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Diesels In Hell 4x4 Test Drive

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Torque Converters

Colone DC had to buy trucks...

This is an insert to the many stories that will be told about our visit to Hell. I am starting with this story because it happened close to the end of the rally and is still fresh in my mind (not that I will be able to forget it).

We were shuttled to the far north end of the DC proving grounds by several Dodge Vans (what'd you think they would use, Fords?) to the 4x4 off road course for a little fun in the mud. This event was extremely popular and there were two lines, each about an hour wait time. DC had four Dakota automatics and two Cummins Ram 6 speeds running the course. Each vehicle was monitored by what looked like engineering students (when I say monitored, I mean that they rode shot-gun to tell us what we couldn't do with the trucks. hehehe).

When I saw the length of the lines I decided that it wasn't important for me to drive one, as long as I got to feel my head banging against the roof in an old fashioned 4x4 ride. So I accepted am invitation from Markcuda and ride with him, his wife and daughter. Everything was fine when we piled into the Cummins Ram, until we all realized that Markcuda had never driven a stick shift. He reached down and pulled the lever for the emergency brake, but whoa that was the hood release!

Markcuda figured he was ready to roll and dumped the clutch, chugging out of the pit area narrowly missing the tech student who was trying to close the hood for us. Down the first hill he chugged in 1st low. We progressed through the course in this manner, up and down and around some bends and over a huge rock pile, until we reached a big deap mud pit with dirt sides, about four feet high. I told Markcuda that he better get up some speed to make it throught that mud hole and he responded that I didn't know how to four wheel (which is probably true) so I sat back to watch how he would manage. We hit the mud hole doing about two mph, and immediately sunk to the middle of the doors in muddy water. Steam erupted from all around the Ram and I heard boiling noises emitting from the floor. At first I thought he had snagged something and ripped a radiator hose off, but I soon realized that Markcuda never released the parking brake. The rear brake drums were probably red hot and were now immersed in water. By the time we crept through the mud hole the rear brakes mannaged to evaporate half of the water.

Just after the mud hole we came upon a pile of trees that were stacked across the course. Markcuda decided that this obstacle would require more speed so he accelerated in sixth gear. Remember, up to this point Markcuda was used to driving this truck with the emergency brake on... . I would have avoided the obstacle, if it were my truck, but Markcuda decided that the logs were put there for him, personally, to drive over. As Mark sped up, we were all surprised by the G forces, since we were used to the slower pace. My head bounced off of the back window and I saw a shower of stars. Markcuda hit that pile of logs and away we went, sailing through the sky. The tech student was dumbfounded, sitting there with his eyes wide, big as tea cups. I started to laugh until we hit dirt on the other side of the log pile and I bit my tongue.

The next obstacle loomed before us. It was a series of steps made of 12x12 timbers. The Ram was still traveling at a good rate of speed and I wanted to yell for Markcuda to hit the brakes, but I was choking on blood from my bit tongue and couldn't say nothing but "gurgle, spit, spit!". Slam!, we hit the base of the steps and rattled up to the top as fast as the truck would go in 6th low.

At the top of the steps we had to make a hard right and decend a 20 foot drop-off. Markcude managed to slam on the brakes in the turn and skidded down the drop-off with the brakes locked up. Of coarse the engine stalled in the middle of the drop and we slid to the side of the trail smacking the drivers side mirror against a big oak tree. We started sliding down the decline and Markcuda had enough sense to take his foot off the brake and pop the clutch, which brought the engine back to life. There was only one problem with the situation at this point, the engine restarted in reversed rotation, so here we were at the bottom of the drop-off, trying to climb it. Black smoke was billowing from the right front fender and there was a weird sick sound of mud being sucked up the tailpipe.

Once again, Markcuda responded with a quick action and threw the truck into reverse, finishing the course without further mishaps, except maybe the inevitable firing of the tech student that was riding with us.


<font color=#000080><strong>Doc</strong> <font color=#996600>and the "Rambi Slayer"</font>
Secretary: Great Lakes TDR

<font color=#990033><strong>Ram Fast - Dream Hard</strong><font color=#cccccc>

[This message has been edited by Doc Tinker (edited 06-25-2000). ]
 
<font color=blue>Great story Doc! Wish I could have seen this. Plus it provided some decent reading since I am at work... at the moment #ad
 
Markcuda... don't worry, Evan started out that way with a clutch. Now, he is as good as anyone else! (and we know Doc would not embellish his stories, neither would I!)

