Another kid with a gun.

[Switca]

Here we go again. Another kid goes to school with a gun and starts shooting his fellow students. "The worst school shooting since Comumbine. " is what the news guy just said.

On the way into work, Stern was in a long comercial break, so I went to the local alternative radio station. They played a song with lyrics something like:

"Maybe it's the parents. Maybe it's the schools. Maybe it's time we live in. Maybe it's... " and it goes on like that for 3 minutes or so. And the last line goes:

"But if it was up to me, I'd take away the guns. "

The DJ said terrible events in CA forced her to play this song.

No doubt, Rosie with her gun toting body guard will have something to say and the million mom marchers will fall in right behind her.

Maybe it is the parents who cant teach junior right from wrong. Maybe it's junior and something in is head. Maybe it's society... do we blame society for anything anymore? Na, let's just take away the guns.

What do you think? A new exchange program: Guns for Prozak and Ridalin.

 

[mikel]

Between the "Better living through chemistry" group and the "Guns kill, so take the guns" people we'll all be a bunch of drugged-up happy people that have to kill each other with sticks and rocks. Until they take those away too...

I believe that there is a fundamental failure in society right now and it is manifesting itself in our children. Most of us grew up in a time when we may have taken a gun to school to go hunting after class and nobody thought anything about it. More importantly we never had kids showing up at schools for the purpose of killing classmates.

When did we start teaching our kids that if somebody makes fun of them then it was ok to kill that someone? I keep hearing on the news how the Columbine kids were picked on by other kids, then there was the kid not too long ago that got caught before he could duplicate the Columbine idiocy and he was picked on too. Now we have this kid who once again was picked on, deciding that the best answer is to kill somebody. Now I don’t know about anyone else but I remember that getting picked on was pretty much standard operating procedure in school. It’s in kids nature to pick on each other. I don’t believe it’s in their nature to kill one another.

I'm not sure if I think the failure is our overt materialism or our seeming lack of religion or what, but I really hope that we as a society get a handle on it...

Just my random thoughts,
Mike


------------------
'99 QC 2500 SLT Driftwood 2wd SB 24v Auto 3. 55 LSD
ISSPRO boost and pyrometer, Autometer 3 gauge replacement pillar, Walker 24168, DTT VB
'00 Durango SLT 360, 3. 55, Patriot Blue
-- email address removed --
Howdy Agg's!

 

[The patriot]

I heard about this too. 15 kids I heard?
I'm not a psyciatrist, or even highly educated. I DO know that long arms, pistols and ammo were ALWAYS AVAILABLE and un locked in my house when growing up, and things like this seldom, if ever happened.
Maybe it's not having a Dad around? Maybe it's MTV glorifying the "gangsta" image?
Maybe these kids are just *F*ed up, and the parents are so busy working, they dont notice it? Maybe they do notice it, and dont want to take the time off work to have junior looked at? Could it be something like dicipline in school? Or more accurately... the lack of it.
Events like this were almost non existant until recently. Were just now seeing the results of removing the Bible from school. Are they related?? Could be.
I feel for these people. All of the parents involved.
I sure hope none of them show up in a HCI commercial. #ad

Eric

 

[Sled Puller]

I remember the first day of Doe season in Pennsylvania. 75% of the entire school above 12 years of age was absent. ( First day of Buck was a legal holiday)
Everybody was armed and grew up with guns. We didn't have any shootings. Oh yea, the Preachers son shot through the Principals house one night, but didn't hit anybody.

You know, if the teachers carried weapons in full view, would these punks keep doing this?
This is a pattern. Somebody arms themself and goes where there IS NO GUNS ALLOWED, and starts shooting. They KNOW these people can't fight back. Would they do it if they knew everyone had a gun?
No way.
How many shootings happen at places where there is known to be firearms?
Gene

 

[illflem]

I think it's entirely the media's fault for crap like this happening,I think if they didn't advertise it on the news that the kids wouldn't come up with the idea. As it stands now if a kid goes to school and blows away his classmates he becomes an instant celebrity,an easy way to instant fame. And of course the liberal media loves it,it gives more reason to ban the evil guns.

