Another dead lift pump

[DGibbs]

Was driving home from Chattanooga, TN yesterday with the wife, kids, dog and utility trailer. Around Clarksville, TN the truck would lose power on hills then cut-out for a second. Did this on about every hill for a while but seemed to get a little better over time. I eased it as much as possible to the nearest Dodge dealership I could find, which was in Paducah, KY. Dealership called today and said it needs a new lift pump. Funny thing is, I was told that it would be another cannister mounted pump rather than the in-tank setup. Not sure about this as everything I hear is that STAR will replace with the in-tank setup? I'm too upset if he's right as I think I'd rather replace the current setup with an aftermarket pump mounted to the truck frame.



Truck has approximately 43K so it falls within the 7/100 warranty with no deductible. Luckily, we got a rental from the dealership and made it home late last night. At least the truck made it to Paducah and we didn't get stranded roadside.

 

[JasonCzerak]

hmm I get the cut out every now and again. hmm I wonder if mines next.



Did you ever notice any lower then normal boost numbers at WOT prior to your new lift pump?

 

[Diesel Power]

Im pretty sure my lift pump is gone too. The highest boost numbers I have seen on my stock 04 truck is 22 lbs of boost, it averages around 20.

 

[DGibbs]

Never noticed any drop in boost but I can't say I was looking either.

 

[JasonCzerak]

Im pretty sure my lift pump is gone too. The highest boost numbers I have seen on my stock 04 truck is 22 lbs of boost, it averages around 20.

hmm I hate to change the topic here. but it's some what releated as wmoody is saying. . but I think and early sign of a bad lift pump is well, low boost numbers.



I WAS thinking it could be my temp/pressure (map, but DC calls it pressure) sensor. maybe 40psi broke something over time. maybe right? Maybe it could be the edge box. I'll have my edge box sent in when I pull my clutch. This way I can't be tempted durning break in



BUT here's what happens. If It sit and idle for 15+ minutes. out side temp 34 degrees. Then I jump on the road and just smack the throttle I can peg 40psi for 2nd, 3rd, 4th... 5th and 6th typicaly will back down. But yeah, lots of smoke, lots of boost, lots of speed. I _WAS_ thinking MAP cuz the temps were brough up in the intake manafold for a while..... This problem started when it was colder out also.



BUT... . As far as the lift pump. It has time to fill and pressureize the filter canaster, and it's safe to say that for about an 1/8 of a mile at WOT, you can empty that canasiter faster then a broken lift pump can fill it? Hence loss of power?





maybe I'm way off... something to think about?

 

[DGibbs]

Just got a call from the dealer, the tech was suprised to find he has to drop the tank for the retro... . must not have too many come in for a dead LP at that dealer yet. Mixed feelings about the in-tank setup... should have went FASS or similar months ago.



Question with those in similar situation, what fuel pressure readings are you getting after going with the in-tank setup?

 

[MStaggs]

My lift pump died two days ago. The check engine light came on and a few minutes later the truck died. :{

My truck is an 04 Calif 235hp model with only 29,000 miles. I thought the "newer" trucks did not have this issue - guess what?

Luckily it was towed all the way to the dealer and fixed all under the excellent warranty.

 

[STEVEBROOKS]

Was driving home from Chattanooga, TN yesterday with the wife, kids, dog and utility trailer. Around Clarksville, TN the truck would lose power on hills then cut-out for a second. Did this on about every hill for a while but seemed to get a little better over time. I eased it as much as possible to the nearest Dodge dealership I could find, which was in Paducah, KY. Dealership called today and said it needs a new lift pump. Funny thing is, I was told that it would be another cannister mounted pump rather than the in-tank setup. Not sure about this as everything I hear is that STAR will replace with the in-tank setup? I'm too upset if he's right as I think I'd rather replace the current setup with an aftermarket pump mounted to the truck frame.



Truck has approximately 43K so it falls within the 7/100 warranty with no deductible. Luckily, we got a rental from the dealership and made it home late last night. At least the truck made it to Paducah and we didn't get stranded roadside.

DGibbs,

Recently, I've noticed a condition on my truck that I'm sure wasn't there before. Now, when I turn the ignition key to "on", the LP runs for approx 45 seconds before cutting off. Before, if I did the same thing, it would run for just approx 5 seconds. Today, I took it to the dealer and they ran a "flow test" on the LP and, initially, they said it was good and they were not going to do anything more to it. After prodding them some more on it, they decided to replace it with the new in-tank LP. My new LP's on order now. Did you see similar indications with your LP before the big problem?



Thanks,

Steve

 

[DGibbs]

SJBrooks - I didn't notice the LP running any longer before it was replaced. My situation is similar to yours as I was not stranded on the road because of a dead pump. But once the tech did a flow test and determined it was flowing at 50% of the spec, he decided to replace it. BTW - The new pump did not fix my problem. But, I did make it back home tonight. I'll have to determine next steps. Truck threw another p0251 on the way home.

