 

[DPKetchum]

I did a search on Aisin autos. Looks like its been used with the 5. 9 for a while in Freightliners.

 

[Yo Hoot]

I would venture to guess... . cost.



transmission probably costs more to procure and the cost of bringing all of the dealerships and technicians up to the task isn't cheap either.



Not to mention satisfying the local workforce.

 

[Big P]

I would venture to guess... . cost.



transmission probably costs more to procure and the cost of bringing all of the dealerships and technicians up to the task isn't cheap either.



Not to mention satisfying the local workforce.

Cost... ..... That's what I getting at. If you source an auto from Aisen, why spend the time and money to develope a DC version? Maybe that's why I'm not a business man. :-laf

 

[EB]

One thing, the Aisen is PTO capable, the 68rfe isn't. The Aisen is going into the cab and chassis model only, a work truck. Also, it is geared lower, again for a work truck.

 

[tkerrigan]

The aisen may not be suitable for 4WD. Too long?

 

[Yo Hoot]

The aisen may not be suitable for 4WD. Too long?

GM's Allison 1000/2000 series is also PTO capable and is used in many work truck applications including chassis cabs, buses and med duties as well as the regular HD pickup.



If the 68RE proves reliable, the extra gears are a great improvement.

 

[KCJackson]

Cost... ..... That's what I getting at. If you source an auto from Aisen, why spend the time and money to develope a DC version? Maybe that's why I'm not a business man.

Actually, it's the other way around. DC knew they had to replace the 48RE with a 6-speed, but it was cheaper to make a non-PTO trans and just buy the already existing Aisin for the extremely-low production chassis-cab. The option price for the Aisin is $2295; the 68RFE will be a lot closer to the 48RE price of $1095.

The aisen may not be suitable for 4WD. Too long?

The Aisin is used in 4x4 chassis-cabs.

 

[KBennett]

Actually, it's the other way around. DC knew they had to replace the 48RE with a 6-speed, but it was cheaper to make a non-PTO trans and just buy the already existing Aisin for the extremely-low production chassis-cab. The option price for the Aisin is $2295; the 68RFE will be a lot closer to the 48RE price of $1095.

Good point. I was also thinking that Aisin may not be able to build enough transmissions to keep up with the demand of supplying all of DC trucks.

 

[Coolslice]

I 'm betting the 68rfe will just be a 48re with 2 more gears basically. I seriously doubt it will be any better than the 48re in terms of reliability, especially with a more powerful engine in front of it. I have a 48 re now and there's no way I'd get another, especially if I pulled heavy. DC could have spent a tad more on the 48re and REALLY beefed it up. I don't know why anyone would expect them to do it with the 68rfe. Just good enough is good enough for DC. Hell, they still use crappy ball joints and u-joints. DC looses lots of sales because of their bad transmission reputation. They could have really done well with the Aisin in the p/up IMO.

 

[cerberusiam]

QUOTE=Coolslice]I 'm betting the 68rfe will just be a 48re with 2 more gears basically. I seriously doubt it will be any better than the 48re in terms of reliability. [/QUOTE]



Thats one bet you would probably loose. :-laf From the descriptions, its based on the 545RFE with a little Mercedes medium duty influence. As for basing it on the 48RE, that would be a big plus as it is the top of the heap as far as reliability and failures are concerned. Basing the design on a proven transmission with 30 years of success kinda makes sense.



Wasn't too long ago the G56 was being portrayed as a huge mistake. That hasn't proven out. We have been crying for a heavy duty auto for years and now we have 2 choices. Yes, they will have to prove themselves so lets just hope they are not the fiascos the Ally and TQ Shift were.

 

[KCJackson]

Wasn't too long ago the G56 was being portrayed as a huge mistake. That hasn't proven out. We have been crying for a heavy duty auto for years and now we have 2 choices. Yes, they will have to prove themselves so lets just hope they are not the fiascos the Ally and TQ Shift were.