Some of the other posts reminded me of what happened in my small town a couple years ago. Two seniors in the high school,one who I knew,went to the local shooting range before school to site in a deer rifle. After they were finished they put the rifle in it's case in the locked trunk and drove to school. A local cop was also at the range and saw them,one guess what happened to those two boys. Expelled from school in their senior year,though they took GED tests to graduate,but they weren't allowed to participate in the graduation ceremonies with the rest of their class,no jail but 5 years probation. That must have really hurt in a school where the graduating class was only 60 kids. These were good kids,but what happened to them is almost enough to cause them to go postal.

 

[Sled Puller]

Anyone up for a Witch hunt?
If the Witch doesn't drown, then she wasn't a Witch!

 

[Switca]

Yeah, guys. Guns are still around like they were when I was in high school in '75. There are more gun laws on the books now than there were 25 years ago.

Something else changed. It's obvious to us. Why is it so hard for the Rosie's of the world to see it?

 

[illflem]

The problem also has much to do with overpopulation and crowding. In the '50s scientists did experiments overcrowding mice in their cages. As the populations increased so did deviant behavior that didn't exist before with mice. They started killing each other and turned homosexual. Also turned to cannibalism even though there was adequate food. See any parallels here?I'm glad I was born when I was,I almost feel sorry for the kids being born right now seeing what they can expect to live in. Then again I'll bet every generation has said the same thing...

 

[JGK]

I'm probably going to get shredded for this, but IMHO it's due largely to what we see on TV, the movies, and video games. All they see is people being blown away, everyone is shot up, and when its all done the survivors jump in the car and go have a beer! They never see the pain, suffering, grief, and consequences to those that survived. There is no understanding of what it does to a person who has been shot or has done the shooting, physically and/or mentally.

I think if every kid who gets caught up in this shoot-em-up mentality had to care for a serious gun shot victim, right from the beginning, most would never touch a gun.

I was raised, like most of you, with guns available. And I, too, went hunting as a kid. But I never thought of even pointing one at somebody. We never saw the current level of explicit and never-ending gore that you can see on the tube, which I think now numbs kids to the reality of it.

Our only hope is with the parents, that they teach from very eary on what guns are about. I want my son and daughter to feel safe around them when they get older (they are only 4 and 1 years now), and use them responsibly if they decide they want to use them at all. It's just going to be very tough to get by what they see on the screen.

JK

 

[Champane Flight]

I have heard that songatty Larkin I believe. You can bet she has never touched a gun in her life. I do like her music,not her ideals.

If no one can put their finger on one thing causing these shootings,it isn't one thing. It is a combination of many things. Lack of morals,societys glorifing of violence(video games,TV,movies,music,etc),
the mixed messages(don't resort to violence,yet go to war and kill). The list goes on and on. We even have computer games that rack up a score for killing,with all the grafics.

In my day you didn't even think of taking a gun to school and blowing away other kids. If you had a beef with someone you took it behind the school and duked it out. Now the teachers are taught to break these fights up(for fear of law suit). I would think that putting the gloves on two kids,letting them go at it and then nursing a bloody nose would be a better alternative to body bags.

Somehow it has become cool to blow people away. Maybe our school system should take our children to the morgue. Show them how permanant death is!We have had child murderers in the past(Billy the kid and others). The big differance today is we have children killing children and a media that preys on death and blood with a frenzy.

The rules in the schools are not working. I know a young man whos family ranchs. He came to school one day with a 22 in the gun rack of his fathers truck. His had a flat tire. He was kicked out of school and had to change schools to finnish highschool. NO exceptions and NO common sense!

Whos fault is it?Or do we really need one?

