EGR/DPF Delete on '09 p4500 C&C

[Wiredawg]

Folks,



First, I appologize for accidently hijacking another thread in this forum... admin error and fumbling the mouse. Next, I am my own warranty station. My '09ngoes out of warranty 7 May and I'm cancelling my Cummins warranty for 5yrs/150K mi. Now to the heart of the matter.



I believe this truck can deliver great emissions and great fuel mileage. I puchased an H&S EGR Delee Kit and Flo Pro DPF delete pipe. Lower EGTs, backpressure and mild power increase will result in clean emmisions and better fuel mileage. Might even sound a tad better, especially with 5" Aussie stacks. I need to first go to a certified diesel emmisions testing station and measure the sam as if done by the EPA. Then upon completion of the transformation, I'm gonna get 'er retested to see exactly where I am. Hopefully, if not on the money they will let me dial it in on the Smarty.



Cheers, Wiredawg

 

[Wiredawg]

Harvey,



I'm picking up for the other thread... I'm hoping to document this to ensure success and I want to make it completely reversable. Smarty 6. 7, 2. 5 years ago $585 free shipping; DPF delete, $135, free shipping; EGR delete, $119 and free shipping. Not too much investment to try to optimize this rig. I'll share my results w/ the TDR.



Cheers, Ron

 

[KLauber]

What do you tow with the 09? You'll also like the fact the oil is no longer fouled by the egr and dpf regen.

 

[Wiredawg]

KLauber,



I tow a 17K lb Travel Supreme 5er. It's a sweet setup and the 4500 is a mean towing machine. I have never performed an oil change on it since a got free oil changes from Dodge for the first 36 months. I check the dip stick and the oil never looks an worse than the other two trucks in our little fleet. It's rainy and nasty all week end, so I might get motiviated an do the change out now. Haven't looked for diesel emission test facility yet, so might try first to see if there is one in San Antonio area.



Wiredawg

 

[Bob4x4]

The 6. 7 won't smoke with the deletes at stock fueling any more than an 06 would. The true exhaust composition will be much different but there are no states that have the equipment to do that type of testing

 

[RVTRKN]

Are you saying that you can pass the emission test without the OEM emission equipment? I thought the new equipment is mandatory for any Diesel engine from 07 and on, per the Federal laws and not per State law. On edit, I'm talking about the DPF.

 

[KLauber]

KLauber,



I tow a 17K lb Travel Supreme 5er. It's a sweet setup and the 4500 is a mean towing machine. I have never performed an oil change on it since a got free oil changes from Dodge for the first 36 months. I check the dip stick and the oil never looks an worse than the other two trucks in our little fleet. It's rainy and nasty all week end, so I might get motiviated an do the change out now. Haven't looked for diesel emission test facility yet, so might try first to see if there is one in San Antonio area.



Wiredawg

Sounds like a nice setup. Put some pics up!

 

[HBarlow]

Ron,

I'll be interested in this thread and will be following it as you update.

 

[HBarlow]

The 6. 7 won't smoke with the deletes at stock fueling any more than an 06 would. The true exhaust composition will be much different but there are no states that have the equipment to do that type of testing

Bob,

That is interesting new information for me but it leaves me confused. I was under the impression that current emissions testing included exhaust sniffing. Is that not true?

What you're saying is state emissions testing can only catch a violator by a visual inspection of equipment or smoke emission. Is this true?

 

[AH64ID]

Currently states only do a visual inspection for equipment, OBDII scan, and an opacity test. There are not any states with the equipment to measure the Nox output.

 

[RVTRKN]

Just don't get caught in a DOT inspection, they can and will tear apart an exhaust system, if spotted smoking knowing a DPF should exsist in the exhaust.

 

[Bob4x4]

Bob,



That is interesting new information for me but it leaves me confused. I was under the impression that current emissions testing included exhaust sniffing. Is that not true?



What you're saying is state emissions testing can only catch a violator by a visual inspection of equipment or smoke emission. Is this true?

My post may not have been clear enough... ... ... maybe AH64ID cleared it up some.



Not saying deletes are legal anywhere just that doing it will not make the truck appear very dirty running. The pipe will show black where as a dpf truck should not. Under heavy load/low rpm it will be a haze that will quickly clear.