 

[99Supercab]

Im pretty sure my lift pump is gone too. The highest boost numbers I have seen on my stock 04 truck is 22 lbs of boost, it averages around 20.

That isn`t a low boost for the 03-04`s. 22 lbs. is about all they make stock.

 

[jnelson]

I was going on my 3rd lift pump but went with the FASS. It s not a matter of "if" but "when".

 

[STEVEBROOKS]

DGibbs,

Recently, I've noticed a condition on my truck that I'm sure wasn't there before. Now, when I turn the ignition key to "on", the LP runs for approx 45 seconds before cutting off. Before, if I did the same thing, it would run for just approx 5 seconds. Today, I took it to the dealer and they ran a "flow test" on the LP and, initially, they said it was good and they were not going to do anything more to it. After prodding them some more on it, they decided to replace it with the new in-tank LP. My new LP's on order now. Did you see similar indications with your LP before the big problem?



Thanks,

Steve

The odd part to me is that, assuming the dealer tech did it correctly, my LP passed the flow test. I've even towed my 5er since I've noticed this problem, and the truck exhibited no loss of power or bad mileage, and I've never thrown a code (that I know of). Unfortunately, the dealer said my new LP won't be in "for a while", yet I've got to take a 2400 mile round trip towing excursion next week. Does anybody believe I've got a serious problem going on? Has anybody else seen similar circumstances?



Thanks,

Steve

 

[Turbo1Ton]

My lift pump runs for like 30-45 seconds before cutting off. I didn't know if this was normal or not. I bought the truck with 74000 miles on the clock and it now has almost 78000 on it and it has done it since I bought it. Might be time to consider an upgrade?



Anyone else ever notice this condition?

 

[MStaggs]

Does the dealer in-tank retrofit replacement solve the issue once and for all?

If so, why has'nt Dodge made them this way from the factory seeing as this problem has been present for a few years now?

 

[KKlepfer]

Cummins has installed the new in tank pump on all 05's and I'm assuming 06's. So they are coming from the factory with the new style pump. As far as solving the issue once and for all; NO. All fuel pumps eventually go out. The intake pump may last longer than the canister mounted stock pump which to me means I'll be paying for a failure out of warranty. That is why I decided to install an aftermarket pump that mounts on my frame rail. It's easier to replace than an in tank pump. There are two systems that seem to get the thumbs up on this sight and they are Diesel Dynamics pusher pump and the FASS system.

 

[Camp]

Now you guys have me thinking. I have a slight stumble as I roll into the throttle that is not very repeatable and I haven't noticed any problems at WOT. It seems to happen around 1800rpm or so and it confuses the heck out of me. This thread got me thinking and from the way some of you have described the symptoms, it sounds like what my truck feels like.



I never had this slight stumble before but, I recently returned from being out of the country for about 2 1/2 months and it is there. Nobody drives my truck while I am gone so, it is weird that it would develop when the truck isn't being used. At any case, I am scheduled to be at the dealer on Monday morning for a flow test of the LP. We shall see what this turns out to be. By the way, this stumble seems to occur at all levels on the juice, or at least from 2-5

 

[ACerf]

My lift pump runs for like 30-45 seconds before cutting off. I didn't know if this was normal or not. I bought the truck with 74000 miles on the clock and it now has almost 78000 on it and it has done it since I bought it. Might be time to consider an upgrade?



Anyone else ever notice this condition?

Okay, maybe I am slow. But how do you know that the Lift Pump is running longer? I don't hear anything be the engine banging away!

I did take the truck in to the dealer for a ticking/rattle sound that it makes when it is cold. As so as the temp hit 190 the noise stopped. Dealer said everything was normal!

 

[STEVEBROOKS]

Okay, maybe I am slow. But how do you know that the Lift Pump is running longer? I don't hear anything be the engine banging away!

I did take the truck in to the dealer for a ticking/rattle sound that it makes when it is cold. As so as the temp hit 190 the noise stopped. Dealer said everything was normal!

When I used to turn my key to the "on" position, but not crank the engine, the lift pump would run for approx 5 seconds. When it was doing that, I assume it was priming the filter housing and the rest of the fuel system. At some point in the past, it started taking longer than 5 seconds and now, when I do the same thing, it runs for approx 45 seconds. Again, the truck (which has no "box" on it) doesn't display any problems, so I'm not sure what the impact of this change really is.



Steve

 

[MStaggs]

SO this supposed "fix" is the in-tank pusher pump.

Now I dont think that you could install a FASS becuse you would be sucking fuel through the in-tank pump and that would be restrictive. Am I correct here?

 

[DGibbs]

MStaggs - You can still get a FASS for the in-tank setup, it's just more of a pain in the rear since you have to drop the tank.