Are VP44/lift pump issues solved in 3rd gen?

[geusterman]

I think I may upgrade from 2002 HO wanting (not needing, mind you) 4 doors and QUIET! Does the VP44/lift pump curse follow the new models (or a new curse) and is the trac bar issue solved with the American axles? geusterman

 

[rbattelle]

The answer, I believe, is yes and yes. New lift pump. No VP-44 (I forget the model name for the new injector pump). I don't believe anyone has complained about the new trackbar.

 

[Pit Bull]

George, the injection system and the steering/front suspension system are new/different. If you want quiet then the new 03/04 would be what you are looking for. I would get one before they add the EGR in January of 04.

 

[CIverson]

The trackbar uses normal round bushings at each end on the 03's compared to the round bushing and ball stud. The ball stud was what caused the problems on the previous years.

 

[geusterman]

Thanks. So lift pump and early pressure pump failure are not an issue with the new configuration? geusterman

 

[Steve M]

The same motor in tractor and stationary applications doesn't even have a lift pump. Ours does for ease of filter changes. There is no more injection pump. Nada. Zilch... We have a high pressure fuel rail pump. It supplies fuel pressure to the rail and the injectors are fired electronically. Electronics nay sayers scoff but I believe it's the best one yet.

 

[krabman]

Still pretty early in the game to make a call on the lift pump issue. I think we need to see more trucks with more miles before we make any kind of definitive assessment. For those that are going to bomb however the jury is in. I tried running my truck sans lift pump when I was putting in the new lift pump and it wasnt liking it much. I swapped it because with nothing more than an EZ I was pulling my fuel pressure down to zero. Several others have done the same although some have not had this problem and others have hardly had any drop when running with an EZ so Im thinking the quality control on the lift pump has some fairly wide paramaters. Before someone chimes in here and says you can run at zero pressure as long as you have flow... wrong answer. Its now been proven beyond any doubt that the truck doesnt like to see zero on the fuel pressure. No one seems to know exactly what effect fuel starvation will have on the cp3 but I know for sure I dont want to have to buy one.

 

[RSnaith]

Originally posted by krabman

Its now been proven beyond any doubt that the truck doesnt like to see zero on the fuel pressure. No one seems to know exactly what effect fuel starvation will have on the cp3 but I know for sure I dont want to have to buy one.

You nailed it right on here. The lift pumps do appear to be more reliable than old ones. I've got one of the first 03s to hit the streets, and my fuel pressure dropped about 1. 5 PSI (to 8. 5 at idle) within the first 2 months of ownership. Since then, the pressures have been rock solid, but even with an EZ in the 80 pony setting, I was able to draw pressure down to 0 PSI. This would cause an intermitent miss at high RPM. I swapped out to -8AN lines between fuel filter canister and the CP3, and with the EZ, I was able to generate about 2 PSI of pressure at WOT. This took care of the miss, however with the Bully Dog box on the truck, I've been able to draw pressure down to 0 PSI again, and cause a miss again.



Rod

 

[Agades]

Originally posted by Pit Bull

George, the injection system and the steering/front suspension system are new/different. If you want quiet then the new 03/04 would be what you are looking for. I would get one before they add the EGR in January of 04.

what is the EGR????

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by Agades

what is the EGR????

Exhaust gas recirculation. They will add this to the trucks made after 1/1/04 it will add more complexity to the engine, it is an added emissions requirement for the CTD. Adds soot to the oil. Lowers performance Not a set in the right direction.

 

[Agades]

thats not cool



Im trying to find a new vehicle for my wife

and

you know , I just cant find a vehicle I really like



they all have some downfall that really takes away from a good product



like dodges quality control

or

fords 6 liter diesel

or

just not being able to get service for some makes without traveling 150 miles



the list goes on... ...



what are some people thinking???????

 

[Pit Bull]

Just buy the 03, or order one and tell the dealer you need it before they add the EGR.

 

[DPKetchum]

A buddy of mine bought a 03 Toyota Truck for wife. One of those V6 4door Auto fully loaded ones. Short bed. Looks great. He bought a 03 2500 H. O. auto 3. 73 gear 4 door bright red Dodge. The toyota used 3 qts of oil in 5k,gets 14mpg etc. WIFE and him prefer the DODGE period. Used no oil,gets 21 mpg most of the time and he/she said quality was equal. Says the 03 Dodge out handles,stops,faster. bigger,better mileage like it MUCH better all the way around. They bet resale will be higher also.

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by DPKetchum

A buddy of mine bought a 03 Toyota Truck for wife. One of those V6 4door Auto fully loaded ones. Short bed. Looks great. He bought a 03 2500 H. O. auto 3. 73 gear 4 door bright red Dodge. The toyota used 3 qts of oil in 5k,gets 14mpg etc. WIFE and him prefer the DODGE period. Used no oil,gets 21 mpg most of the time and he/she said quality was equal. Says the 03 Dodge out handles,stops,faster. bigger,better mileage like it MUCH better all the way around. They bet resale will be higher also.

