brake shoes...hard to replace or not?

[jaynes]

Everytime i depress my brake pedal, the rear brakes squeel and scream like banshees. I think I remember years ago trying to get the brake drums off, but I couldn't do it. I think they were stuck or something. Is there anything special you have to do besides take off the brake drum, or is there anything special you have to do to get the brake drum off (besides beat the crap out of it). Thanks!!



jaynes

 

[AMink]

It makes it easier if you put a skinny screwdriver through the adjustment hole and push on the adjuster "lock", then turn the adjuster so that the shoes move away from the drum. It's kind of hard to explain, but if you put the screwdriver in the hole and poke around, you'll feel something "springy" move. That's what you want to push on. Also, squirt some penetrating oil around the bolts so it soaks into the back of the drum. The drum tends to "freeze" to the hub. If you have run the shoes too far down, they will etch into the drum, so you'll have to literally back them out of the groove that they wore. Then, get a hammer and tap around the drum to loosen it; when it's ready, it comes right off. I went through this last weekend on my 2g. Once you get the hang of it, it's really easy. Good luck!

 

[Greenleaf]

I'll let you know in a few weeks and post back with the 411



If my Dodge equipped Dana 70 is the same or similar to the Ford, the rear axle will pull out/remove the bearing retaining nut(s) and the drum/hub assy will slide off the axle housing.



-S

 

[CMckee]

you can try backing off the adjusters first then beat the crap out of them. it helpsto have a helper that way one can pry on each side with a screwdriver/prybar and the other can hit the drum with a hammer. sometimes a little heat in the centre of the drum helps as well.

 

[Case500D]

Drum removal

To get the rear drums off, you first need to remove the axle shaft. These are the 8 9/16" headed bolts in the center of the hub. If the axle doesn't move when the bolts are loose, smack it with a hammer and it will come loose. Then you will need to remove the little lock wedge holding the axle bearing nut in place. Make sure your brakes are backed off like the other fellas said. Then remove the axle nut (2-9/16" socket) and pull the drum, hub, and bearings off. To remove the drum, you have to drive the studs out of the the drum/hub assembly. You can use an air hammer or just a BFH. Put new studs in if you install a new drum. More than likely your drum will be wore out and not be turnable. You can get new seals, bearings, drums, shoes, small parts kits, etc at NAPA or your favorite auto parts store. Good luck. You can tear one side down in about 20 minutes if everything goes right.



Jeremy

 

[AMink]

I hope I didn't give bad advice. I assumed that the G1 drums would be the same as G2. I didn't have to pull off anything but the drum. I was nice not having to mess with pulling out the axle and messing up the seals. Like I did on the rotors.

 

[jaynes]

i know what you are talking about. The axle pulls out of the housing thing, along with the drum and hub. So you HAVE to remove the axle from it's housing to get the drums off? I guess it's no big deal, but I remember I had trouble getting the axle back in. Took two of us: one to put the truck in gear so the rear end would turn, and the other to try and shove the axle back in to it's grooves. Sounds like a pain, but it has to be done.



jaynes

 

[Case500D]

You guessed it. You have to remove the axle shaft, nuts and bearings to get the drum off. The studs are pressed into the hub and drum. These are NOT like the 2nd gen trucks. To put the axle back in, just push it in and rotate it until it slides into the splines of the differential. Then rotate the hub/drum assembly to match up the bolt holes. Never had to turn the differential or have help to get the axle in. Make sure to replace the steel gaskets on the axle shafts. They are really cheap and it sure beats the old ones leaking.



Jeremy

 

[TKingsbury]

Yup, inboard drums suck. I haven't checked my rears yet because of this fact. I'll probably let 'em go until I hear noise, or finish all of the other must-do's.

Travis. .

 

[AlK]

It is not that hard of job. Jeremy pretty well described what needs to be done. I would add a couple of other things.

1) install new axle seals - chances are the old ones will leak.

2) the wheel bearings are lubed via the rear end, after the brake job is finished but before you drive the vehicle, first jack up one rear wheel at a time so that oil will flow from the rear end to the bearings of wheel that is on the ground. After this you may have to top up the rear end with oil.

 

[dan brooks]

Compared to 1/2-ton trucks and passenger cars, these things are a PITA. One of these days I'd like to figure out how to swap in the later model hubs and drums so it's just a matter of jacking it up and pulling the wheel... .