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Rob Hanson
1999 3500 SLT QC 4X4 6 spd, Braided SS fuel lines, Cummins E-Brake, Blue Box, Bosch 275HP injectors, Member of BOMB! (WW NW Chapter)

MyPics.com (pics updated 6/19/00)

I'd rather be... .
Cummin than Strokin.
 
Oh man - you should've seen it!! I can't believe D-C let us beat on those trucks like we did!! The dakota's with the hoods up are DEAD, there's one dead 3/4 ton Ram (6sp) at the bottom of the hill that you can't see (broken tie rod end). We started the off-road session with 4 Dakotas and 2 diesel Rams and ended up with 2 Dakotas and 1 Ram left at the end - we beat them HARD!!! I drove towards the end of it and I counted at least 30 truck parts left on the course (ALL from the dakotas, btw!!) The white turbo diesel was pretty clean when I got into it after probably 50-60 drivers having taken it through the course. When I got in the engineer that was riding with me asked if I was ready for this!? I said HA, I off-road my truck regularly (and thought ARE YOU READY FOR THIS!?). He said but this isn't an ordinary off-road truck - I said I have the same truck but a long bed (with a 5 sp). So then he said this isn't an ordinary off-road trail and that I'd be in 2nd and 3rd the whole time (in 4 low)!! HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA - I hit 4th by the bottom of the first hill and hit the governor in 6th at least at one point - didn't have time to look at the gauges #ad
. There was a rock trail that was really abusive and I had her boucing right on through. Next major obstacle was a mud pit that I hit hard enough to put the mud up on the hood and fenders (which were clean after those first 50-60 drivers)!!!! Next, a major drop (he said!), when he said I'd have to go slow because of the drop I looked at it - max of 60 degrees down. I nailed the throttle going off the top and landed the front tires about 3-4 feet down the hill!!!!!!! Then a stair climb of tree limbs at about 40 degrees and I think about 10-12 log 10 inches in diameter. He said take it easy - once I hit the first one (in 4th, btw) and the front's went airborne I nailed it and BOUNCED hard all the way to the top - the axles were wrapping so hard that I think I was hitting the fender wells with them!!! Halfway up I turned and looked at him (with a BIG grin on my face) and he was holding on to the oh s. . t handle and the console and I could see his muscles flexing in his arm trying to hold on!! At the end of the drive he said that was the most aggresive driving he'd ever seen - and she lived!!!!! (great exaggeration starts here) Basically every time he said go slow I nailed it, I was trying to break the truck and thought for sure that I would! I thought I was going to drop a driveshaft on the stair climb. I wanted to see where the truck would break so I'd never go there in my truck - I'd never go ANYWHERE near the abuse I dished out to that truck with mine! The dakotas had parts hanging off of them (and some left behind) all over the place. One guy took out a tree with one and munched the fender pretty good - another hit the steps so hard be blew the A/C lines. These were BRAND NEW trucks btw, I don't think any of them had more than 100 miles on them by the end of the day. We had a GLTDR after-glow dinner at a local restaraunt (very nice restaraunt) and the car haulers drove by with the trucks on them and we just cheered and said - WE DID THAT!! I don't think I've ever had so much fun with my clothes on as beating the tar out of a brand new $40,000 truck that I didn't have to worry about. It impressed me unbelievably by the end of the day. The only damage to either of the TD's was the one broken tie rod end - the Dakota's were dead, even the one's still driving. I figure we destroyed $200k worth of trucks and they are now on their way to engineer's to get checked out and then will probably be crushed #ad
! WOOOHOOOOOOOOOOO TOO MUCH FUN!!

