building/installing a living quaters in a horse trailer

[Mhannink]

my friend has a 4 horse steel goose neck trailer with a 4 ft short wall. she wants to make a small living quaters out of the tack room area for when she is at horse shows. i have most of the plan figured out however i am having an issue with the shower, mainly the hot water. i am hoping that everyone here can help me in the design of this set up. the overriding concern is budget. i am looking at 2500 to 3000 to spend on the entire set up. cabinets, bed, kitchen area are not hard and i can do inexpensively but the shower and bath room are another story. the trailer has a wood floor in the horse area. we are talking about doing a cowboy shower, which entails a shower head in the first stall, ideally i want to keep the first stall useable for horses but it may not be possible. beyond this i am not sure how to proceed. i need a shower head, floor pan, drain to waste tank, and most importantly hot water.



i dont think the budget allows for a generator or a hot water setup like most tailers have. what are the alternative options for hot water that might work. keep in mind this unit is going to be lived in for two weeks at the most at a time and a number of creature comforts are able to be sacrificed in that time. i really dont have any idea where to go or where to start on this part so any information will be of great help to me.

 

[Barry]

I am in the horse trailer business. Most of the time when a cowboy shower is used, it is plumbed into the wall between the LQ and horse area. Use an RV recessed shower head/control unit mounted up high. With all the doors and windows closed, the shower-ee just steps into the front stall to shower and the water just runs out onto the ground. (after all, where does the urine go when the horse takes a whiz?) It would be advisable to use flip flops while taking a shower. With the controls mounted up high on the butt side of the trailer(above the horse's butt) the front stall is still usable.



If I were you, I would use a portable potty and not worry about holding tanks other than the one needed for the water tank.



And last but not least, I would give a lot of thought before spending $3K to install a weekend package in a steel trailer.



Hope this helps... ... ... ... . Where are you located?

 

[Barry]

I just checked our website to see if I could find a unit that has a cowboy shower. Here is the link to a unit that does. Look at the very last picture up on the wall between the LQ and the first stall. You will see a recessed RV shower cover on the wall... ... ... ..... that's how its done.
Also if you will look at the ceiling you will see a gold colored shower curtain bow.

Featherlite Horse Trailer For Sale Used 2001 3 Horse Trailer with Living Quarters For Sale - Dixie Horse & Mule Co.

Hope this helps... .....

 

[Mhannink]

I am in the horse trailer business. Most of the time when a cowboy shower is used, it is plumbed into the wall between the LQ and horse area. Use an RV recessed shower head/control unit mounted up high. With all the doors and windows closed, the shower-ee just steps into the front stall to shower and the water just runs out onto the ground. (after all, where does the urine go when the horse takes a whiz?) It would be advisable to use flip flops while taking a shower. With the controls mounted up high on the butt side of the trailer(above the horse's butt) the front stall is still usable.



If I were you, I would use a portable potty and not worry about holding tanks other than the one needed for the water tank.



And last but not least, I would give a lot of thought before spending $3K to install a weekend package in a steel trailer.



Hope this helps... ... ... ... . Where are you located?

my concern is my friend is showing english jumpers and they can be a pretentious bunch, they may not appreciate water running out from under a trailer in the rv parking area. if not for that i would not be much concerned either. how much water gets used in a shower like that 5 gallons? it may not be a problem at that volume.



i am planning on a camping style toilet, it will work when convience is needed otherwise the porta potty at the show should work fine.



as for the kitchen/food prep. an ice chest will keep things pretty cold easily just need to replace the ice, a coleman camp stove will provide enough to cook with and a small portable hot water heater (coleman makes one) can supply the water, probably can be drained under the trailer same as the shower. also thinking a small propane heater, my friend gets cold very easily. on that note is there anything i can do for insulation in the lq area?

 

[Barry]

Spray foam or foam board between the ribs.

