Any plumbers on here?

[THenningsen]

I need some help diagnosing a plumbing issue. Are there any plumbers on here that could help?

 

[ACoyle]

Amatuer here, but, not too bad. Can I help?



AC

 

[Crash&Burn]

I need some help diagnosing a plumbing issue. Are there any plumbers on here that could help?

I'm not now, but I played one in the Army.

 

[rbattelle]

I also am an amateur, and very curious to hear what the problem is!

Ryan

 

[bighammer]

Hot on the left, cold on the right, and poop runs downhill. The rest is just details, right?

OK, I don't know much, but I'm curious too.

 

[THenningsen]

Well..... it seems that I have a high pressure situation. When I turn on a faucet or the shower, there is a surge of high pressure water, then it levels off. I went out to look at the water heater and noticed that the pressure relief valve on the top of the water heater had been discharging cause there was a wet spot on the floor. That seemed to be in keeping with my high pressure problem. For cheap insurance I replaced the pressure valve. Now I've found that if I run the washer or the tub, I have extremely low pressure throughout the rest of the house. I bought a pressure gauge that goes on the outside faucet, and it's showing 120 psi, which is extremely high. So, how with such and apparent high pressure problem, do I have such low pressure when anything significant is running? Is it just the pressure reducing valve (pressure regulator) that is bad? Water company says that they are a gravity based system and the problem is not on their end. You all have any ideas? If it is the pressure reducing valve, are there any tricks of the trade to replacing it? Thanks guys for all the help.

 

[Bill Stockard]

It sounds like your pressure regulator flow rating is too low. Replace the regulator with a higher flow rating (gallons per minute-GPM).



No I'm not a plumber.



Bill

 

[daveshoe]

This old house did a segment on this very issue. City water departments now install backflow preventers on their systems that prevent water from your house from flowing backwards into the town system. Think of it as a one-way valve that allows water in to the house,but does not allow the water back out. If the pressure increases inside the house,it just stays inside. When your water heater heats up,it creates expansion in the system resulting in high pressure. The solution is the installation of a hot water expansion tank close to the water heater. These water expansion tanks are commonly used in hot water heating systems that supply hot water to radiators in the home. Very common and readily available. Hope this helps.

 

[Crash&Burn]

Well..... it seems that I have a high pressure situation. When I turn on a faucet or the shower, there is a surge of high pressure water, then it levels off. I went out to look at the water heater and noticed that the pressure relief valve on the top of the water heater had been discharging cause there was a wet spot on the floor. That seemed to be in keeping with my high pressure problem. For cheap insurance I replaced the pressure valve. Now I've found that if I run the washer or the tub, I have extremely low pressure throughout the rest of the house. I bought a pressure gauge that goes on the outside faucet, and it's showing 120 psi, which is extremely high. So, how with such and apparent high pressure problem, do I have such low pressure when anything significant is running? Is it just the pressure reducing valve (pressure regulator) that is bad? Water company says that they are a gravity based system and the problem is not on their end. You all have any ideas? If it is the pressure reducing valve, are there any tricks of the trade to replacing it? Thanks guys for all the help.

Is PRV a Watts brand? If it is, there is a large plug on the bottom which houses a strainer..... Turn the service valve off and pull the strainer... . be sure to use a backup wrench on the valve body when looseing the plug.

 

[donnier]

Aother reason is if you have galvanized plumbing in the house, the pipes may have a lot of buildup and acting like a restrictor.

That could explain the low flow when using the washer.

I ran into this a lot when working for the local water dept complaint dept.

If yu do have 120# oming in, install a regulator to take the pressure down to 75 #.

Saves wear and tear on the washer and toilet seals.

 

[rbattelle]

If yu do have 120# oming in, install a regulator to take the pressure down to 75 #.

120 psi!?!?!?



My city supply from the street is almost 80 psi, and I think that's WAY too high. 120 is downright dangerous! If I were you, I'd be shutting off the main water supply when I'm not home, just to be safe. Appliances and toilets just aren't rated to handle that.



From my research, 60-80 psi is "normal". Anything outside that is bad.