#ad

#ad




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-Steve St. Laurent - President of the Great Lakes TDR, Chapter Forums Moderator
'98 Quad Cab Long Bed (CMNSPWR), 4x4, ISB, 5sp, 4. 10 LSD, Prime-loc remote fuel filter, boost & pyro gauges, TST Powermax, muffler eliminator, 5" chrome tip, BD Exhaust Brake, Isspro turbo temp monitor, Permatech spray in liner, Grizzly stainless nerf bars, Stull SS grill & bumper inserts, Front Draw-Tite receiver, BFG 285/75R16 AT KO's

[This message has been edited by Steve St. Laurent (edited 06-25-2000). ]

[This message has been edited by Steve St. Laurent (edited 06-26-2000). ]
 
I never thought HELL would be so much fun. The event far exceeded my expectations with the number of trucks, and people, that were there. Arrived at about 0850, and there were already a couple hundred trucks there. Without being lengthy, the Chelsea events had to be the most fun, especially, the off road course. The breakfast, and lunch, kept everyone full throughout the day.

A SPECIAL THANKS TO THE GLTDR, COLONE DODGE, DC, AND EVERYONE THAT WORKED HARD TO PUT ON THIS EVENT !!

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2001 ordered 12/20/99. Arrived 2/9/00 2500 RC, SLT,4X4,ETH,6-speed,4:10 anti-spin,Camper special,cab clearance lights,GPD trailer tow mirrors,sliding rear window,Snow Plow prep, power seat,Line-X'd OTR bed and quarter panels,DeeZee running boards,INTENSE Blue/ agate.
 
I wonder if Dodge will ever let the TDR do such an event again. Probably not. #ad
I drove the white Cummins in the first group. It finished in the same shape it started. I appreciated the opportunity that Dodge gave us to see what the trucks we capable of. I drove the truck as if it were mine, although I wouldn't have done it in mine, it was a very rough course.

I don't know about you, but I would never ruin a chance of being able to do such an event in the future (or maybe a better event). Steve, you make the GLTDR look like a bunch of dumbass punks, if you tried to tear the truck up as you state. Reminds me of a movie I just watched where a hard-rock band destroyed a hotel room that they were let use rent free. At least Doc's story wasn't him tearing up the truck and he probably stretched the truth about the guys in-ability to drive a stick.

I picked up your card, Steve, from Doc at the event. I just threw it in the trash. I don't know anybody else in that group, I met Doc, he seemed like a good guy. I'm glad I didn't join the GLTDR on the spot, though. I don't want to be associated with the kind of person who would take advantage of such a good opportunity as we were given, and then laugh about it. I hope you're not as big an ass as you sound. Maybe you think I'm an ass or a wussy for not tearing up somebody else's truck. But if I had you wouldn't have got to drive it, would you? I was raised up in the south, with manners, so I wanted everybody else at the event to have the same opportunity that I got.

And you brag about destroying $200,000 worth of trucks. Yeah, like that's really something to be proud of. I hope, I really do, that I'm not the only one who feels like this. If so, I don't care, what you did (or at least said) is not something to brag about. It's something worth having you impeached from office, to have someone respectable leading that group. Of course I don't have to worry about that (luckily) cause I didn't join. That's my $0. 02 worth. Hate me if you want to, reply angrily, whatever, it doesn't change anything.

People of the TDR, let's hear your opinion! Disagree with me if you want, it's your right! Stand up for what YOU think is RIGHT! Voice it here.

------------------
Y2K 2500 Cummins ETC/DEE, SLT+, 4X4, Quad, LB, Intense Blue Sport, 3. 54 anti-spin, rear aux. springs (camper special), sliding rear window, all options except cab clearance lights including agate leather, totally stock, + a mpg increaser goodie. Since everybody else listed their toys, I will too.
1995 Kawasaki ZX6-R (For Sale)
1990 Toyota Celica
1983 Mazda RX-7 GSL (For sale)
1983 Mazda RX-7 GS (For sale)

[This message has been edited by JyRO (edited 06-26-2000). ]
 
JyRO, I'd like to warn you that the GLTDR guys like to run off at the mouth, me included. Steve's comments about the bashfest exaggerates the real scenario. I know, because Mrs Doc spoke with Michael Spears of MSX International, and organizer for the event. She asked him what will happen with the trucks that were used in the 4x4 test drive and he said that they will be repaired and sold.

Obviously, Steve's post is an attempt to make light of the nature of the event. I might add that just your driving through that course caused more damage that even you would want to do to your own vehicle, which was expected by both you and DC.

Don't let our love of fun interfer with your opportunity to acheive the same.

