Bad fuel/Why are dealers aggressive flagging trucks as warranty void?

[jayhawktrailers.com]

Long rant . Read at own risk.



We dropped a new '07 at dealer today, after installing a hitch. Another truck we had worked on was there for "warranty" service. The dealer told him it had bad fuel and was not warranty, also voided warranty. I understand DC's concern with chips, etc. and expect they have an "incentive" to get dealers to rat out their customers. Is the incentive straight to the tech somehow? Or do they make that much more on the non-warranty service to make it worth the horrible customer relations. This truck was one of several late model higher mileage trucks their customer had bought from them. Can the dealer make enough on the injector job to compensate for the loss of a customer? Will the customer even go back to Dodge, or try another make?



Why can't DC install a filter that just stops fuel after it plugs and shut it down and save the engine/fuel system? Even if they don't want to starve the pump for lube issues, can't they just monitor pressure and shut it down electronically? I would rather get towed and fixed, than drive till they say it is toast. It is just insane to say "you overwhelmed the filter" and ruined your new truck, as opposed to "you plugged your filter and your truck won't run until you replace it".



Also, I have not heard GM or Ford void bunches of warranties for this. I pay more attention to the Dodge stuff, but is this problem widespread for those guys as well?

 

[RustyJC]

All three companies are losing money. A warranty dollar saved flows straight to the bottom line, so all of the Big 3 are playing warranty hardball at present.



Rusty

 

[byoslandry]

stude

I agree with you on having the engine stop if the filter would plug up. A tow is better than a bad engine.

I change my fuel filter every 10,000 miles plus I open that drain on the fuel canister every other tank up.

I want to put a better fuel filter setup, but don't want to give anyone a reason to void my basic warranty as well as my extended warranty.

I don't need more horsepower or more torque than what I have from the factory as this engine gets er done.

This fuel filtration from the stock 10 microns to 2 microns would plug up the filter faster and may stain the in tank fuel pump. So, to hopefully keep my truck in warranty, I use only their parts and hope for the best.

I hate knowing better by being informed by this forum and not being able to do anything in fear of losing warranty. Really bums me out.

 

[jayhawktrailers.com]

Seems awefully short sighted?

They are bleeding, but aren't the full-size pick-ups one of the few areas they make some money? If your cheap on warranty on a car you lose money on already, you have little to lose? But fighting customers on trucks seems like killing the golden goose or something.

 

[brista]

stude

I agree with you on having the engine stop if the filter would plug up. A tow is better than a bad engine.

I change my fuel filter every 10,000 miles plus I open that drain on the fuel canister every other tank up.

I want to put a better fuel filter setup, but don't want to give anyone a reason to void my basic warranty as well as my extended warranty.

I don't need more horsepower or more torque than what I have from the factory as this engine gets er done.

This fuel filtration from the stock 10 microns to 2 microns would plug up the filter faster and may stain the in tank fuel pump. So, to hopefully keep my truck in warranty, I use only their parts and hope for the best.

I hate knowing better by being informed by this forum and not being able to do anything in fear of losing warranty. Really bums me out.

Ask your dealer... I did and the service manager said he would not void a warranty because I had installed better fuel filtration. In his dealership they deal with lots of injector issues so I think he is willing to look at things as an improvement. I put on a secondary 2 micron unit.

 

[DPKetchum]

I read some Ford and G. M. forums and not much about "bad"fuel. G. M. has lots of injector issues and they just keep replacing them without much fanfare. (same design/system as the Dodge trucks)They have just extended the coverage on injectors to 200k on more year model Duramaxs as well as updated filters. Ford 6. 0s have lots of issues and a few injector failures but they are a totaly differant system also. They just replace them with out much fan fare. D. C. is the one with the BAD fuel got you and no coverage time after time.

 

[RRees]

If a person bought diesel and didn't know it was bad, why doesn't DC and the local dealers followup with their respective States regulators to figure out where the bad fuel is?



Just thinking out loud.

 

[Spooled-up]

How are they determining that the fuel is actually bad? Is it based on the filter, or actually analyzing the fuel in the tank or the filter canister?



This seems like a cop-out to me on the part of DC. Voiding a warranty does nothing to promote brand loyalty. I think that is most of the reason Ford sells so many trucks. My dad buys Ford exclusively. He hasn't even looked at or test driven another type of vehicle in 30 years! If you treat your customers right, you keep getting those customers again. What a concept.



With the volume of vehicles that Dodge sells, they probably write it off as a tiny percentage of repeat business lost. It's a shame.

 

[jelag]

Lets say for the past 5 years you've been buying your fuel at one of the major truck stops. . some of these locations move in excess of 50K gal's a day with several tankers running to them daily... . and now your truck has a problem and the dealer says its fuel...



I would think that if your having this problem so would 1000 other trucks that have bought fuel from that same location... . the quality of our fuel today is very good because most of the oil companies have closed those low volume locations and new standards for tanks in the ground... .



I see this leading to one or two very specific areas... . 1 - DC didn't install the correct systems on our trucks to protect the fuel... . and I'm sure these specific items are suggested by Cummins and are used in like trucks where the same engine is used such as UPS or other large fleets... . 2 - you the owner is doing something to get dirt into the system..... 3 - the tech. at the dealer and the support he gets from up channel DC is not what it needs to be to correctly discover the problem and the cause of failure...



