2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Did Bilstein/D25 install-- Did i screw it up? PLEEZE help me..

[Hohn]

Ok Fellas, today was H&LL, no doubt about it.



My Bilstein/D25 install only took about SEVEN hours. On top of that, the results i have are not what i expected. First, the install, and then I'll tell you why i think I screwerd up my truck.



I started by disconnecting the sway bar. I took the front wheels off. I couldn't get the axle low enough to get the springs out, so i removed the tie rod and steering damper. Then i see that the track bar is hitting the top of the bracket on the pasenger side, so i guess the trackbar has to come out too.

Lo and behold, the upper trailing arms are butting up against the bump stops. I guess I have to loosed the control arms too. At first i took out the bolts on the upper arms at the axle (didn't want to mess with caster bolts). Then i realized that wasn't such a good idea, so i decided to reinstall those bolts. i decided i should have removed the lower arm bolts at the frame. With those out, I managed to ge the old springs/shocks out.

It wasn't until i put a bottle jack in there that I could get the D25s into the perches. That little move put the lower arms at the frame WAY away from their proper alignment. Getting the bolts back in was a real pain.

The worst part by far was the #$%^& track bar! I stripped some of the end threads on the ball joint, so it wasn't until I got creative with the 13mmx1. 5 tap and die and a cutoff wheel that i was able to get it back together.

When I put everything back together, I just grabbed the 1/2" impact and tightened it all down.





I LOVE the look of the "leveling kit" but the feel of the truck now REALLY REALLY SCARES me. The steering feel is very numb, and the wheel is not centered (though i expected it to be off center since the track bar pulls the axle left).



The other part that REALLY REALLY scares me it that now the WHOLE TRUCK feels like it is vibrating in tune with the engine. Interior engine noise is a LOT higher. It feels like the engine is going to explode at any moment! When I shut it down, the noise is VERY loud, and the interior sounds like your seated in a main bearing!



How could all this come from just fiddling with the front end?? The only thing that's different are the shocks and springs, yet it feels like a whole different truck. Some of that is good (it DOES ride a little smoother). But if I would have known it would be like this I would NOT have touched it!



What things can i check? Did I overtighten the control arm bolts, track bar ends, or tie rod linkage? Did I ruin something by gently using a pickle fork on the track bar? Why is everything suddenly so loud on the interior?



Someone PLEASE help me. I am scared that i ruined my truck. i have had a day that would make a grown man cry. Murphy's in charge.....





Justin

 

[y-knot]

Hohn,

don't worry to much, I think it is repairable. When you took off the lower control arms, you changed the alinement. On the sides you will is an area that has index makes , the alinement guy changes the position of the front axle by moving a cam like device in the lower control arms. Also by taking off most of the steering control hardware the alinement (toe) settings are probaly out. The front spacers are a pain to install, but you managed to get them in. The bottle jack used to get the clearance worked, but probally also contributed to your alinement problem. Make yourself an appointment with a GOOD front end shop and most of your worries should go away. Usually the Bilsteins ride a little rougher, but handle better. I wouldn't use the truck to much till it has been alined, sounds like it is pretty far out, and it is very hard on the tires like that.

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Hohn,



Some people have reported a vibration in the 2002 trucks after lifting them due to not having the front axle disconnect. For anyone else putting in new springs when I did my springs (D25's also) I checked around at a few reputable garages and found one that would put them in, when I asked how much and he said $100, I said when can you do it. It was late in the year and I don't have a garage that the truck will fit in so the money was well worth not having the hassle. Then I went straight from that shop to the alignment shop. Been real happy with mine.

 

[2broke2smoke]

i will be doing the same when my tires wear out and would like to hear from others who are running the combo, did you make any changes from the stock aligment to compensate for the 2 inch higher lift? (or 2" lower from the original alignment), my truck rides and handles like a dream and i would reconsider the "lift" if it will negatively affect handling

 

[Got Smoke?]