------------------
95 Dodge 2500 Luverne grill guard,headache rack,running boards and Amzoiled. Soon to be mildly bombed. 84 Dodge d-150, 318 Hooker headers,Edelbrok intake,mallory ignition,Carter Afb,Accel coil,and Custom dual exhaust. Boat,fifthwheel,motorcycles,and shop. 72000 as of 3/1/01,not even broke in yet. Old Dodge 126000 miles and running better than new.

 

[Brandon]

my 5yr old son hunts with me and, respects guns, I always had guns, I am 29 and raising my son to respect firearms and hunting, same treatment I got as a kid

can we say disfunctional parents??????????????

------------------
END THE OPPRESSION FREE HVAC NOW
Danelle's Dodge

 

[Switca]

The media screams "It's the guns!" The liberals scream "It's the guns!". In a move right out of Stalin's game book, "all" (any gun traceable by a yellow sheet and the BATF) guns are confiscated.

What happens when someone figures out the recipe for a Molotov cocktail and the destructive power of that simple technology?

Will posession of a glass bottle be a felony?

 

[Koa Man]

I grew up on the island of Molokai, real country, still is. I had 7 guns at 16 years old. Two . 22s, 16 and 20 gauge shotguns, 7mm Rem. Mag. , a 30-06, and a 30-30 Win. A majority of the other guys in high school also had one or more guns. I remember riding thru the main town with 3 other 16 year olds with our rifles sticking out of an open top Jeep and the police would not even blink an eye. In fact they would ask if we got anything. The pickup I drove to school everyday always had my 30-06 behind the seat. You CANNOT do this today. You would get arrested. But when I was growing up there 30 years ago, school & workplace shootings were unheard of and even Post Office workers did not kill people.

 

[Amianthus]

Gene, I think that would be analagous to walking in to a Police station and shooting at the cops. Odds are pretty good you won't do that because you'll get dead. Unless you're the Terminator.

Let me tell you a story. My current cert II instructor is an Asst. Chief in his town's fire department. He is also a badge carrying, route driving cop for the same town. He spent most of his life as the principle at the local high school. Took his badge and gun to work with him. Them kids walked the straight and narrow. He didn't harass them, but discipline was a given in that school. The kids never crossed him, and he would do anything for them. But if they got out of control, *click*-*click* on went the cuffs and of to jail they went. Every morning he'd be out there greeting those kids. Every morning they'd add "Sir. " to every reply. He never missed a sporting event, play, or day of school. The kids liked and respected him. That is what we need more of in schools today. What say ye?

 

['956Wheel]

Yes it's another sad day for all. And I hear that the "shooter" was telling his fellow students his plan, I guess it's just not cool to "fink"... even in a life or death situation.

Now, on why this happens I see many reasons:

Single parents more than ever, support the children and make a living... it will not work in most cases.

Media, both news and "entertainment" are being irresponsible with their glorifying of violence in order that they satisfy their greed. Hold them accountable, hit them where it hurts... in the pocketbook!

The youths peer pressure seems stronger than ever, yes we were competetive, but it had limits, there was fear... not now.

The recording industry (media again) churning out mind polluting crap in the guise of free speech, the problem... you can't leglislate reponsibility let alone intellegence. Yes, I am for free speech but with it must come concern for the well being of others.

How many of us had Mom home when we got home from school? We are now more than ever a materialistic society, in order that Mom and Dad have all the latest, newest posessions both must work, parents, in many cases, are not raising their own children! Sad but true. Why have them if the lady down the street will be raising them. Lets be honest many children are a "by-product" of a romp in the hay... not trully wanted or planned.

I anticipate some upset folks by my post, sobeit, I do have strong opinions on this subject and felt a need to post them.

