Re: they might be a little to far left but they have a point
Originally posted by CGoyette
Look I have hunted all my life and in 25 years of hunting I can tell you that our coountry is not the same as it once was. We as a whole society have laid waste to some great wilderness areas... that are now subdivisions. I wish there was some middle ground on this but I think that the country is polorized on this issue... . meaning you are far right or far left. I am by no means a tree hugger but I do hug tree's... ... and I'll bet most TDR members are forest lovers and more than half are gun owning hunters and love there sport..... not many 10 pointers shot in city limits... . before you slay them for being somewhat finaticle about the wilderness and wildlife ask yourself if you had your choice would you want a city with 300 differant kids of fast foods or 300 thousand acres of deer and turkey and quail filled woods. They just go over board more often than not.
No blasting me please on this I own more dam guns and have killed more than my fair share of deer and birds but I love the woods so I guess I am a quasi tree hugger... at least my deer stand is a API... . ha
about 5% of the land mass in the US is paved over, built over, or otherwise intensively developed. We are not in the slightest danger of "losing our land". This movement isn't about "wise use" or caring for our land. Nobody here that I know of believes in seriously polluting the environment - air, water, land, or otherwise. This movement is dedicated to the notion that we must densely populate our cities, and remove man COMPLETELY from well over half of our country.
I love the fact that 1/4 mile from my house, I can turn onto Oregon 204 and in 10 minutes be in the forest, with only the occainsional house and abundant wildlife. If these guys got their way, I'd have to live in metropolitan Portland or Seattle, NOT be able to drive up to Mt Hood and NOT be able to live in any rural area. They want the roads removed. They want us off the rivers. They want us to NOT tow our RV's to Wallowa Lake, take the tram to the top, or do any hunting while we boondock on some backroad.
What you and I both believe in, is good and wise use of our resources. They were God-given to us to improve our lives, and provide for our needs. We are NOT a pollution upon the land. We are it's owners and we are responsible to the Creator who gave it to us to take good care of it.
These people don't believe in God, they don't believe in the Biblical injunction to "dress and care" for our land - as Adam and Eve were instructed to do. Instead, they believe that the land and creatures are "holy" and our presence defiles.
In our age of communications and information technology, it is becoming more and more possible for more and more of us to live away from a city environment. As we face an increasingly dangerous future from the likes the Sept 11th attack, it is more and more intelligent to spread out. Attacks of a viral or chemical nature downtown Manhattan could kill immense numbers. In less populated areas, such things become less likely and produce far fewer victims. Crime is reduced, inner city poverty,gangs, violence, and despair, for instance, does not exist outside of the inner city.
We should do the opposite of what we are doing. By closing off more and more areas to man's use, we concentrate our use on smaller and smaller areas, eventually leading to their destruction. Instead, we should be opening up more and more areas, diversely spread. We should be encouraging small communities to grow in such ways we minimize the effect of concentrating our impact on our land. We should be opening almost every possible area to wise use. We should have a comprehensive plan to use every last possible acre of national and s tate forests for trees... done so that we can maintain the health and young vitality of all of it. This way, management costs would be small. Recurring impacts on those areas will be decades or even perhaps generations apart, instead of trying to meet our timber needs by intensive cultivation of small areas.
These people are wrong, period. Thier motivation is NOT to be good stewards... but to simply remove man, and call that "caring". Their goals are to "depopulate" the planet "humanely". I suppose that means to euthanize. At the minimum it means to control our lives by government. By their own admission, they are not interested in the science or knowledge of thier world, but in a pseudo-religious philosophy that maintains utterly irrational beliefs and promotes goals that are against the interest of every person on the planet. They want to de-industrialize us. Their goals will reduce our ability to create food so severely that our world will not be able to support even a small portion of it's people. These people have wrapped themselves in a mantle of self-righteous and phony rhetoric. I do not believe in "compromise" with them. I believe in total defeat of thier dangerous and senseless ideas. You cannot "compromise" with them, since thier demands to compromise will never end. They will not stop until your life, my life, or my children's lives, or perhaps thier children's lives are totally controlled by them or people they control.
There is NO good in that.
Attention: TDR Forum Junkies 
What a premise - my life is worth no more than that of a pissant or a cockroach!! 
Yeah, I'll bet they get lots of recruits with that philosophy!
How 'bout noise pollution and removing mufflers & silencer rings? Music to one is pollution to another. And when was the last time you heard one of these guys say "you know, those DD Stage 5 injectors are just too darn smoky"?