 

[Mhannink]

thinking out loud here, i have an idea for a shower useing a self contained tankless unit that runs on propane. i have some plastic food grade barrells that are nice and clean inside. those can be filled with water and should meet all the demands pretty easy. for drinking and food prep, the shower can provide the hot water, cold water can be plumbed in really easily straight from the tank. some l. e. d. lighting will be good for illumination. a camp style toilet can be set up in the front stall with the shower and cleaned out easily. mostly the porta potties will be used for that though. cooking should be taken care of with a small propane cook stove, and a tent heater will do well for heating i think. what do you think?

 

[Mhannink]

forgot to mention im thinking some high capacity batteries that can be charged off the truck i think will work. l. e. d. lights are about the only thing electrical running and if i have enough capacity and a very large inverter i should be able to run a very small microwave for a short bit. maybe the microwave is too much

 

[Mhannink]

I am in the horse trailer business. Most of the time when a cowboy shower is used, it is plumbed into the wall between the LQ and horse area. Use an RV recessed shower head/control unit mounted up high. With all the doors and windows closed, the shower-ee just steps into the front stall to shower and the water just runs out onto the ground. (after all, where does the urine go when the horse takes a whiz?) It would be advisable to use flip flops while taking a shower. With the controls mounted up high on the butt side of the trailer(above the horse's butt) the front stall is still usable.



If I were you, I would use a portable potty and not worry about holding tanks other than the one needed for the water tank.



And last but not least, I would give a lot of thought before spending $3K to install a weekend package in a steel trailer.



Hope this helps... ... ... ... . Where are you located?

im located in modesto ca, in the central valley. also what are your thoughts when you say to think hard before spending 3k in a steel trailer?

 

[Barry]

Value: What is the value of the steel trailer? Take into count the year, make and model of the unit and then consider if the money is going to be well spent.

If you took the value of the steel trailer and then add the money you intend to spend, how close does that get you to a unit that is already built? Trying to get a weekend package into a 4' short wall is tight.

Weight: Once you get all this installed, filled and loaded, does she have enough truck to safely pull it?

 

[Mhannink]

barry, your thoughts are the very reasons we are looking at this. for the moment all of this is cost analysis.



here is our line of thought, she paid 7k for the trailer. it is a solid little trailer with no issues at the moment. our thinking is that this trailer is going to be kept for a very long time and used for a variety of things. im pretty sure she (maybe eventually we) will never sell it. the trailer is paid for, registration is permanant and paid for, and insurance is minimal so even if its not being used the cost to keep it for when its needed is worth while.



3k spent on an lq unit would bring the price/cost of the trailer to 10k, we will never get that out of it i know, but like mentioned above we never plan to sell it. if we do it is to get rid of a cost and then it doesnt really matter whats been done to it. the reasons for putting it in is to reduce the cost of going to a show. the next show she is going to is two weeks long and the hotel bill is going to be 1400. at 3k the trailer is paid for in a couple of shows. this show is the expensive one but even half that cost and 3 a year, the trailer pays off pretty quick. there are other expenses that go away too with the lq that make it worth while. i know life can change and who knows the future but she loves horses and wants to show so it is likely a life time sort of thing. that makes it a more interesting idea.



i know a 4ft short wall is tight, but it only needs to supply the basic needs for herself and possibly one other person, and 2 to 4 dogs. its tight but i think its doable.



as for weight, she has an 08 f-450, thats more than enough truck to tow it. my truck will even tow it. the trailer weighs about 7k, with 4 horses, lq, tack, and feed i think it would be about 20 to 22. which is well within the capabilities of her truck, and even within mine. i will be watching weight though, i want to try and keep it light. in all i think it will be worth while, but i am willing to hear differing opinions and the reasons. there may might be some things i have not considered.



so my plans, for the moment im thinking i want to run as much as i can off of propane. with a couple 20lb tanks and some conservation i think it would last long enough for a show.