He got a lemon Toyota . I've owned several Toyotas, very high quality fit and finish and never had one that used oil. My wife drives my old 95 Landcruiser that has 130K miles on it and it does not use oil and gets 16 mpg (that's a straight six and the LC weighs 4800-5000 lbs). My wife once owned a Toyota 4x4 4 banger that got 24 mpg and never used oil. It had 160K miles on it when she got tire of it and sold it. Toyota makes the highest quality vehicles on the market. I love my Dodge CTD, and I got a good one that is very well built, but they are not on average as problem free as a Toyota designed or built vehicle. Wish they were and maybe some day they will be.

 

[DPKetchum]

His first was a Highlander. It also used oil and with 21,000 miles and roughy 5,000 mile oil chages was fairly sludged up. He was Pxxx. Found on some other web sites that this was a issue with them. He traded for the truck thinking it would be better. It is in some ways. It did stop using oil after 5k. But fit/finish was not really any better then the Dodge. Fuel mileage has NEVER been better then 15. 5 with the Toyota. Wife drives it but prefers The 2500 Dodge much better. He says it his LAST Toyo unless he can be PROVEN otherwize. His dad has a v8 Toyo truck. Told him How GREAT it was and it would get GREAT mileage and pull his 3 horse bumper pull Sooner horse trailer. He borrowed it for a week. Said MPG was poor and pulled his empty trailer around 3 days. Said mileage was RAW and towing power wasnt at ALL what it was cracked up to be. Said HE rather have a CHEVY 350 1/2 ton truck to pull with and he wasnt real fond of them. Drove the 2500 Cumming with 48re and said WOW thats THE MAN>Had shopped DuraMax,Ford,Toyota Etc. Also said its cool to have CHEVY/Ford late model owners ALWAYS looking at YOU as you pass or turn in front of them. P. S. I worked for Nissan 14 years. Like Toyota no oil usage,good quality fit etc. I've been told NOW that much more engine issues in past years,oil usage etc. There not the same as the 2. 4re and 1600 Toyos as was in the 80's and early 90s

 

[Pit Bull]

Wifes Toyo was a 1984 2. 4 liter 4 cylinder 4x4 with manual locking hubs. One of the best engines made for durability. My LC is a 4. 5 liter straight six, they are good for 300K miles with no problems. Had the Lexus V-8's in the SC400 and LS400 both were great engines. Wife had a 92 Lexus ES300 V-6 that was a good engine and never used oil until the mechanic at the Lexus dealer forgot to put oil in during a oil and filter change. At this point I think Lexus makes the highest quality cars, but I owned a 91 Acura NSX that they make in a special factory in Japan, it was the highest quality vehicle I have ever seen (should of kept that one). I also owned a 2000 Toyota Tundra with the 4. 7 liter V-8, nice engine (does have the iron block). I would prefer a Toyota built engine over any of the engines made by GM, Ford or DC. I might consider a Hemi But if I bought a new truck it has to have a CTD in it. I thought of the Tundra as a great truck for light hauling and towing, got around 17 mpg and it drove like a car. Very boring!!!

 

[DPKetchum]

The 84 etc you mentioned was the GOOD years. /I'm told by friends that still work on Nissan's that In late 90s etc a lot of that changed,for the worse. oil usage issues,knocks,timing chain issues etc. From what I hear about Toyota and some of the web sites and my buddies experience it changed for them also. His Highlander as well as using oil started to blow smoke on startup. dealer said if sludge its YOUR problem. he has receipts of 5 k oil and filters. They said DON'T matter. Any how I found that this was a PROBLEM with those autos. Since then my friend has said he has noticed other Highlanders smoking bad slowing on hi way etc. We pulled his front valve cover. Was quite a bit of goo in there. He said fine I bet they fix it under warranty but not for ME. He traded it at another Toyo dealer the next day. We are going to get a writer at another store to run that Vin number and check Warranty history on it. Bet it gets repaired. they will sell it to some unsuspecting person who in a week or so will bring it back in complaining of smoke and oil usage. In fact its time to do that. Has been 3 months since trade. It only had 24k and change on it.

 

[Pit Bull]

That is a bad deal, I had never heard anything like this before. Just shows that you have to do your research about a car/truck before you buy and not hold on to old experiences. I did that on the Dodge Cummins and also on the Landcruiser (bought it used with 30K miles on it when I retired). I would not want to spend the money on a new Landcruiser, has the same engine as a $20,000 Tundra but you pay $50,000 for the new Landcruiser . Buying a bunch of new vehicles is no longer a problem I will have, now that I am poor and retired. Have to drive the stuff I have and do the research big time before I buy anything new. But you can still get stuck with a lemon no matter how much research you do.