<font color=#000080><strong>Doc</strong> <font color=#996600>and the "Rambi Slayer"</font>
Secretary: Great Lakes TDR

<font color=#990033><strong>Ram Fast - Dream Hard</strong>
 
Doc,

I'm aware of the wear and tear I put on the truck, that's why I said I wouldn't have done it in my own truck. I hope Steve's story was very exaggerated, but if not, I stand behind my post.

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Y2K 2500 Cummins ETC/DEE, SLT+, 4X4, Quad, LB, Intense Blue Sport, 3. 54 anti-spin, rear aux. springs (camper special), sliding rear window, all options except cab clearance lights including agate leather, totally stock, + a mpg increaser goodie. Since everybody else listed their toys, I will too.
1995 Kawasaki ZX6-R (For Sale)
1990 Toyota Celica
1983 Mazda RX-7 GSL (For sale)
1983 Mazda RX-7 GS (For sale)
 
JyRo, you're probably driving one of those trucks from a previous event #ad
and you didn't even know it. Lighten up ! As for being a Southerner, I am one, and know right from wrong. And I was with our club all day, nobody acted inappropriately. Our prez and Doc both have a wild sense of humor, and the posts were all in fun. The dealership and sponsors all knew how bad the course was before they had the trucks brought out there for us to use. It was a valuable learning experience for all of us, to see what the trucks can and cannot do, and I'm grateful to the event organizers and sponsors for making it possible. The GLTDR is a great club, you're missing out. We do get carried away with the humor, but that makes it fun !

[This message has been edited by Briar Hopper (edited 06-26-2000). ]
 
JyRO, I would like to publicly apologize to you and all reading this if my post wasn't taken in the light manner that I meant it. I've edited the message and inserted where the great exaggerations started. I made that post the very next day when I was still swimming with the excitement from the event. The truck that I drove (the same white one that you did) was also in the same condition (other than the mud over the hood - which was to be expected) as when I started with it. I have no experience with D-C's testing but have a lot of experience with GM's. Those coarses are designed to punish the vehicles - I'm sure that it was expected that damage would be done to the vehicles. I now know that John Colone Dodge purchased those vehicles and they will be repaired and sold. What I was attempting to do (and evidently did a poor job of it - again sorry) was to point out the incredible strength of the Ram and to give Dodge a pat on the back for a great vehicle. The one ram that broke was simply a tie rod end which is a minor part failure (and probably happened due to driver error and not the vehicle). I do regularly off-road my vehicles and work them hard - I did push that truck a little harder than I would mine but that was primarily because of the coarse that we were on that was set up to do just that. I assure you that I work very hard on the GLTDR and do everything I can to contribute to a respectable organization. At the end of the event I was walking around thanking everyone that I could find for hosting the event. Also, there was some damage done to the lawn of the proving grounds (due to the wet conditions and some people playing) and I was on the phone first thing this morning to Robert Patton offering to drive back to Chelsea (nearly a 2 hour drive) to repair the damage done to the lawn myself in order to foster good feelings towards our group. I take my civic responsibility very seriously and at a previous event (we've only had 3 so far before this one) which was in my town had our group make a donation to the town to help pay for our local park which was not required or expected but I thought would be a good thing to do. Again, I'm sorry if my unbridled enthusiasm came across wrong - if you would like to talk to me about this please feel free to email me (stevest@voyager.net) and either give me your phone number so I can pay for the call or I'll give you mine if you'd rather not do that.

-Steve St. Laurent


[This message has been edited by Steve St. Laurent (edited 06-26-2000). ]
 
<font color=red>When I 1st read JyRO's comments i figured it turn to an all out war with a reply by steve. . I dont know Steve but with his last post... he's a 1st class guy in my book. . JB

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99 Quad,Long bed,4x4, SLT,Auto,K&N,Mobil Super Delvac 1300,fuel line up-grade from lift pump to filter and from filter to injection pump, Suncoast coverter,BD valve body and pressure-loc,Mag-Hytec trans pan,Amsoil ATF-4,Auto meter Ultra lite gauges:Boost,EGT,Fuel Pressure,Trans Temp, "true" Jet-Hot Coated 5 inch exhaust from turbo to tail pipe(over the axle)Borla shoot-out muffler,DD stage 3 injectors and boost module,HX-40 16cm,here and waiting to be installed, Next Jet-hot my ATS exhaust manifold and turbo housing, and special thanx to rob for swaying me on a 4 wire Blue Box(incoming)

[This message has been edited by QuadDoorRam25004x4diesel (edited 06-26-2000). ]
 
I'm at a disadvantage here, because I wasn't there. However, I need to point out to everyone, that EVERY drive was supervised, and that this "fun drive" was sanctioned, promoted, and paid for by the people who set the rules of the event.