 

[Mark31]

Mhannick, there is no way I'd spend money on a steel trailer. Keep forever? West coast forever must not be same thing as east coast forever. In just a few years, you will see rusty streaks, then paint blistering. Fixing rust and painting with good paint and sealer will damage Bill Gates' purse! If you don't fix it, you will be ashamed of it and not go. Consider telling Barry what you want and give him a little time to find something. There are people having tough times having to let some toys go. For what it's worth, I have a Gore 970 made in Whiteville, NC, 3 horse slant with a 1 piece fiberglass roof. You wouldn't believe how much cooler it is! Mark

 

[Mark31]

Mhannick, your completely stock ... ... ... ... ... ... . nearly reminded me off a recent "Pass Time" drag race show. A "nearly stock Camaro with just a little cam" turned the quarter mile in under 10 seconds! LOL Mark

 

[Barry]

Mark, California's climate is different than ours here on the east coast. Things just last a lot longer out there than they do here. But, IMHO, spending $3K on a used steel trailer to have a make shift(no offense intended) weekend package needs to have serious thought.



As I look at 100s of used horse trailers,(I am the outside wholesale buyer for the largest horse trailer dealer in the US) it amazes me how well good quality all aluminum trailers hold their value. I am having to pay 6K for Sooners that are back in the mid 90's.



In the day and age in which we live, a good quality all aluminum trailer is better than a CD in the bank while on the other hand, when someone calls me with a steel trailer to sell, I almost hang up.



Mr. Hannick, once again, please understand that I am not trying to offend you. And my opinion is just that... ... ... ... an opinion.

 

[BIGNASTY]

hot water

These things work really well for their size you can get them in propane also



Amazon.com: Bosch GL2. 5 Ariston 2-1/2-Gallon Point-of-Use Indoor Electric Mini-Tank Water Heater: Home Improvement

 

[Mhannink]

No offense guys, I love hearing inputs especially countering ones, keeps me looking at all parameters. As for the lq, we are holding off for the moment. For a lot of reasons.

As for it being make shift, I will grant you that really anything modifications done after a unit rolls off the assembly line is make shift (at least in my mind) however, I have been a mechanic for 5 years and am currently studying for an engineering degree, hopefully that means my make shift items are at least a little better than the norm. I do know that no matter how well I assemble the lq, it would hurt the value of the trailer, not help it. Which leads to the forever comment. Barry is right, out west we don't have the issues that make long term ownership a problem. With decent care, TLC, and maintainence vehicles can last 50+ years and still look great.

For the moment the project is on hold mainly cause my friend needs to determine the direction of her life first, if the lq will pay off in the foreseeable citrus then we will go ahead with it. I want to thank you guys for the help though it really is appreciated.

 

[CBari]

If you go with the build living quarters the one thing I didn't see you mention was a CO2 alarm. I know of several people who have drifted off to sleep and never wake up from the CO2 build up from the mr buddy heaters. I am like the others spending money on a steel horse trailer for anything just doesn't make sense. I have a 20year old aluminum sooner that has never seen a shed a in its life give it an acid bath and it looks new. The aluminum just hold there value to well compared to the steel trailers.



There are a lot of trailers back my way for sale because of the economy. Fuel is relatively cheap if you find exactly what you need for a good price.

 

[Mhannink]

cbari, i did think of that but much later after writing most of the posts. going to put a gas alarm too since most everything would be on propane.



all ya'll do have a different opinion on the east coast. i know the salt and snow really creates a problem, but out here steel horse trailers are just about as valueable. in fact many people prefer steel over aluminum because it lasts longer. before anyone says anything, out here on the west coast thats actually true because we dont have the rust issues. ive seen very old steel trailers that look good and the same age aluminum that were solid yes, but looked like crap because the aluminum is all bent up.



im not trying to argue with you guys, things are just different out here. steel holds value pretty well. i should also mention that buying a different trailer is not really practical, and i can work with steel, im not set up for aluminum.

 

[Deleted member 995608]

This is what I've been using for my hunt/camping trips and could be easily adaptable just about anywhere to anything.



We use it for showers, kitchen cleanup, washing hands,... . whatever.



I use a better quality hose with added T's and on/off valves to direct water to either the shower, sink, etc.



Zodi x40 shower Instant Portable Hot Showers and Propane Tent Heaters