During any visual it would be a very quick fail

 

[Wiredawg]

Well the software is loaded in the ECM that stops regen (4th fueling event), the DPF is off, and the delete pipe is on. The DPF isn't too hard to take off, just leave the three temp sensors in the DPF and just unplug the connectors to them. The other two fittings come off. I loosened the clamp connecting the rear of the DPF to the exhaust pipe. I also disconnected the hanger. There are three splined bolts that fit into the downpipe flange that connects to the DPF. I loosened the three nuts and used them to protect the bolts while I hammered them out of the flange. Once removed, I used the DPF to waller out of the exhaust pipe. Installing the delete pipe was cake. Friday, I'm going to seal up the open connectors and wiring for the temp sensors. Also, Friday I will take off the EGR and be ready for a test drive. I'll report how that goes and over time any mpg gains, egt drops, performance changes and if it sounds any different.



See ya'll... I'm pooped.



Wiredawg

 

[Wiredawg]

Folks,



I'm done. Although I purchased the EGR delete kit from H&S, I modified it to only block it off. It is way too much trouble to remove and blocking it off allows you to forego the hard labor and keep it looking connected. Connectors that are supposed to be disconnected, I placed thick electric tape between the contacts and taped together to look like it is connected. The purpose is tno to foll the dealer nor Dodge... I'm on my own for warranty. My purpose is to record data to determine if this mod increases my mpg. I took for test drive... the DPF gone allows muffler to provide tone... not drone or loud, just deep low sound. Couldn't really tell right off about egts, cause I had to kick her in the but hard getting on the interstate. On level 5 of the Smarty, no detectable smoke. No other real difference noticable. All things being equal, I'm hoping to see some mpg improvements, both solo and towing. I run 112 gallons in the aux/pri tanks and I'm 3/4 full now.



I searched and could not find an emission testing facilty in the San Antonio area. Commercial plant are, but not vehicles I could find. So, here is where it is at: I'm going to make this my primary vehicle to check unloaded mpg, egt and performance charateristics. Then, I will hook up to the 5er and run a few hundred miles in the hill country to see if there is any advantage to thid mod. If none, I'll taker her back... if there is at least a mpg or two, it stays.



Finally, my truck had a Georgia State clean idle certification sticker on it and the DPF and EGR seem to bear it out. DPF did not have any noticable particulate in it nor did the EGR seem to be too dirty. There was a coating of black soot, but not more than that.



At this point, I want to share my frustration with the economy and the government. I worked all my life, 30 years in the Air Force and almost 6 yeas in Civil Service. We, the working class, have been screwed by ultra low sulfer diesel... all thre vehicles dropped 1 to 2 mpg from low sulfer diesel. Then, they install these devices that burn more fuel to " clean the DPF" and still require preiodic service on it. I'm convinced this rig is clean burning without all the crap plugged in. If I'm wrong, I'll report is honestly. If I'm right, same thing.



So, let the test begin. And Harvey, If you want to come to SA, I'll help you do this. You can stay at the house or plug you 5er into our pole.



C-ya,



Ron

 

[HBarlow]

Ron,

Thank you very sincerely for your kind offer. I may take you up on it but for now will wait and watch reading your reports and opinions of the work you've done.

You've written an excellent description and I'm lookin forward to reading your future observations.

 

[Bob4x4]

Good luck with your testing,If it were my truck I would add an external wastegate as an attempt to keep the head gasket alive

 

[firemansdiesel]

He will be ok with the gaskets if he (or anyone deleted) turns the power down when towing, and don't romp on it when the truck is cold. Also I would rather put the money into head studs. The ARP 625 will hold, but the ARP 2000's (425's) from reading have weakened at times.

Deleted and towing will not yield much mpg difference than stock, but unloaded you'll see anywhere from 1-3mpg. The biggest benefit will be no more high EGT's and excessive soot circulating back through the engine.

 

[Wiredawg]

Thanks for the heads up about the head gasket... I need to replace the boost gauge as mine goes only to 30 psi and it occasionally buries. I'm going to go down to SW#3... just wanted to see if she smoked when I got down on it.



Please do share thoughts and concerns along the way... an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.



Thanks,



Ron

 

[Bob4x4]

The last 2 failures I repaired were both contractors that towed

One I am pretty sure was not an honest guy

At first denied programmer and deletes till I showed him the proof

He still claimed running on the lowest level.....

 

[Wiredawg]

Bob,



What kind of boost pressures are we talking about to blow the head gasket? I pulled the 5er to Canada and back thinking I was on SW#3 but was actually on SW#5. I did not have any egt problems and I towed in tow/haul mode, which had RPMs about 2300 or 2400 at 70mph.



I don't want to hurt the truck.



Thanks,



Ron