If they were intending that the drivers be nice to the trucks, they failed in getting that across. If they intended that it be a wild day in woods, busting up the trucks to see what breaks first, they did succeed.

In no place in his posts, or in my conversations with Steve or others, has anyone indicated or suggested, or even hinted that they did anything thier guides disapproved of. If things did not go as expected, then it's either a failure by those in charge to get the message across, or else a complete underestimation by those who set up the event (not TDR or GLTDR, but DC or the dealer) of what would eventuate. Maybe this is a learning curve for someone... maybe what happened was entirely expected, and there's no problem.

No matter what has occurred in relation to the event, it is clear that the TDR and GLTDR, Steve and Doc and whoever else, are not to blame for any future bad relationships. If things went down badly, then any future events will be more properly regulated by those who set the rules. It really is easy to react to things, but that does not find the truth here.

"The difference between men and boys is the price of thier toys". And as long as someone else is buying the toys, boys play rough. I fail to see why anyone would expect otherwise.

There, my $0. 00 worth.

Mark
 
Steve,

I guess I just don't relate too well to someone, "blowing their own horn," to sound cool. I try to let my actions speak for me. I just don't find bragging about destroying $200,000 worth of trucks funny (even if it was exaggeration). I don't have the greatest sense of humor, but the Warden (who's got a good sense of humor and is never wrong) didn't see the humor either. It is commendable the things you've said, hope their not exaggerated too. I feel sorry for poor Mr. John Colone Dodge. #ad


Briar, I hope your not serious either. I've got enough intelligence to know that it was brand new. You know, tracking it through production/assembly and all. I'm just going to assume you were being sarcastic as well because, my sense of humor must be not as bountiful as the rest of you guys.

I'm not against you guys, I'm for all the Diesel-heads here in the forums. I've learned a lot of good stuff. I just would've hated some DC rep or engr or Chelsea PG worker to read the above and understand it the way I did, and someone not call you on it.

------------------
Y2K 2500 Cummins ETC/DEE, SLT+, 4X4, Quad, LB, Intense Blue Sport, 3. 54 anti-spin, rear aux. springs (camper special), sliding rear window, all options except cab clearance lights including agate leather, totally stock, + a mpg increaser goodie. Since everybody else listed their toys, I will too.
1995 Kawasaki ZX6-R (For Sale)
1990 Toyota Celica
1983 Mazda RX-7 GSL (For sale)
1983 Mazda RX-7 GS (For sale)
 
Originally posted by JyRO:
... I just don't find bragging about destroying $200,000 worth of trucks funny (even if it was exaggeration). ...

I would suppose that the guys who do that for a living brag about it for a while. But I'll bet they don't brag about it for too long. After a while, it becomes just another job.

The off-road test track at the Proving Grounds exists to 'prove' the worthiness of a vehicle's design. They allowed us to drive/ride some vehicles around a very short section of the track to give us an idea of the punishment they can give vehicles under development. I doubt that Steve, Eric, Tom or any of the other drivers ran any of the vehicles anywhere near as hard as DC's test drivers do.

I eased a Dakota around the course. Or so I thought. I kept mashing down on the brake to keep from rear-ending the truck in front of me. It's the first time I'd ever driven on anything that rough (though Illinois' roads do come close), so I drove easy; but I didn't baby the truck either. I powered over the logs, up the stairs, through the mud. But I did have to wait nearly a minute at the top of the blind hairpin turn for the driver in front of me to clear out.

I really doubt Colone or DC expected the off-road trucks to emerge in the same shape they went in; they couldn't be *that* naive. And I doubt there was any permanent damage to any of the vehicles.
And if Colone spends even $100,000 fixing the trucks, it will have been money well spent.

Even $1,000,000 in advertising can't match the publicity they got from having 300+ diesel Rams at their shop, or from stopping traffic for those 300+ Rams to caravan to Hell for lunch, or from the tremendous traffic backups from the cruise to Chelsea on the back roads, replete with Colone's signage pointing the way to the Proving Grounds.