Mike

------------------
9535hundred

 

[rich m]

the problems are numerous, but simple to analyze:

human life has been cheapened. 10,000 videogame virtual points have become more valuable than the virtual person that got "offed" for the score. the "10 commandments" is just a movie with cheesy "lame" special effects. there are no more parents, only tall children who have reproduced, and are no more worthy of decisionmaking authority than their more diminutive offspring.
the basket-case parents in my age-group (36 +/- 10 years) have, collectively, failed miserably at disciplining the next layer of our society.
We can only hope that the permanent images and emotional scars carried by the survivors (both local and via news) will serve as a reminder to raise their children in such a manner as to minimize the probability of this type of behavior being repeated. The behavior is human, not hardware. Control the criminals, not the firearms. Teach the child internal selfcontrol before he is too "difficult" to control externally. Armed societies are, typically, more polite. A disarmed populace only invites society's vermin to hunt in a baited field. Like a school, or a workplace.

It irritated me to hear the spokeman on the TV "... . the weapon was a fully loaded . 22longrifle revolver... . "

"fully loaded" is a phrase that just screams for attention. as if partially loaded is safer. it only takes one well-placed round to turn a person into a memory.

other newsies referred to the . 22LR as a "high calibre" handgun #ad


as a matter of informational contrast, i must state, in all honesty, i don't recall ever seeing . 22L or . 22"short". I presume they exist, as i have heard of them, but, are they obsolete? can you purchase a new gun in that calibre that's chambered for anything but . 22LR?. . all the . 22 rounds i think i've ever seen have been . 22LR
and they just phrase it that way to play upon people's ignorance.

 

[Dave B]

Virtually every school shooting has had one common thread: BULLIES. Everyone seems so amazed that these shootings happen, but when one considers how the "bullies" have been beating the crap out of smaller kids, intimidating them, etc etc for years... . then the screwed up kid who's been the doormat for the bullies sees a movie where "the little guy" blows away all the big meanies, well, what do you think he's gonna do? IMHO, a large amount of this is a SCHOOL problem brought on by liberal morons who are either too stupid, liberal, or SCARED to throw out the bullies. Remember the black teens who caused a riot at the football game somewhere a year or so back... running through the stands beating the crap out of whomever got in their way? School threw em out..... Jesse Cupcake Jackson (aka Can't Keep It In His Pants) went nuts making it a racial issue: offenders are back in school.

So where's the problem? Parents? To a certain degree. The school? To a certain degree. Society? Somewhat. One thing that CAN change is these stupid jackass administrators need to be made to THROW OUT adult criminals disguised as school children and that addresses the bully issue. What to do with the bullies after that is another question.

 

[buttugly]

The Rosies are NOT educated on the subject of guns. Do they really know the diference between a . 22 and a . 22-250? doubt it! As I see it two basic things take place when you fire a weapon,the physical move of the finger to pull the trigger and the mental thought telling the finger to pull. Now this kid is 15 and I believe parents or guardians are "legally" responsible. The kid pulled the trigger. . parents(more than likely)failed in training the brain. BOTH should be convicted for the crime. If we run down a innocent person with a Dodge truck and kill them,who's acused. . us or Dodge?

------------------
2001 2500quad4X4SB auto KN Black Leather loaded Boost and EGT gauges EZ ordered

 

[HEMI®Dart]

I heard the Califorinia has some of the toughest gun laws in the country.

Lucky he only had a . 22 LR. Don't misunderstand me, its still a lethal caliber. Eric & Dylan from Coloumbine had much more powerful weapons and heavier loads. Hence, more kids died #ad


No simple answer how to prevent this.

 

[Amianthus]

All of these are good points to ponder. They would all help remove some of the pressures and stressors of today. But the finger of blame shouldn't be pointed at anyone else but the ones who pulled the trigger. They had the final decision. End of argument. Who forces the thief to put something of yours in his hand? Who forces the rapist to put his "thingy" in his victim? Who forces the wife to poison her husband? These are all matters that noone can control except the individual involved. What the above actions describe is not a failure of society, but a failure of self-control. A failure of self-discipline, in other words.
IMO, lack of religious discipline is a good place to start. But I shouldn't preach to anyone. I have my own demons to work out with the devine. Just my take.