Another Getrag noise thread.....

[Levi1a]

Got the getrag 360 out on the ground due to nasty noise in 4th gear only. I pulled the shifter cover and fully expected to see something obvious. Honestly I really don't know what I am looking for. I had just serviced it when I got the truck 5 quart fill. When I drained the fluid there was a ton of syncro material in the fluid, but not really much bearing or gear material. Input and output "feel" tight. From what I understand that 4th gear noise is the cluster bearings, but my concern is since nothing is visibly wrong that the noise may be coming from somewhere else. I did pull the rear carrier and discovered that the ring gear side bearing had spun so got that taken care of. I pulled the rear shaft and drove it down the road in 4x4 high and I still have the same noise... ... ... ... so I feel confident that it is in the transmission. Any possibility it is in the NP205? Anything else I should look at, or should I just drop it off to be rebuilt? I have a reliable old guy that is going to do it.

 

[Simplysmn]

I would have it rebuilt it will be 1 less thing to worry over .

 

[HHhuntitall]

If it's only doing it in one gear, it's not the T-case. Probably one of the smaller roller bearings inside the gear packs... ...

 

[Levi1a]

Yeah the trans is at the rebuilder. I found the noise though. I pulled the transmission and didn't bother to pull the pressure plate till later on in the evening after I had already hauled the transmission to the shop. I figured it was time for a new clutch cause it always sounded rough when it was released, but the truck had a brand new luk pressure plate and clutch. I had already planned on replacing with the new OE SACHS stuff I bought cause the clutch always sounded crappy so I assumed it was time, but anyway I pulled the pressure plate and thought why the hell are my flywheel bolts so chewed????? Looked down at the clutch disc and the springs were almost cut in half. Yup somebody managed to put the clutch disc in backwards and the hub didn't clear the flywheel bolts. I think what was happening is after I turned the truck up and changed the exhaust housing on the turbo I was able to drive through the clutch and what I was hearing was the clutch hub springs smacking the flywheel bolts and the clutch began to slip. :-laf Needless to say the flywheel had some of the strangest chatter marks you have ever seen :--)
So the flywheel is now resurfaced and by the end of the week everything behind the flywheel should be as good as new.

Link to said clutch pic.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=567820993277364&l=86ca7a9570

 

[GCroyle]

Levi1a,



I don't think you told us when the noise is made and can you control it. The noise made by a disc in backwards and contacting the F/W bolts would be worst with engine running, clutch released (pedal down) in gear and truck stationary. And this scenario would also make it difficult to cleanly select 1st or REV from a stop as the disc is still being driven. The noise would be the least while rolling along, disc, cover and F/W all locked as one, but this still might make noise as the damper springs could be restricted from contacting the F/W bolts.



The original Sachs 13" cast iron unit also requires the OE location lip on the outer edge of the F/W. It locates the cover for the balance reference. This lip is ground off for use with stamped steel covers. F/W bolt heads, condition, time to replace due to damage?



I saw the pic, bet it says flywheel side on the other side?



So, one question that concerns the trans, what was the noise while driving? Normal, noise reduced? The damper is still "active" and MIGHT have been heard as a noise as the springs buzz back and forth on the bolts.



Gary

 

[HHhuntitall]

:blankstare:... ... ... ... ... Yeeeeeaaaaahhhhh, about that..... I'd be at someone's door fist thing... . errr, I mean first thing on Monday morning..... Whoever installed that would be in for an epic butt chewing.....

"And in other news today, a local man is in the hospital, after a dissatisfied customer shoved a 13" clutch disc up his rectum. Proctologists went to work right away, removing the disc, and expect the man to make a full recovery, albeit he'll never sit easy again..... Local Sherriff's officers were on scene and were quoted as saying, "Well, I can't blame the guy, you should have seen how he installed this thing. He's lucky we showed up and intervened before the other guy went and got the flywheel... ... ... ""

 

[GCroyle]

HHuntitall,



Ouch, fiberglass splinters in all the wrong places to boot.



I don't have enough room to store all of the objects similarly inserted and later removed and sent back to us, but I'll give you one gem today.



It was some kinda CJ repower to a small block Chevy. The part was a simple flywheel. They installed it and returned as a labor claim stating something to the effect that



THE FLYWHEEL WAS MACHINED ON THE WRONG SIDE



Ever notice when you tighten a bolt against a F/W and then remove the bolt, it leaves a witness mark from the bolt.



Closer examination revealed that the F/W bolt head witness marks were on the crankshaft side and the crank flange witness marks were on the trans side of the defective F/W.



I think we still have this one somewhere. And that they had the gall to send it in and it never even had the clutch installed, insult to injury. I'd like to have heard the "Techs" explanation to the boss.

 

[Levi1a]

Gcroyle you hit the nail on the head. That is why I had bought the clutch stuff before the fourth gear noise arose. Sitting at a traffic light clutch depressed it sounded like the throwout bearing growling. On the trans and yes first and reverse were always tough to manage. As far as the fourth gear noise was concerned it began at about mid RPM all the way through pull up and got louder with increasing RPM. I could control it by simply rolling out of the throttle. As far as the flywheel and bolts are concerned luckily whoever installed the clutch did not have the lip machined off of the flywheel as the luk PP fit down inside it. The flywheel bolt have some wear on them but I believe they are still useable. The only bolts I am going to have to source are the longer bolts that retain the new SACHS pressure plate to the flywheel as shorter bolts were used due to the flange being thinner. Is there a specific bolt I should use, or would proper thread and length grade 8 with a lock washer be enough, or do I need a bolt with a fatter flange on the head?

LMAO @ HHhuntitall's reply!!

 

[GCroyle]

Levi1a,



Clutch cover bolts. 2nd gen and up are 5/16" flange head shoulder bolts into a piloted shoulder hole in the F/W. The 13" Sachs cast iron 1st Gen are tapped all the way to the friction surface I think. The pilot system is the lip.



So you have a true 1st Gen F/W with the lip. I've never had that bolt in my possession, so can't ID it.



Gary

 

[DMcLeod]

Interesting. I have a loud rattling noise in neutral with clutch engaged (pedal up). I replaced the release bearing, but no change. The lever looks good. New pivot ball. Looks like previous owner replaced clutch, it looks like a new luk. I didnt notice any marks on the flywheel bolts when i was in there. The getrag was recently rebuilt as well. Noise still there. I need to do some poking around under there when it's sitting there at idle. If you raise the rpm, the noise dissapears. Has anyone run into this sort of obnoxious rattling noise at idle with clutch engaged?

 

[jdross440]

I have had the same noise with my 92 since I replaced the clutch several years ago. I haven't figured out what it is either. I haven't taken the time to pull the transmission as it's a pain and works good. I don't remember the brand of clutch I put in, just that it had a "lifetime warranty" from OReilly's, I have the receipt put away.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

Remember, in Texas "he needed killin' " is apparently a valid defense, lol.

Talk to South Bend Clutch for a good unit. The Sachs was a good clutch, unless a cast iron hat makes you nervous--cast can grenade. I haven't heard of it happening on the Sachs, however.

Noise in 4th is interesting because the power is going straight through the Getrag trans. The pocket bearing and bearings under the countergear and mainshaft gears should be minimized--thus looking elsewhere as you did makes good sense.

 

[HHhuntitall]

I think one of the biggest noise problems is incorrect bearing preload, or perhaps incorrect fluid. The front bearing is easily not set correctly. Many remanufacturers just replace the bearing and install the same shims, leaving the new one too tight or too loose... ...