Camper with ex.cab short bed ?

[clanders]

I was wondering if any of you have a short bed with a camper? And what lenghts they might be 7' or 8' , or if it is even a good idea? Any info would be greatly appreciated to help with my descision on what to buy.

 

[klenger]

I think that earthroamer.com would have the be the ultimate example.



Click here for picture

 

[Crazy Horse]

I assume you do have the camper package on your truck. You should take a look at Lance Campers, they make a few different models for your truck. You can also locate the nearest dealer. Here is a link: Lance Campers

Good Luck!

 

[clanders]

I do have the camper package, but I was wondering with it being a shorter wheel base if anyone was having swaying problems or had to upgrade the suspension . And I also found a lance dealer in the Salt lake area I'll give them a call Thanks.

 

[DocStressor]

I run an 8. 2 ft Lance 820 on a short 2500 with the extended cab. Check my mods. It handles fine with the mods I have listed in my sig. The camper weighs 2800 lb dry and I won't list my actual working weight. Lets just say it's a bit over 8800. In my opinion, the airbags, adjustable Ranchos, and stabilizers are all necessary for a safe ride.

 

[Crazy Horse]

Lee- That 2800 lbs is a wee bit on the heavy side. Here are some Lance specs. Lance Specs

 

[DocStressor]

CH-- That's the weight from a certified scales after subtracting the real weight of the unloaded truck. Take Lance’s listed weights with a large grain of salt. Once you add the trim and cold weather packages, solar panels, and a little basic equipment, that's what you get. If they listed the actual weight of these monsters, nobody would ever consider putting them on a 3/4 ton truck. But a 2500 short bed hauls the load fine once you make a couple of modifications. Improving the brakes will be my next project. The Earth Roamer article in TDR has a discussion of why a 2500 Dodge is a closet 1-ton. My rear axle weight is only 6,000 lb with the airbags adjusted properly. That's just shy of the limit for the E rated tires. But I sure hope I never have an acident where I need to deal with the insurance company over weight issues.

 

[clanders]

Lee what size tires do you run for the E rating 265/75 r16? And I'm also familiar with the air bag set up, between the frame and the leafs, but what do you guys think of putting an extra leaf spring or two in the overload spring stack instead of the air bag set up?

 

[Crazy Horse]

Quote: "That's the weight from a certified scales after subtracting the real weight of the unloaded truck. "



"Real Weight-Unloaded Truck" = Fuzzy Math.



The way I figured my weight is; my dually weighed 7001 lbs (dry shipping weight). I scaled my truck at a certified Cat Scale and the axle weight was 11,620 lbs. without the wife and dogs(150 + 150 lbs). Deduct the shipping weight (7001) and my scaled payload (cargo weight) is at 4,619 lbs. That's the wet weight due to the fact that the fresh water holding tank was full and fuel tank was full.



A more accurate way for you (Dry Weight) to do it would be:



#1- Fill fuel tank in truck, load camper in the bed-without the propane bottles and holding tanks empty.



#2- Weigh truck and camper. Scale Ticket.



#3- Deduct weight of fuel (8 lbs/ Gal?). Deduct your weight. Deduct the weight of anything in the camper or on the truck that were not on them when they left the factory. (This will include all vehicle accessories (truck and camper), anything left in the camper or the truck. ) Examples of added weight will be items such as the 50-60 lb bed mat under your camper, Grill Guard, Happyjack tie down system, etc etc.



#4- Deduct the shipping weight of your truck. Every truck goes to the dealer with a true shipping weight ticket, and your dealer can supply you with a copy.



After doing this you will get fairly close to your camper's true "Dry Weight". I also think you'll be surprized how close Lance's Specs really are.

 

[DocStressor]

Crazy Horse -- I beg to differ. My method makes no assumptions. I weighed the truck with myself, wife, and dog. No tail gate. Fuel tank essentially full. "Actual weight" 7,450 lb. Went home and loaded the camper. 1 gallon of antifreeze in the water system. 2 propane tanks aboard, but nearly empty. No gear except for electric jacks, solar panel, microwave, 3 way fridge, trim and cold weather packages. No TV, stereo, or generator. "Actual weight" of the rig was 10,240 lb. Subtraction is not fuzzy math. With the air bags holding 50 lb of air, the rear axle weight was ~6500 lb. At 70 lb of air in the bags, the weight on the rear axle was ~6000 lb. And that is how I drive the rig.



Now the reason I didn't initially want to post the weights is because I’d have to admit that the rig is 1,440 lb over the max. GVWR of 8800 lb. DRY! The rig hauls fine with an estimated working weight of 11,000 lb. But I am breaking the law. Now the real question is how a Lance dealer can sell an 820 to a customer with an extended cab 4X4 when even your own data acknowledges a dry weight of 2400 lb. The sticker on mine says 2840 wet and my dealer had no qualms about adding the additional gear. And they insisted that a 2500 would carry the load with no problem as long as I had air bags. However, he would not sell me the camper without installed air bags. They didn't care if someone else put them in.



