Death Wobble Still Not Fixed 100%

[1965LONEWOLF]

DID THE TSB AT THE DEALERSHIP , NO CHARGE - THAT WAS GOOD BECAUSE I HAVE A LEVELING KIT AND 35" TIRES AND THEY NEVER SAID A WORD -

ITS ALOT BETTER BUT STILL DOES IT ONCE IN AWHILE IF YOU HIT THE RIGHT BUMP AT THE RIGHT ANGLE , NEVER NEVER DID IT TILL I HIT 55000 MILES - WISH I COULD GET RID OF IT ALL TOGETHER - THINKING ABOUT GOING TO A DUEL STABLELIZING KIT -

 

[cerberusiam]

Loose the BFG's, loose the death wobble.

 

[1965LONEWOLF]

I Have About 15,000 Miles On Them And It Just Started - So Why The Bfg's ? I Really Don't Want To Spend A $ 1000. 00 On New Tires And Find Out It Still Does It - I Don't Know Or Have Anyone Close To Me To Try Another Set Of 35" Tires Either

 

[cArNiVaLwOrKeR]

Keep it stock, I wish I had never did anything to my truck, its all Money thats BURNED and that I will never recover



Joe

 

[TCluff]

its not 100 percent of the tire

 

[TCluff]

I Have About 15,000 Miles On Them And It Just Started - So Why The Bfg's ? I Really Don't Want To Spend A $ 1000. 00 On New Tires And Find Out It Still Does It - I Don't Know Or Have Anyone Close To Me To Try Another Set Of 35" Tires Either

when you added the level lift, the drop pitman is still the stocker, the track bar drop bracket is in the stock location, and the control arms are not the correct length causing the front axle to be off center, this all plays in the effect of death wobble, even a good alignment shop wont get you the 100 percent, give top gun customz a call and they can set you up pretty cheap with the right length of control arms... .

 

[jelag]

There is a point on the ground... . that if you draw a line through the center of the tire, through the spindle to a point on the ground... . and another line through the center of the ball joints to the ground..... these two lines need to meet as a dot on the road surface for the geometry of the front suspension to work as it should... . as the vehicle turns these two spots move away from each other and as you turn straight they come back together... .

The angle of the ball joints is call king pin inclination from when trucks had king pins... . when you put larger tires and wheels, or like we did when we were kids, reverse wheels on cars you screw up this angle..... actually the line you move is the line through the center of the tire... . the farther away you get from the two dots hitting on the surface the worse the tire wear is... . and if you have an out of round tire, out of balance tire you add to the problem because the front end geometry is not right... .

So I guess that what I'm trying to say is as long as the geometry is out it will never be right... but better tires might help...

As an example smaller tires means that the dot is below the surface of the road and larger tires usually has the dot 2" off the road surface and the two lines making 2 dots on the road surface...

That said... the BFG's are a tire that doesn't have the quality control or maybe the right answer is tighter specifications needed to keep it from developing other problems as it ages... This could be a soft side wall, under inflation or many other issues... . The facts seem to show that BFG's tend to have more problems than others... . with our trucks... . But this is a compounded problem... the geometry and tire size together.....

I learned all this from a great old alignment man who used to run cars on the rack... . rub his hand across the face of the tires and make adjustments... . as he understood the angles of the geometry of the vehicles... . I wish I had listened more, because he truly gave me the opportunity to listen and learn... .

 

[cerberusiam]

I Have About 15,000 Miles On Them And It Just Started - So Why The Bfg's ? I Really Don't Want To Spend A $ 1000. 00 On New Tires And Find Out It Still Does It - I Don't Know Or Have Anyone Close To Me To Try Another Set Of 35" Tires Either

Not a good feeling when yopu have to spend that much for new tires but it can cost that much and more to fix it with parts.



When the leveling kit was put it was anything else done? Adjustable track bar, offset ball joints, control arms? If not, the caster has been reduced to the low side of spec and the axle is offset 1-1. 5 ". This is enough to induce DW with good tires. Add to that a tire that is NOT a good match for these trucks and you have what you have.



Have you had it aligned and what are the specs they set it to?



What TSB did the dealer do for you?



Since it just started, the wear on the steering parts has finally gotten to the point where it is an issue. The bigger the tire the faster the wear. Weather, tire wear, roads, etc, also affect it.



