Death Wobble in laymans terms

[FullSack]

Can somebody explain to me why the camber causes the "death wobble" in laymans terms? I'm not an engineer or mechanic, so all the jargon and big words really confuse me.



And is everybody in agreement that fixing the camber resolves the "death wobble" issue



I'm running a 2" level kit and BFG 315's. I put in the lift about 18 months ago and had no problems. Had my first DW experience 3 months ago and then 3 more times in the last week.

 

[Nate]

Caster and toe in

 

[JDerbedrossian]

Can somebody explain to me why the camber causes the "death wobble" in laymans terms? I'm not an engineer or mechanic, so all the jargon and big words really confuse me.



And is everybody in agreement that fixing the camber resolves the "death wobble" issue



I'm running a 2" level kit and BFG 315's. I put in the lift about 18 months ago and had no problems. Had my first DW experience 3 months ago and then 3 more times in the last week.

FullSack since your in costa mesa take it to VODIES wheel alignment in garden grove(714)537-6347. if they cant fix it you got problems. been driving my truck for three years without one hiccup after lift and alignment by these guys.



p. s. its first come first serve there so try and get there very early



jake.

 

[JCleary]

Caster angle is the main problem with death wobble. If you run a line through the upper and lower ball joints, it should cant back towards the rear of the truck, similar to rake on a motorcycle.



If your caster is like this: l

your going to have major problems.



If your caster is like this: /

you're going to track straight and not have problems.



Thats assuming, of course, that your ball joints, steering linkage, and shocks aren't worn out. They all contribute. Same with underinflated tires. Basically you want to max out the camber if you've lifted the truck and are experiencing DW.

 

[rbattelle]

And is everybody in agreement that fixing the camber resolves the "death wobble" issue

I would say emphatically NO.



Stories like this are why I have decided not even to put a leveling kit on.



-Ryan

 

[Nate]

Why?



I have a leveling kit on my truck, wasn't aligned even and it's been ok... other than tires wearing a bit.



I run 7" of lift on my Jeep, with bascially the same front end setup as the truck, no death wobble.



If the steering parts are good, and the caster and toe in are in spec, you'll be all set.

 

[bmoeller]

http://www.emotoman.com/videos/dw.mpg

 

[JCleary]

Remember guys, it's caster, not camber.



Camber is only adjustable on IFS trucks, or with special ball joints on a solid axle truck.

 

[tgbol]

The death wobble is most often caused by 0 or + camber. A negative camber (the top joint is behind the spindle centerline) makes the truck track straight, the more - camber the more it will want to go straight. the less it is easier to steer(turn), the secret is to find the happy medium. The death wobble will start when to little camber and something hits the wheel knocking it off of its line. On the real high speed cars such Bonneville car 15 degrees are common. It seems that 1 to 1. 5 degrees more will help your trucks. The lift kit will cause the front end to lose some of the camber when it is lifted. simply dialing in a little camber usually will fix the problem.





Caution: Due to my confusion I have the +'s and -'s mixed in this post. It is a ***** to get old.

 

[AndyMan]

An "Excellent" alignment shop that will work with you is FAR more important than walking in somewhere and demanding caster adjustment.

I had my leveling kit for over a year before DW surfaced. Three trips to the alignment shop yeilded 4 degrees of negative caster and no more DW. ALL steering components were verified within spec by two different shops...

 

[FullSack]

Thanks for the tips guys, I'm going to get the CASTER checked out. I've now read anywhere from 4 to 7 degrees of negative caster. Any advice on this one?

 

[MBreyer]

I had been told to go for positive caster, but then I've got a 2nd gen truck.

Any diferance?





~Matt

 

[JBlock]

i like your explantion, it really helps me understand why one need to keep the wheel centered after it lifted

 

[AndyMan]

Thanks for the tips guys, I'm going to get the CASTER checked out. I've now read anywhere from 4 to 7 degrees of negative caster. Any advice on this one?

You might want to re-read some posts. Most people have better luck with excessive POSITIVE caster. My negative caster fix really makes everyone (including me) scratch their heads... .

That's why I say find a GOOD... I mean REALLY good alignment shop that will work with you. There's no simple 1+2=3 fix for death wobble. It could be a large number of things causing the problem. It's most likely going to take some serious troubleshooting, and probably some trial and error.

 

[tgbol]

Matt

You need to hit over the head with a 2x4. I got my +'s & -'s mixed up. When the upper ball joint is behind the centerline it is POSITIVE (does that sound better Andy-man?) SORRY about the confusion. Full Sack 4 to 7 POSITIVE would be right probably +5 would be great.

Sorry again

 

[AndyMan]

No worries tgbol !! I just wanted to make sure that he re-read everything and had his facts straight before he headed off to "slay the beast".

Before going to a good alignment shop, I tried all kinds of crap. I tried ALL kinds of Caster adjustment. Full positive, Full negative, everywhere in between. I could still induce Death Wobble at will.

FullSack, you can do some caster adjustments in your driveway and see how it works for you... but I still say a good alignment shop is where you'll find your solution.

Best of luck!

 

[FullSack]

One of the best alignment shops in my area is right across the street from my place (Glenn's Alignment in Costa Mesa). I think I'll take it over in the morning.

 

[MBreyer]

I ain't got a 2b4 that can reach coast-to-coast! LOL

Positive caster is what I had heard. I purchased a 3 year unlimited alignment package from NTB (Tire America). They give me dirty looks 'cause I'm back every month or so.

Hey, till it's all figgured out, I'll keep going back. Bummer is, they can't get more than 3. 2 on one side & 3. 7 on the other.



Never had DW before I rotated my tires (1st time, bout 7k on them).

The truck will be in the shop w/ my regular mechanic this wed. for another issue, & I'll have him look over the front end, he's better than me & might notice if something is out of spec.



It's a wierd beast, this Death Wobble. Also strange that it still exists on you guy's fancy 3G's.



Ah, well. I'm off my soap box now.



~Matt

 

[FullSack]

bit the bullet and removed the leveling kit last night. Took it to the alignment shop this morning and owner said it's the best move to make. Dealer will be replacing the steering stabilizer with my warranty.

 

[MBreyer]

Somehow I can't bring myself to remove that spacer. The only way I'd pull it is if I was swapping in new front springs.



I like my truck sitting level.







~Matt