"Cummins Is An International Engine"

[crobertson1]

I was talking to a friend who has a Powerstroke Ford and we were talking smack to each other about our trucks. He says my '04. 5 sounds like a "tractor". Then he said the the Dodges were "cornbinders". I said "no, you're thinking of the Internationals" (as in International Harvesters). I then told him that Cummins is Cummins, not a part of any other company. He went on to tell me that he meant Dodges because the "Cummins was designed by International" and that "they're International engines". I was dumbfounded. But not wanting to argue, I just let it go. Pretty funny huh?

 

[HRDROKN]

That is funny... . because as we all know Ford owns Cummins! :-laf

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Actually the B series cummins was designed for Case backhoes and other equipement.

 

[nickleinonen]

the b series engine was a cummins and case joint venture...



the result was CDC [consolidated diesel corporation]

 

[trainhorndodge]

I hope that was a joke because Ford DOES NOT own Cummins.

 

[Nate]

Your right. Ford owns Cummings

 

[JUeckert]

actually there was a thread in the cummins conversion section about two weeks ago,where a guy showed a picture of a 5. 9 cummins engine that was casted by international[the block]. heard a rumor the latest produced 6. 5 engines were casted by international also. both were suprises to me,and i havent got a clue were to chk for either being factual.

 

[Signal73]

Kinda funny everyone says teh blocks with the international casting mark is the best one to go with when bombing...

 

[mrsnow]

I have been wondering about this for awhile now. The company I used to work for had a CASE 850G dozer with what I'd swear was a 12 valve in it but, there was International logo on the intake manifold.



BTW, I ran that dozer on and off for 6 years and that engine was absolutly bullet proof.

 

[Signal73]

Furthermore, FWIW, My truck at work is a Detroit Diesel, And the block and head have Intl' castings on them, with DD electronics...

 

[nickleinonen]

Furthermore, FWIW, My truck at work is a Detroit Diesel, And the block and head have Intl' castings on them, with DD electronics...

the gm/emd engines i work on with electronics on them, have ddec3 and ddec4 ecm's bolted to the engine [2x one for each 8 cylinders]

actually there was a thread in the cummins conversion section about two weeks ago,where a guy showed a picture of a 5. 9 cummins engine that was casted by international[the block]. heard a rumor the latest produced 6. 5 engines were casted by international also. both were suprises to me,and i havent got a clue were to chk for either being factual.

yep. international has done casting for the B series block and for the gm 6. 5 blocks. . i found that odd too, but apparently both are one of the best castings for those engines

 

[fkovalski]

... . "they're International engines". ...

They are absolutly International... . they are used worldwide!

 

[crobertson1]

They are absolutly International... . they are used worldwide!

Maybe that's what he meant!



So after reading all the above replies, he could be right technically huh?

 

[CumminsBu]

It funny when the Ferd boys start talking, I hear it all the time from my brother also. Your right Cummins are found globally in Boat, Ship, Farm equipment, Generator, Semi trucks and yes even the great Dodge truck. I always tell the Ferd guys when they start talking their smack.

Isn't the Powerstoke still in there testing faze, because if they are the best diesel engine on the plant, how come we don't find them in anything but Ford F and E series trucks, must not be reliable for anything else. We all know how well the Powerstoke 6. 0L came out.



When they pull up at work you tell them Man what is that the sound, It sounds like your engine has marble rolling around in the head, Oh yea that’s your injectors, Its hard to tell because it didn't sound like my farm tractor I drove to work.



Just remember He didn't dis our trucks because he said it sounds like a tractor because it pull like one too, that’s what real work trucks do, your International Harvesters Powerstoke Ford was design for a One Ton Grocery Getter. Hey Ford boy I think I need a cup of Sugar

 

[JJuday]

The B and C series engines were around before the Case/Cummins CDC joint venture. The Case backhoes didn't get the 3. 9 until the E series in the late 80's. Same goes for the dozers, not sure of the series designation. For example the 850's of the late 80's had 5. 9 N. A. engines. In the farm industry, the first C. IH tractors to get the CDC motors were the Magnums of the late 80's. As a matter of fact the earliest tractors to my knowledge, and to what I have read on www.tractordata.com is that the Hundred series Whites were the first ones to get the B and C series engines, that was 1987. I think the early Magnums were 1989.



Even in a joint venture I doubt Cummins would just give an engine to any customer, let alone design one or more specific engines for any one user. That would involve alot of paperwork and fine print. And let's face it... . There is no profit in it!!!! My point is the B and C series engines were built by Cummins for Cummins, end of story.

 

[JUeckert]

the b,c series engines were first used in case products back in 1986[memory serves]with the begining of the e series case backhoe,and d series dozers. the aqreement for case to purchase the b,c series goes back to 1980[during development]. the b series actually went into production in 1983. cummins ,cat and detroit are in the buisness to sell engines. everyone remembers when detroit diesel was likely the most common engine to be found in various machinery,when the 2 stroke saw the introduction of tighter emmssions,it was the end of the line for them,and an open door for cummins. producers like mack,international,john deere and some others seldom sell there engines to manufactors,especially in the automotive market. designing, production, aswell as intended sales of the b series engines originated from agreement of case and cummins. in other words if cummins couldnt line up enough buyers for the b series,it would not see production. clear as mud?

 

[JJuday]

Yes, you have have me tracking like a TOW on an Iraqi tank. What I meant was the B and C series engines weren't designed for any one manufacturer in general. Just so happens Case IH bought a big enough share of the engines to go into a long term sales and production agreement with Cummins in the form of the Consolidated Diesel Company. We all know that Navistar built the 7. 3 or the 444E in IH lingo, but no one says that that particular engine was built for Ford. Just so happens that Ford has bought a large share of their diesel engines from Navistar, the 7. 3/444E fit the Fords, but it was built with the idea of being used in many applications.



I haven't seen any Case equipment with Cummins engines built much before 1988. The D series backhoes lasted to about 1987 or so and they had J. I. Case motors. Oh, and don't confuse the J. I. Case built 504 c. i. diesel with the Cummins 505/8. 3L. , they are not the same engine, Case 504 had segmented heads and very deep skirted block that was used insted of a frame rail to tie the front of the tractor to the belt line.



Anyway, my guess is that the engines have been around since the very late 70's in product evaluations in various applications. Makes no sense to build just for one perticular manufacturer and a few lines of equipment. Theres no money in it. Espically considering the shape of the AG and industrial markets in the early 80's. I'm sure they were designed for more in mind than just Case IH. Sorry for the monster reply.

 

[JUeckert]

no confusing the 504 case with the 505 cummins to a trained eye. dam shame the 504 [and most other case engines] were replaced by cummins models in my book. i have never had a case engine that didnt take a lot of abuse and still live a long life. had a 880case trackhoe with the 504,swear it had what seamed like a million hrs on it when i sold it,engine never was opened up. same goes for my dozer and three backoes,the engines just wont die!

 

[JJuday]

True, the older 580's I have looked at all had great running 4 cylinders. Seems like about 230 C. I. range or so, too bad the same couldn't be said about the rest of the hoes I looked at, most were beat and welded back to some sembelence of a boom.

Minneapolis-Moline had 504-6 diesels too, most though didn't top 1800 r. p. m. They were in the 706, 707, and G-1000's, but most never climbed over 130 pto. hp. except for the G-1000 Vistas. Minnie Moe loved the displacement.