When I drove out of the dealer's lot with 40 lb of air in the bags, I found that I could not drive the rig in a straight line at anything over 50 mph. Pumping up the bags to >60 lb eliminated this problem but not the side to side sway. The Ranchos took care of the sway problem with the rear shocks set at #5. The extended cabover flexed visibly when driving on certain types of road surfaces and caused the truck to rock front to rear. The stabilizers fixed that problem and I am very happy with the way the rig has handled for the past 3 years.



IMO, you need air bags with the short bed and a heavy camper. Adding heavy springs should stop the sway problem, but the real issue is the relative weight distribution between the front and rear axles. Unless the center of gravity is shifted forward by raising the camper sufficiently using the air bags, the rig is dangerous and should not be driven. Now all of this discussion refers specifically to short wheel base 2500 trucks hauling heavy campers. I have a friend with a LWB 2500 who hauls a camper nearly as heavy as mine without air bags. He did install special helper springs, however.



So there's my 2 cents. One of these days a Lance or Bigfoot dealer is going to become involved in a law suit over selling campers that put 3/4 ton trucks significantly over their GVWR. I just hope I am not involved. I feel that Lance makes a first rate product and I am very happy with my 820.



BTW Crazy Horse, you have a really nice web site! Are you the Lance dealer in Anchorage? I get up that way pretty often.



clanders -- I run the stock Michelin 245/75/16s that came on the '99s. They wear like rocks even with my overloaded condition. I run 88 psi in the rear since I live at 5400 ft. This turns out to be 80 psi at sea level.

 

[Crazy Horse]

Lee, I am not the Lance Dealer in Anchorage. I do work for an RV dealer here and sell RVs and campers. I also really like the Lance product. I bought my Lance 9' 10" Squire 5000 in 1998. My wet weight posted on the sticker was 2550. I've had it on four different trucks. The first truck was a 97 F-350 and it was spooky driving the truck with the camper on it. The airbag installation helped but the tires were the weak point. That was before I got into my 99 v-10 reg cab 3500. When I went to the dually there was a night and day difference between it and the Ford. I do have to say I only weighed mine once, last year, loaded in South Carolina, as I said earlier. It was on my 2000 3500 quad cab cummins. I don't know how yours can have a wet weight of 2840 lbs. I saw a 9' 6" 920 Lance simularly equiped to yours on our lot today with the wet weight posted on the tag of 2660 lbs. Also, the advice I give to people when they are shopping for a camper is, go by the posted wet weights on the campers and stay under the GVW rating of the truck. I do tell them of my past experiences and the necessity of the proper support equipment. We will not over gross a vehicle due to the possible legal ramifications. If you have been up here you do know how our roads are, being very uneven and full of frost-heaves and allot of them aren't even paved. Under tose conditions it's imparitive to have a well matched truck/camper setup with the proper support equipment. And if you do the springs right you will transfer the weight to the front as you do with the airbags. I pulled my factory "camper springs out on my 2000 3500 and replaced them with a four spring pack from my local spring shop. I didn't want to go the airbag route. They rated the spring pack at 3,500 all by themselves. See the clip attached on my weght transfer to the front axle. If you are ever up here look me up. Email when you are coming.

 

[DocStressor]

Yes, I think the take home message all around is that if you want to haul a heavy camper, get a 1-ton dually. I got the short bed thinking that I could go off highway a bit. Turns out that I did >$5,000 damage to the camper the first trip into the boonies. Nevada and Alaska have similar "roads?". I crossed a creek bed and clipped a corner of the rear overhang on a rock climbing out the other side. Now I stick to highways and graded gravel roads that a dually could easily handle. Anyone seriously considering hauling a camper off road should consider a light weight pop up type with no overhang.

 

[IdaH.O.Train]

The Cold Reality

I have been researching several different makes and models of campers to replace my TT. In doing so, I made a disappointing discovery. Below are the posted dry weights for the following manufacturers' lightest campers:



Lance Lite 815: 1,667



Bigfoot 15C8. 2: 1,560



Fleetwood Angler 8C: 1,600



Alpenlite LX850: 1,781



S&S 7. 5T: 1,895



Summerwind 805: 1,724



The above listed campers are entry level units with very little in the way of options. Going by these figures, I would not be able to haul any of them with the set up I have. Well maybe if I didn't put any fuel or passengers in my rig and didn't pack any supplies in the camper. Unfortunately, one of the selling points I proposed to my wife to get rid of my short bed V-10, was that with the long bed we would have more options when it came to buying a camper. :{ Now if I tell her there's no legal way to do it I'm toast :-{}.



My conclusion is this: If you have a 3/4 ton truck, and want to haul a slide-in, unless you have a standard cab, 2wd, 5sp, there is basically no way you can put a decently equipped camper on your truck and still stay legal.



This is my opinion, anyway.

 

[DocStressor]

My point exactly. But the trucks can haul the big campers just fine with a few mods. It's just not legal.