Archived Did the truck blow up? Help

[Greg Boardman-RIP]

truck history:

1999 quad cab 5 speed with 50,000 miles on it.



Today I got a call from a friend of mine at 6 am. He had broken down in the middle of the hwy and need help getting home. He said he was running at 2400 rpm's and the truck stumbled real bad but just once and a second later it died. the front dif is covered with motor oil. It wont run at all.



First question: has the same thing ever happened to any of you?

Second question: Can he take it to Cummins under the warranty or will Dodge have to handle it. The stealer up here sucks. Not a diesel mechanic in the lot of them.



We need to know what to do. Truck is sitting dead in my yard. On Monday we will be taking it to a repair shop

 

[SOOT]

That sucks

I would say it is a Cummins problem Yes it sounds like the engine is toast:{ Unless, I think the 24V's have an oil level sensor, if it does then it might see that there is no oil and will not turn on the fuel.



Someone will correct me if I am wrong:-{}

 

[Pit Bull]

You will have to take it to the Dodge dealer, they can only authorize warranty work. Now if it is a big job and they don't have the personal to do the work they can get the authority to send it to the Cummins shop to have the work done. Any problem should be covered under the 5 year 100K mile warranty. Good luck.

 

[Greg Boardman-RIP]

UPDATE

Stealer said that the VP 44 drive chain is bad. Does anyone know what causes this?

 

[OO]

It's gear driven.

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

KDP



Bob

 

[Extreme1]

KDP Strikes AGAIN!!!

Gee, do you think Cummins will start to realize they have a problem yet?



On a side note: I'd by pretty upset if the "technician" determined a bad "chain". Try to get it fixed somewhere else.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Re: UPDATE

Originally posted by Greg Boardman

Stealer said that the VP 44 drive chain is bad. Does anyone know what causes this?

There's a 7" 'chain' with lots of teeth on it that looks suspiciously like a steel gear!!! one just like it on the cam and a smaller one on the crank.



everything in the CTD is gear driven. NO CHAINS. don't you just love 'certified' technicians

 

[MidwestMotorman]

I have heard of some early 24Vs have the "killer dowel pin". Do you happen to know the build date from the drivers door? Mine is a 99 too, built in Jan 99.



VP44 chain??? Obviously none of them have any knowledge on Cummins diesels. A fried VP44 won't leave oil all under the front. That sounds like the KDP though.



The truck won't run or won't crank? Obviously neither is good.



Good luck and keep us in the loop.

 

[DEZLPWR]

Me thinks the dealer is full of poop!!

 

[illflem]

Sounds like the worst possible case of a KDP failure where it went in-between the gears before getting spit though the case. $3-4k to fix because the camshaft/gears are likely damaged. A timing chain breaking can cause similar damage, the dealer tech's diagnosis was good except he doesn't know Cummins engines.



Though the problem may lie elsewhere let this serve as warning that early model 24 valves and all 12 valves are known to have this potential problem. Click here for prevention

 

[Greg Boardman-RIP]

Illflem,

What makes you think it is the KDP? I thought it was only on undervalved trucks? How do you tell a tech about it?



Thanks, Greg

 

[MidwestMotorman]

the KDP

The tech will see a busted or cracked front timing gear cover. If you look under the front plate, the damage will be apparent. If the search is working, look up "KDP" for info and pics, and there is lots of info in the 12V section.



KDPs can crack the front cover without ruining the engine. Then a lot of oil leaks out the front and gets everywhere. Being there is lots of engine oil up there, the KDP is suspect. Otherwise some other internal come apart or broke, unless the oil was there already.

 

[Alan Reagan]

I thought the dowel was only on the P700 pumps.

 

[illflem]

What keeps the dowel pin from coming out on 24 valves is an improved gear case that contains the pin. This case was introduced in early '98 but Cummins continued to use the old style case till their stocks ran out sometime in '99. It's just luck of the draw what your early 24 valve may have. All 5. 9s have the dowel pin.

 

[MidwestMotorman]

Is there a way to tell the difference between the two cases by looking at the engine? Some casting mark, stamping, or visual design?

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I opened up an early 24V that HVAC had and I found no dowel pins.



there are keys on the VP44 and Cam but no pins.



where is it and what does it look like??

 

[Alan Reagan]

Is it the dowel pin that is used to find TDC that used to be under the P700 pump. My understanding is that is no longer there.

 

[Joe G.]

Alan,



That's the timing pin that is no longer there. Dowell pins are used to locate the gear case exactly. The KDP is in a bored thru hole in the gear case casting instead of a blind hole like the other dowell pins. The crack the leaks all that oil if the KDP fails is hidden by the water or idler pulley (bad case of CRS here). The newer gear case has a stepped hole to retain the KDP. From what illflem says there are some early 24 valve engines that still have the older gear case. LOT'S of work to replace the case.

 

[MidwestMotorman]

KDP

Those that thirst for knowledge, use this link as some help:



http://www.flex.net/~triplem/new/dowelpin.htm



Hopefully you can at least cut and past this if the link is not underlined.



BTW, there are at least 213 threads on the KDP from three months ago and older. I read it all once last fall, and am refreshing myself again.