I'm personally more inclined to believe 3 above... . in that something besides fuel is causing the problem... we personally run several trucks of which 3 are Dodges... . 04, 04. 5, 05 and the total mileage on these 3 trucks is 325 K miles... . but we own 3 other trucks and those trucks have a total mileage of well over 1 million miles... Of the 6 trucks our electrical problems with a 00 F550 and injectors is famous..... but its not the fuel... its the electrical system that works them and fires them... .



I personally don't believe that we can have a fuel problem like what is mentioned on this board.....

 

[JGheen]

I hope I never have this issue(knock on wood), but if I run into any injector problems and they try to void my warranty due to the reason of bad fuel, they will never hear the end of it from me. This bad fuel cop-out is the biggest bunch of crap I have ever heard.



Joe

 

[MRaynor]

I have a buddy who has a Sprinter van. He took it to a 5 star dealer in Columbia, and they told hime he needed new injectors. He said ok replace them. They replaced the injectors fired up the van, and blew the motor. They tried to blame it on bad fuel. He sent in a sample that came back with no problems. What actually happened was one or two of the new injectors stuck wide opened and washed down the cylinders. He went back and forth with them, but they finally replaced the motor.



Mike

 

[Cal Brewin]

Diesel Fuel Analysis! I just started using oil analysis from Blackstone, and if a dealer were to try to pull the "bad fuel" scam, I would send in a diesel sample to be analyzed.



Tom

 

[PGreenleaf]

Lets say for the past 5 years you've been buying your fuel at one of the major truck stops. . some of these locations move in excess of 50K gal's a day with several tankers running to them daily... . and now your truck has a problem and the dealer says its fuel...



I would think that if your having this problem so would 1000 other trucks that have bought fuel from that same location... . the quality of our fuel today is very good because most of the oil companies have closed those low volume locations and new standards for tanks in the ground... .



I see this leading to one or two very specific areas... . 1 - DC didn't install the correct systems on our trucks to protect the fuel... . and I'm sure these specific items are suggested by Cummins and are used in like trucks where the same engine is used such as UPS or other large fleets... . 2 - you the owner is doing something to get dirt into the system..... 3 - the tech. at the dealer and the support he gets from up channel DC is not what it needs to be to correctly discover the problem and the cause of failure...



I'm personally more inclined to believe 3 above... . in that something besides fuel is causing the problem... we personally run several trucks of which 3 are Dodges... . 04, 04. 5, 05 and the total mileage on these 3 trucks is 325 K miles... . but we own 3 other trucks and those trucks have a total mileage of well over 1 million miles... Of the 6 trucks our electrical problems with a 00 F550 and injectors is famous..... but its not the fuel... its the electrical system that works them and fires them... .



I personally don't believe that we can have a fuel problem like what is mentioned on this board.....

OK guys Take the above #2 reason. How many of you have fixed the exposed elbows setting on top of your tank, that are capable of letting all kinds of water and crud go directly into your fuel tank??

These elbow are setting in a concave on top of tank. If water fills the concave it'll run right into your tank. Theres supposed to be a one way check valve there to keep fuel from running out if truck turns upsidedown, but nothing to keep water from running in. And crud too. The 06s had a recall to fix this . But its a old problem , several model years. No older trucks got recalled.

Fix-- Put 18 inches of 1/4 in. gas line on elbow, let hang down between tank and heat shield , put cheap little inline gas filter on end of line.

Will still vent but wont allow crud to go in. Some models have two exposed elbows .

 

[FPettijohn]

Just because a dealer or star or zone says you have bad fuel or that a mod caused your problem and your warranty is void does NOT make it so. You can fight them with help from sema, the fuel company and even TDR as a group. I understand the pay if you play rule but fair is fair. If they claim bad fuel ask why the water light did not come on, why the ecm did not go into limp in mode, if the engine has been washed down as why the injectors are not being recalled. Since it usually takes out the turbo as well a good lawyer may be inexpensive compared to a voided warranty with 40 or 50k left. DCX is NOT judge and jury.

Fred

 

[BNH4221]

The above posts are one reason I save all my fuel receipts. Have for the past two years.

If I ever have any problems, I can at least show where I buy all my fuel and let them fight it out with DC.

No problems yet but mark my words, the day I throw them all away... ... . :{





Steve

 

[JMetzger]

I wonder if these warranty issues with DC is why there are 50000 unsold 2006 Dodge trucks,Durango's & Jeep's sittihg in a big stste fair lot just off 8 Mile Road in Detroit. This was in Motor Trend

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I wonder if these warranty issues with DC is why there are 50000 unsold 2006 Dodge trucks,Durango's & Jeep's sittihg in a big stste fair lot just off 8 Mile Road in Detroit. This was in Motor Trend

HMMmmm - that many end of year leftovers could sure amount to some substantial specilal prices and rebates...

 

[Regcabguy]

Leftovers.

I like to quantify how many of those 50,000 are CTD's. I doubt many.

 

[J&LRam]

water in fuel has always been a issue that can get a voided engine warranty from Ford/GM/Dodge. My first new Ford 6. 9 diesel , many years ago, was refused warranty work because of contaminated fuel [water]. The truck stop and the oil company stepped up and fixed my problem along with several others.

JIM