My drivers side tire started wearing really badly on the inside after I installed my D25's. Then I started experienceing death wobble so I took it to the shop. They said replaced the track bar so I did (thank goodness for Moog lifetime warrenty) and then I went to test drive to see if it was going to need an alignment.



As soon as I pulled onto the highway the steering wheel was near verticle. So "YES" I had to have an alignment. My steering was out so bad that if you tried to straighten the wheel driving down the highway you'd go into a ditch.



I had "heard" that you didn't need to check alignment with the D25's, but I would strongly suggest that everybody that install's them have it done.



My toe was a great deal in causing my tires to wear, even though they are nearly shot I need a couple more weeks outta 'em.

 

[y-knot]

I had no negative effects after my spacer was installed. I don't think I would go with the "jack-it" package, I haven't heard to much good about it. One reason I went with the DAYSTAR poly spacer, is it helps isolate noise, and vibrations. I have had it installed for 4 years and have no complaints. On the shocks, I to went with the BILSTEIN's, but after a year or so, I developed a knock or clunk in the front end when ever a bump was hit. I looked forever to locate it, but it wasn't until I just recently took the front end apart that I found it. The drivers side top shock mount wore out. The rubber isolator had worn Thu, letting the metal piece inside smack the shock tower. The passenger side was almost worn Thu. Many people think they are getting BILSTEIN 5100 shocks, but they do not make them for our trucks. Most will buy the BE5-2549 for the fronts, they are the over 8400lb units. They are BILSTEIN's OEM replacement shocks. One good thing, when I took the old BILSTEIN's off, they were not leaking and still were a bear to compress, so they do last. I wish I had someone to give them to.

 

[Hohn]

Originally posted by y-knot

Hohn,

don't worry to much, I think it is repairable. When you took off the lower control arms, you changed the alinement. On the sides you will is an area that has index makes , the alinement guy changes the position of the front axle by moving a cam like device in the lower control arms. Also by taking off most of the steering control hardware the alinement (toe) settings are probaly out. The front spacers are a pain to install, but you managed to get them in. The bottle jack used to get the clearance worked, but probally also contributed to your alinement problem. Make yourself an appointment with a GOOD front end shop and most of your worries should go away. Usually the Bilsteins ride a little rougher, but handle better. I wouldn't use the truck to much till it has been alined, sounds like it is pretty far out, and it is very hard on the tires like that.

I never actually removed the lower control arms completely. I just took out the bolt at the frame and dropped the arms down. i didn't touch the alignment cams at the axle end.



I didn't use spacers to get the front end leveled. I used the D25 coils from Skyjacker.

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Hohn,



I can't explain the difference in noise because I didn't notice any difference, but it could be possible that with something mis-aligned a vibration could be traveling into your cab. The D25 coils or even a spacer will cause the front axle to be moved sideways a little bit. Of course that is a good reason to get a DT track bar to adjust it back. With the axle moving other things are naturally going to be off and most likely an alignment needed just like y-knot said

 

[Hohn]

Originally posted by Turbo Tim 1

Hohn,



Some people have reported a vibration in the 2002 trucks after lifting them due to not having the front axle disconnect. For anyone else putting in new springs when I did my springs (D25's also) I checked around at a few reputable garages and found one that would put them in, when I asked how much and he said $100, I said when can you do it. It was late in the year and I don't have a garage that the truck will fit in so the money was well worth not having the hassle. Then I went straight from that shop to the alignment shop. Been real happy with mine.

TT:

The vibration i am experiencing is from the engine, not the trans or driveline. I know this because not only is it linked to engine RPM, but it makes the noise worst when i am just idling at rest. Since the front axle isn't turning then, I know that can't be the source of vibration.



What I find VERY interesting is that if i make a right turn and load the track bar in tension, the noise goes away, and it's just normal engine sound. When I make a left turn (ands the trackbar is loaded in compression) the noise is still there. .



Is it possible that my track bar just isn't tight enough at the frame? What is the torque spec for the castle nut? Right now, the track bar is my #1 suspect, since i ruined the end taking it out (I should have known better than to hammer even once on the threads!)