What will probably fix it is a steering stabilizer the stiffens the frame and steering box, adjustable track bar, adjustable control arms, and a dual steering shock system. Those items can easily run $1500 with installation.

Or you might get lucky and just align the axle and raise the castor at much less cost.



Tires MAY be a cheaper route.

 

[XXLTexan]

get 10 ply tires (e rated)... i cannot say they ride as well but when your suspension loosens up that wobble is more pronounced. I love BFG but in a 35 with a heavy front end of a 3/4 ton truck... they are not the best choice... get some TOYO's

 

[Parks]

I had the same problem. Rebuilt the entire front end and went back to stock tires and it was still there. After talking to Kore and DRC, it turned out to be the steering stabilizer. I was using a Rancho stabilizer and trashed it and went back to a Dodge stabilizer and it went away. According to Kore and DRC most stabilzers like Rancho and others are junk. The factory stabilzers are high quality and work great. Just a thought.

Brandon

 

[Tejasdge]

Try Cheap first!

Make sure your tires have at least 45 psi in the front. It makes it ride a little rougher but minimizes DW with BFG's. Also get the tires rebalanced and pay attention to how much and where the weights are. Either have the tire with a lot of weight Roadforce Balanced and/or move them to the back axle.



After 100k with BFG's, I can tell when DW wants to start through the feel in the steering wheel in corners and bumps. I get the up and down wheel hop if the tire is poorly balanced and/or underinflated. Getting rid of the worn out Rancho's has helped a bunch since 35's are a lot more tire than most OEM and replacement shocks can handle.



I think that that there are number of "modes" that can induce death wobble. as mentioned before, I have problems with the up and down bouncing with BFG's soft sidewalls and poor balancing. It is not as much that you loose control (if going straight) as it might cause the loss of bowel control until you slow down, as the traffic around you makes a plenty of space for you. It's pretty hard to miss a hopping Dodge Ram going down the highway at 70 mph. I also imagine balljoints, track bar and other front end components have thier own style of death wobble.



In the FWIW catagory, I have noticed that factory take off BFG's take less weight to balance vs tire store BFG's. Insert your own theory here, but mine is that the OEM folks get the pick of the litter (tire wise) and leave the rest for the tire stores.

 

[KevinO]

had same problem as you, put new ball joints, DSS steering bracket, Bilstein's all the way around, adjustable trac bar, 2 alignments and new single stabilizer still had DW. Dual Skyjacker stabilizer did the trick it was last thing before another new set of tires. Still have the BFG's on now.

 

[JDerbedrossian]

Loose the BFG's, loose the death wobble.

Not true. Try this set-up from Carli suspension.

 

[rbattelle]

That stabilizer setup from Carli looks pretty cleaver!

Ryan

 

[cArNiVaLwOrKeR]

Appears to be a Bilstein product...

 

[cerberusiam]

Not true. Try this set-up from Carli suspension.

Nice setup, and I am sure it does just what it was intended to.



Looks like you have more than a few non-stock suspension pieces in there, and you still had to add one more piece to keep things in check?



Yet, you simply do not hear of these problems with a Toyo or some other tires that have a heavy sidewall. I have personally seen and run 35's and 37's with only a dual opposed steering shock setup and making sure the caster is correct. Even 35" Toyos with caster at the very bottom of specs only require a good steering shock to make it happy, but its NOT the tires?



Strikes me as more addressing the symptoms than the cause, but its NOT the tires?



Riiiiggght! :-laf:-laf



Lessee, $2k worth of suspension mods added to a $40k 8000 lb truck and then put on a set of the cheapest most problematic tires there are???



I have only one question, WHY????



To each his own and all that rubbish, but, c'mon now!!! :-laf

 

[JDerbedrossian]

Nice setup, and I am sure it does just what it was intended to.

Looks like you have more than a few non-stock suspension pieces in there, and you still had to add one more piece to keep things in check?

Yet, you simply do not hear of these problems with a Toyo or some other tires that have a heavy sidewall. I have personally seen and run 35's and 37's with only a dual opposed steering shock setup and making sure the caster is correct. Even 35" Toyos with caster at the very bottom of specs only require a good steering shock to make it happy, but its NOT the tires?

Strikes me as more addressing the symptoms than the cause, but its NOT the tires?