For the dealer and DC, it's effective advertising, worth the cost of several vehicles. How many of the 500+ folks who were at Chelsea left thinking, "Geez. DC sure build crummy trucks. They couldn't even make it through an afternoon of off-roading. "
I think most folks left thinking, "Dodge sure makes truck that'll take a beating. If they can make it through the off-road track with inexperienced folks driving them, they should last almost forever on the road. "

Also, something that was *not* mentioned was that the six or so trucks running the test highway made it through the afternoon without a single mishap. And some of those trucks were pulling (albeit empty) trailers. One was pulling what seemed to be a brand new Victory motorbike.

If one or two of us drove aggressively, what of it? The shotgun riders would have stopped us if we were *too* aggressive; they did in one case.

There was damage to the vehicles. With 300+ folks who are not experienced driving off-road piloting those trucks, damage was to be expected. As the track deteriorated during the afternoon, more damage was to be expected. And since there had to be at least one experienced off-road driver in the crowd, some aggressive driving was expected.

I wouldn't necessarily call it bragging, but I took particular delight in being allowed a once-in-a-lifetime chance to pilot a test vehicle around the official off-road proving track. It was fun; it was different. I doubt that anything that happened was unexpected.

Four vehicles coarsely broken in? It's the cost of doing business, a cost that Colone will happily pay this time, and the next time they do it. They couldn't *buy* that much good will with 10 times the money. Funny? Humorous? Perhaps not. Cool? Delightful? I think so.

Just trying to put the day's events into perspective.

Fest3er

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'98 auto, 4X4, valve- and BOMB-challenged; Yokohama 225/75-19. 5 on Rickson wheels; 67K miles; Amsoil dual remote filter
 
Dear Mr. YOYO

"Steve, you make the GLTDR look like a bunch of dumbass punks, if you tried to tear the truck up as you state. "

"I picked up your card, Steve, from Doc at the event. I just threw it in the trash. I don't know anybody else in that group,"

"I try to let my actions speak for me. "

I think you speak in volumes, your actions do speak for you. And I for one do not think that the GLTDR needs your 10. 00 for membership. We are in no why that desperate for members.

OH Steve well done you are the one here with class!

Proud Member of GLTDR



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Eric Pitts
2001 Properly Valved 2500 Qcab 4X4 auto Transgo shifts it 4. 10 LSD Prime-Loc
Weston Nerf Bars Smith built brush guard
Command Remote Starter Scotty Air
Neophyte B. O. M. B. er
Terre Haute Indiana
The Pitts Home Page

Member GLTDR
 
Last edited by a moderator:
JyRO,
No, I wasn't serious about wishing one of those trucks on you, just trying to be funny.
I actually wouldn't be afraid to buy one, though... Years of experience off-roading and working as a mechanic have left me with the philosophy "don't worry about it till it breaks". Even new ones have something break, just going down smooth pavement.
 
JyRO,
No, I wasn't serious about wishing one of those trucks on you, just trying to be funny.
I actually wouldn't be afraid to buy one, though... Years of experience off-roading and working as a mechanic have left me with the philosophy "don't worry about it till it breaks". Even new ones have something break, just going down smooth pavement.
 
Steve,
For the masses of people that read this site, and don't know you, the comments appear very irresponsible. Without going into the rights/wrongs I hope a lesson is learned by all, and that in the future no-one would attempt to intentionally break or abuse someone elses ride, and then write about it.
Nuff said... . My $. 03 worth (inflation)

ps You did a great job of putting on the show !


Wizzzzzz
 
The new owner of Colone Dodge rode with me, as he did with Steve,( thats right,NEW OWNER,not an engineer!)
He said they had already sold 4 trucks, and 1 PT Cruiser and expected more. He did not seem concerned when I got into it a few times, and only said once" You should probally use 2 gear here. " hehe The Dakotas did not have the clearance for the course, parts are going to fail when you drag them on rocks and dirt!
He also said he signed a 3 year contract for future events. Seemed to be pleased with the turn out and a little sore from 200 + rides!

They call it a PROVING GROUND for a reason.

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GENE

1997 BOMBed 4x4
NRA Member
GLTDR Member
LIC-ROC Member
 
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