I installed an industrial, bronze pressure regulator designed for large buildings in the house, and regulate my pressure down to about 60 psi.



Also, as someone already mentioned, a water heater expansion tank is a must. In fact, I believe in many areas of the country it's now part of code. Most pressure regulators won't permit backflow, as far as I know, so if the water company has a regulator at the street, you need an expansion tank on that water heater.



The water company played on your ignorance when they told you their system is gravity feed. The fact that the water supply is gravity fed is true, but irrelevant. They were trying to get rid of you. Remember the code of "customer service": it's always the user's fault.



Most municipal water systems are "gravity feed". You know those big water towers you see across the skyline? Those are what provide you your water pressure. They pump the water up to the top of those towers, and gravity generates the pressure according to the height of the column. [It's done this way because the water reservoir provides a buffer between the demand side and the use side so the water pumps aren't dealing with a constantly-varying demand].



I was thinking your super-high initial pressure was caused by the water heater building pressure when heating the water, then releasing it when a faucet is opened. But that doesn't explain the low flow.



The first thing I would check is the thermostat on the water heater. If it's broken, and the heating elements (or the burner) is stuck on, then your water temperature is getting way too high (which causes the high pressure, which causes the T&P release valve to open). If the heater is sticking ON, you may notice EXTREMELY hot water, or even steam coming out when you open a hot water faucet.



After that, I agree with Bill's suggestion that there's a problem with the regulator out at the street. If so, the water company needs to come fix their equipment.



There is a simple way to test whether the excess pressure is being generated in the house, or at the street. Shut off the water main, then connect up your pressure gauge. Open a faucet until the water pressure indicated on the gauge drops down to, say, 50 psi. Then make sure every faucet in the house is off and don't let anyone shower, wash, or flush a toilet. Monitor the pressure gauge for awhile and see if it climbs.



Since you've isolated the house from the supply, if the pressure rises over time then your problem is inside the house (and it's probably the water heater). If the pressure remains steady, the problem is probably not in the house.



From what I've read, there can be problems with municipal water supply pressure skyrocketing during the night, when demand is very low. To test for this condition, you can connect your pressure gauge at night before going to bed. Open a faucet to get the pressure to drop down to supply pressure (this will happen within 60 seconds of opening any faucet in the house), then close everything up for the night.



Check the gauge in the morning and see if it has risen. If it has, then there's something going on from the supply at night, which is a water company problem.



Like I said, I'm no plumber. But out of necessity I've had to do a great deal of research because my house was destroyed (literally) by a broken under-sink supply line that cracked due (partly) to excessive water pressure.



Excess water pressure is nothing to scoff at!!! It CAN destroy your home and everything in it, just as easily as a fire could!



Ryan

 

[p-Bar]

I had the exact same problem happen to me . You have a pin hole in the diaphram of your regulator so when you are flowing water it is regulating, when you have no water flowing the water is leaking thru the pin hole and giving you the street pressure.

 

[Blu-meanie]

I'd try turning off the hot water heater. If the pressure doesn't build up, you need the tank. If it still goes to 120 lbs, you got a regulator problem. Also, it seems that if there is low flow, that too would indicate a bad regulator.

 

[daveshoe]

I just happened to see an expansion tank plumbed in to a water heater today. It was in a recently constructed business, so I would assume that a pro did the installation, with State of Ohio permits. The expansion tank was on a Tee fitting, directly over the COLD or supply side of the tank.

 

[mberry]

I'd try turning off the hot water heater.

Hot water heater? Why would hot water need heating? Sorry, I couldn't resist throwing out some George Carlin.

It sounds to me like you have a pressure regulator problem to me. Liquids do not compress, so unless you are actually boiling the water and creating gas/steam in the system I don't see the pressure building up that high from the water heater alone. Besides that, the PRV on the water heater should be preventing that high of pressure I would think.

Now, for the rest of you, I would LOVE to have 60-80psi IN my house. I'm lucky to get 35 or 40 and God forbid you turn on more than one faucet while you're in the shower. The flow goes to less than half. I'm definitely not getting enough volume.