Riiiiggght! :-laf:-laf

Lessee, $2k worth of suspension mods added to a $40k 8000 lb truck and then put on a set of the cheapest most problematic tires there are???

I have only one question, WHY????

To each his own and all that rubbish, but, c'mon now!!! :-laf

315/70/17's bfg at's, 2 inch level kit everything else STOCK about 5000 miles then 4 inch superlift w/stock stabilizer for 35,000 miles no death wobble, please explain why no death wobble?. Next 35,000 miles 3 inch lift 325/70/17's toyo at's still no wobble, now back on 37 inch bfg at's 2000 miles and guess what still no death wobble. I must be one lucky S. O. B cerberusiam.

Jake

 

[Baja_Mike]

Nice setup, and I am sure it does just what it was intended to.



Looks like you have more than a few non-stock suspension pieces in there, and you still had to add one more piece to keep things in check?



Yet, you simply do not hear of these problems with a Toyo or some other tires that have a heavy sidewall. I have personally seen and run 35's and 37's with only a dual opposed steering shock setup and making sure the caster is correct. Even 35" Toyos with caster at the very bottom of specs only require a good steering shock to make it happy, but its NOT the tires?



Strikes me as more addressing the symptoms than the cause, but its NOT the tires?



Riiiiggght! :-laf:-laf



Lessee, $2k worth of suspension mods added to a $40k 8000 lb truck and then put on a set of the cheapest most problematic tires there are???



I have only one question, WHY????



To each his own and all that rubbish, but, c'mon now!!! :-laf

You're right the BFG's have given a lot of customers problems. We've seen them come in with DW and we change out the tires to a Toyo and the problem goes away completely. I have seen a pair of Toyo's have a manufacturing defect and give DW as well. As soon as the customer rotated his tires the problem went away.



BFG's are the reason why we are working on our dual stabilizer setup. We currently offer the high mount kit but we are working on our lower stabiler clamp as well like you see on Jake's. We are developing the dual setup around BFG's Baja race tire which is a load range C and has a very flexible sidewall (helps soak up rough terrain almost like a second suspension system but this is why they are Kevlar reinforced). This tire gives DW right off the bat. But with our dual stabilizer system we have yet to see DW with over 6 months of testing and over 20,000 miles... .....

 

[cerberusiam]

315/70/17's bfg at's, 2 inch level kit everything else STOCK about 5000 miles then 4 inch superlift w/stock stabilizer for 35,000 miles no death wobble, please explain why no death wobble?.

Just guessing, but, truck had less miles and newer components? You would be the FIRST to tell me 34" BFG's, 4" lift, no steering corrections, and NO problems in 40k.

now back on 37 inch bfg at's 2000 miles and guess what still no death wobble.

Got a few more suspension mods in there also with, I am pretty sure, updated bushings and things nice and tight, right?

BFG's are the reason why we are working on our dual stabilizer setup

Yeah, I would say LUCKY is your middle name. :-laf :-laf



Looking at the number of posts on DW and seeing the BFG's as a real common denominator is pretty telling. Obviously they work for some but there a LOT of people they don't work for, and, when they don't work they REALLY don't work.



Once you got DW, it is impossible to get rid of with tires that are the source. Cover up, yes, but not get rid of it. The original poster was lamenting the low mileage and cost of the tires and my stance is it could cost more than a new set of tires to fix.

 

[Kry226]

I am really getting aggravated when every time someone who has DW, folks on these forums always point to BFGs as the only culprit. Selective memories forget that some of these trucks come from the factory completely stock (with E rated tires, by the way) with DW.

Can D rated BFGs cause, or be an exacerbating factor in DW? Yes.

Can other things besides BFG tires cause DW? Yes.

Is it ignorant to point the finger solely at BFGs as the cause for DW? Absolutely. Especially since the original poster said it started at 55K (cue: worn suspension parts, or leveling kit) and after he'd had the tires for 15K.

There's a whole host of components involved in the mix, and tires are just one part of the equation.

There are just too many guys running BFGs WITHOUT problems, me included. By the way, I am on my second set of BFG 315s and have over 50K driven on BFG 315s, KORE (coils, drop blocks, and bump stops) installed by me, stock steering stabilizer, heck, stock everything else save driver's axle u-joint.

I have never had the first hint of DW. You have to fix the PROBLEM, and it may or may not be the tires.