This is where Mopar will likely succeed. The Allison 1000 and TorqShift were both clean-sheet designs, while the 68RFE is directly based on the proven 45RFE/545RFE. For those who may be forgetting, the 545RFE is a 6-speed... there are two separate gears for "2", depending on if you're upshifting or downshifting.

 

[EBottema]

Dodge should run the aisin all models. Less to deal with for warranty as aisin makes nice transmissions. Most likely done for cost, hopefully it will bite them in warranty claims. Running a 6 speed auto is a mistake, internals are too small on this size of a truck causing high future rebuild costs.

 

[zstroken]

Running a 6 speed auto is a mistake, internals are too small on this size of a truck causing high future rebuild costs.

How many 6 speeds have you taken apart? How many 5 speeds? Any of them in heavy duty trucks? The 545RFE has a nice planetary set up. This new trans is based off of that. Have you seen the internals of the allison? I don't see two more gears make the parts small. They are making a new case to put it in too.

 

[DPKetchum]

The Aisan trannys I'm familier with are low maintance and almost bullet proof. I bet the thinkings behind D. C. is more commerical use. Going after the medical field truck sales,flat beds wreckers,elect.company vehicles etc. Higher price tag,lower warranty claims in those areas,less complaints etc. Ford has had a big hold on that market but the 6. 0 engine had a lot of unhappy customers in those fields. Some ambulance services posted a lot of sour grapes on the Ford sites.

 

[cerberusiam]

Running a 6 speed auto is a mistake, internals are too small on this size of a truck causing high future rebuild costs.

You are right about that, but, your forgetting the FE designation on the transmissions. Short of Ally 3000, none of the current transmissions will stand up to the Cummins unmanaged. All the newer transmissions are managed by the ECU so they don't eat themselves up, even in the medium duties. In a light duty truck a $10k option plus the size modifications needed is simply not going to sell.

 

[BRayls]

I 'm betting the 68rfe will just be a 48re with 2 more gears basically. I seriously doubt it will be any better than the 48re in terms of reliability, especially with a more powerful engine in front of it. I have a 48 re now and there's no way I'd get another, especially if I pulled heavy. DC could have spent a tad more on the 48re and REALLY beefed it up. I don't know why anyone would expect them to do it with the 68rfe. Just good enough is good enough for DC. Hell, they still use crappy ball joints and u-joints. DC looses lots of sales because of their bad transmission reputation. They could have really done well with the Aisin in the p/up IMO.

read my old posts. the ones eveyone tells me i am wrong there is no 68 it will be an aisin. I have said before and here again the 68 was tested at the 1000 lbft. mark.

 

[jcarey]

1000 lbft... very nice.



We need a drool icon :-laf

 

[mesterline]

read my old posts. the ones eveyone tells me i am wrong there is no 68 it will be an aisin. I have said before and here again the 68 was tested at the 1000 lbft. mark.

Why don't you tell every one what this trans is based from?

DC can't deny the problems they are having behind the 4cyl vm in the liberty

with the torque converter recall & reprogramming of the torque output.

Has any one seen the torque converter on the 68rfe trans cut part &

looked at the "new multi disc" lock up clutch?

Yes, it is multi clutch but the diameter is half of the old one.

I hope the 68rfe will last, but the trans its based off of is not the best!!!

If not I will have alot of transmissions to rebuild or replace!!!

 

[BRayls]

Why don't you tell every one what this trans is based from?

DC can't deny the problems they are having behind the 4cyl vm in the liberty

with the torque converter recall & reprogramming of the torque output.

Has any one seen the torque converter on the 68rfe trans cut part &

looked at the "new multi disc" lock up clutch?

Yes, it is multi clutch but the diameter is half of the old one.

I hope the 68rfe will last, but the trans its based off of is not the best!!!

If not I will have alot of transmissions to rebuild or replace!!!

I think if you zstroken's (Dan) post he did just that. I have not seen the unit I am relying on a buddy in the ITP 1 plant thats in engineering. I work down the road where the old dino was built (the original KTP). which is slowing down. I am told a couple weeks worth of service and then done with 46,47,48 trans parts. :{