As far as the shoes go, they're not difficult if you have the right tools. The first time around I didn't, and I fought the hold down springs for a long time to get them back in place. Here are a couple links to the tools I used to make the job much, much easier:



Hold down spring tool - this one makes the shoes a cinch to remove and install.



Return spring tool - this one is for the springs that go from shoe to shoe, and works much better than pliers or vice grips.



If you need to replace your drums, it's not that hard but is time consuming since you have to knock out all the studs to seperate the drum from the hub, then press them back in to reassemble the unit. I used an impact wrench with a bunch of washers to "pull" the stud through, but it can be done with a hammer and brass punch (softer metal won't damage the studs - use it when driving them out especially). Once you get the drum and hub back together, you'll need to have it turned to true it - I made the mistake and didn't the first time, and ended up pulling it apart a few days later.



I had a hard time finding the right drums - my 3/4-ton (and apparently all 3/4-ton CTDs) use the 1-ton drums. Just specify the 12x3" brakes and that should get you the right ones.

 

[jaynes]

yikes

this is starting to sound like more work than I would like to do, or am capable of doing. I don't have alot of the means to do these things, or am in the right environment (just ask AJ, I drove four hours to be in the right environment!). So I dunno... sounds like a real PITA, not sure if I could accomplish that or not. I'll look into those tools though, might make it better. I don't know if those drums could be turned or not, pretty old. Another big problem is $$$, which I have virutally none of. I'm in a rock and a hard place right now. I'll have to dig myself out somehow. Maybe I'll be the lucky 1:50,000,000 to win the $1,000,000 Sweepstakes prize I got in the mail today!! Oo.



jaynes

 

[DieselTweaker]

It's not that bad of a job, I had a wheel cyl take a crap on me. I had to pull the axle to do it as well,,,,,, I will also be doing brake's all the way around and also stepping up to the larger wheel cyl's for more braking power.

 

[dan brooks]

If you've done drum brakes before you won't have any problems with these - it's just more time consuming because there is more involved to just get the drums off. It sounds pretty intimidating, but all in all it isn't a difficult job with the right tools, some basic skills, and the right amount of patience (that's where my problem usually comes in).



As far as the environment, all you need is a place to safely jack up and support the truck on stands (a lift would be better, but not many of us have access to one of them... ). Take your time, keep things clean, and do one side at a time so you have a mirror image to refer to for reassembly.



The parts for these things can be a little pricey, especially the drums. I paid around $100 each IIRC. With the miles on your truck the odds are pretty good that yours will be out of spec, even if they're not grooved. It adds to the cost, but while it's apart I'd replace the wheel cylinders and the hardware (springs, clips, etc), and upgrade to the 3" shoes - do it right, once, instead of halfway a couple times. Unless the adjusters are rusted together or show a lot of wear I'd just clean and lightly lube them. Don't forget to clean the backing plates well, and lightly lube the contact areas (raised pads where the metal part of the shoes rest). Another issue: the emergency brake cable retainers are a joke, and I had one pop off after reassembling everything. A couple small worm-drive hose clamps are now keeping the cables in place on mine.



Just as a FYI, it took me the better part of a day to do my brakes the first time around, including several trips to the parts store to get the right drums, fighting with the hold down springs, and retrieving tools from various parts of the garage, yard, and street (I was just a bit frustrated). It went much quicker the second time since I had the tools I listed, even though I took the drums to be turned and replaced the cylinders when swapping in the 3" shoes. Obviously I didn't do it right the first time... .

 

[cerberusiam]

If the brakes are squealing you will more than likely need new drums, about $140 per, or just throw shoes at it and hope for the best. You will also need that 2 9/16 socket to get the hubs off but the rest can be done with an assortment of hand tools.



I hear you on the rock and hard place, its never fun to be broke and broke down at the same time. Good luck.

 

[jaynes]

Thanks guys, I defiantly can't afford the new drums. But I might be able to afford the shoes. And if any of the other parts are cheap, I could get those too. I'll give her a whirl when I get a chance, probably in a couple of weeks here. I'll repost if I ever get it done!! And Dan, I hear ya on the tool throwing bit... i think I set a record for distance in the grease gun throw!!



Josh