The noise is basically just normal engine vibration, but it is reverberating (and seemingly amplified) through the whole front end. You can really feel it in the steering wheel and shifter.



I think I forgot to tighten the upper swaybar links, so i am going to check that today. I don't see how this could be the cause of all the noise.



Interestingly enough, my truck doesn't pull left or right, but the steering wheel is slighly off center.



Does Moog make a track bar for our trucks?? It might be a more cost-effective option than going with the DT. How much is an OEM bar? How about the Moog? I am not afraid to drop the $$ for the DT, but would prefer not to at this point.



Justin

 

[jrobinson2]

On a "Y" type tie rod setup any lift will change toe in and steering wheel center by increasing the angle from the steering box to the outer tie rod ends, this can cause the strange steering feel you described.

As to the engine noise, it sounds like something may be touching the engine? I hope I'm not insulting someone but did you jack against the oil pan or balancer and bend something?

Jared

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Moog makes a track bar for our trucks and you can get one at Napa but it is like the stock one and will still leave the front axle off center.

 

[Got Smoke?]

Originally posted by Turbo Tim 1

Moog makes a track bar for our trucks and you can get one at Napa but it is like the stock one and will still leave the front axle off center.

Part # DS1413 lifetime warrenty near 40K on my first one, just replaced this week thank goodness for that warrenty.



P. S. if you have an advance check there its cheaper.

 

[Hohn]

Well, I figured out what the problem was (I think). I had my wife turn the wheels left and right while I looked underneath.



I had a mere 3/8" of play in the track bar ball joint!!! Personally, I think this is because I couldn't tighten the castle nut enough (wimpy 1/2" snap-On impact gun).



Anyway, my track bar time has come. In looking over my different options for a long-term solution, I think that the DT is going to be my best option.



Why the DT? Well, I think the weak link in the track bar design is the ball joint. Especially since the ball joint is oriented close to vertical, ensuring that the vertical travel of the axle will wear the ball joint to the maximum. I looked at the luke's link, but I think that is better for tie rods than for the track bar.



The DT allows the wear surface at the framte to be oriented properly (longitudinally, like the 3rd gen trucks), and it's a Heim joint to boot. With the D25s, I need a wee bit more length in the track bar, too.



Plus, I can rebuild the track bar end by just buying a new track bar ends-- MUCH cheaper than a whole new bar.



Now to see if I can get a hold of DT to get it in the mail...



Justin

 

[Got Smoke?]

Originally posted by Hohn





Why the DT? Well, I think the weak link in the track bar design is the ball joint. Especially since the ball joint is oriented close to vertical, ensuring that the vertical travel of the axle will wear the ball joint to the maximum. I looked at the luke's link, but I think that is better for tie rods than for the track bar.



The DT allows the wear surface at the framte to be oriented properly (longitudinally, like the 3rd gen trucks), and it's a Heim joint to boot. With the D25s, I need a wee bit more length in the track bar, too.



Plus, I can rebuild the track bar end by just buying a new track bar ends-- MUCH cheaper than a whole new bar.



Now to see if I can get a hold of DT to get it in the mail...



Justin

If you have the $$$ then I'd suggest the DT, if not then get the Moog Lifetime warrenty track bar part #DS1413 from Advance, Auto Zone, Napa, etc. Mine let it be known it needed replacement after I installed my D25's. Well I figured that it would be a #@$%! to do with the D25's in there so I got the warrenty replacement and took it to have it done. Watched the guy install it and it took all of 5 mniutes! :--)



Its just slid right into place. Boy was I **$$**!! Oh well. If you've got the $300 for the DT get it, I didn't.

 

[KOdegaard]

I fab a spacer that fits under the spring(4x4) and levels

the truck (about 1. 5"). If you had no trouble before

than this will not have any adverse affect. It is well

with in the limits of the factory settings. If interested

you can email me, It really is pretty slick.

Kirk