eth and power upgrades

[SixShooter]

I am wondering what the power drop is between the etc and the eth, when both have an edge comp and dd 3 injectors? I am figuring about 25hp less in the eth? I you would change the comp to the hot comp, would you have the same output as the etc with just the comp and injectors? I got really confused when people started posting small numbers with this setup on the eth. Any help would be great.

 

[MikeR]

From what I saw between two exactly the same 'modded ETC and ETH trucks, the difference was about 30hp less in the ETH. I don't think the race program in the comp would make up for it. Then you have to consider the disadvantage of the 6spd to the 5spd at the track. If you want to race it, then the odd gear spacing, and one less gear of the 5spd is going to be a better drag truck... it will get up to speed faster.



You've been waiting quite a while for a truck. Have you considered a used truck? A reg-cab 5spd should be relatively easy to find and at a much cheaper price over new. It would make the bomb parts list easier and faster to get into.

 

[jtisdale]

whoa trigger...

Let me get this straight...

If I were to take an ETC(235hp 5 speed) and an ETH(245hp 6speed), both equipted exactly the same (except for the obvious differences) and I were to make the exact same mods to both trucks...

1)aftermarket air filter

2)aftermarket exhaust

3)edge ez

... the ETC would now dyno higher figures than the ETH?

Where did I go wrong buying the ETH?:{

 

[DEZLPWR]

Doesn't it go something like this:

ETC's rule, ETH's drool... .

CUMMINTSTRKN used to have this in his sig, but it was the other way around. Now he's an ETC man! hehehehe

 

[jtisdale]

What'chu talkin' 'bout Willis?

Can somebody please explain to me how this is even possible? How can you start with two engines (basically) the same- one with just a few more ponies (by design) and one with a few less. But basically the same engine. Now add the exact same mods to both and the one with less hp surpasses his more powerful counterpart. NO WAY. I dont want to believe that. (I really dont)

 

[Jetpilot]

It has to do with the differences in the VP44. The ETC gets better results from fueling box power upgrades than the ETH.



Doug

 

[jtisdale]

I'll refrain from comment, so I dont get kicked out

#@$%!

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

The ETH will gain a lot more with injectors and put them about even up.



The ETH has smaller injectors and a different VP44 that supposedly delivers more fuel. the stock program is a little hotter.



When adding a box the program doesn't have as much headroom inside the limits to expand. once the injectors change the eth and the etc match pretty well... except that the ETH has more compression. . can be an advantage or disadvantage depending on boost level.





Later,

Mark

 

[Jetpilot]

Mark,



I may be wrong here... . But an ETC will make more HP than an ETH with the same mods. There have been countless discussions on this subject on the TDR. Seems that injectors really help the ETH more than a fueling module but the two are not equal if exact same mods are done to both an ETC and an ETH.



Doug

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I agree on fueling boxes. I've seen that. I know that I gained the full 100hp from my dd3s. I haven't checked against ETCs there.



I know I gained 160+ hp from DD3's and a PEC.



I've seen huge differences between ETHs and ETHs and ETC:ETC, so I dunno.

 

[jtisdale]

from the cummins web site

http://www.cummins.com/na/pages/en/....cfm?uuid=00038B45-046B-1B90-BCF080C4A8F00000



What is the High Output Cummins Engine? What changes were made to the HO engine?





The High Output Cummins engine is a new rating launched in January 2000 for the Dodge Ram. It produces 245hp and 505 lb. -ft torque. To create and handle the high output the rating this engine has different components:



Controls: new software instructing fuel pump to deliver more fuel.

Fuel System: VP44 fuel pump components changed to allow for increased fuel delivery.

Injectors: Changed to allow for increased fuel delivery.

Pistons: New design for higher 17:1 compression ratio-

Head: powdered metal valve seat inserts for improved Durability.

Flywheel: larger to match to larger diameter clutch for handling higher torque output.



Is all this info correct as you see it?

I've cooled off now, and I am only seeking answers

 

[DEZLPWR]

That makes sense...

With just my DDII's and Comp Box off, my ETC dynoed at 255hp. With the Comp turned on to 5-5, I dynoed at 412hp! I think it IS true that the ETC responds less to injectors and more to fueling boxes vs. the ETH's... .

 

[redeye]

This was copied from the Diesel Dynamics Dodge page.

Note that with the same upgrade kit the ETH will end up gaining more HP and torque.



1998. 5 – 2001 POWER UP



Stage 1

50hp/100ft-lbs

Injectors and K&N Filter



Stage 1 ETH

60hp/125ft-lbs

Injectors and K&N Filter



Stage 1 Pro

95hp/180ft-lbs

Injectors, True Torque Power Module and K&N Filter



Stage 1 ETH Pro

100hp/200ft-lbs

Injectors, True Torque Power Module and K&N Filter



It was explained to me that the True Torque Power Module is manufactured by the company that makes EZ products, with DD's proprietary programming.



The Higher compression and 10cm turbo housing does limit transformations to a monster motor, but given enough time and money that is easily overcome.



Happy Bombing

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Thanks redeye. .

 

[DEZLPWR]

Notice how the gap narrows....

This is with the TTPM. (EZ) Wouldn't the gap be eliminated and even flip-flopped with the more aggressive UFM (Comp Box)?

 

[redeye]

Could Be?



There's more information at Diesel Dynamics

 

[KLockliear]

ETH's respond differently to boxes and injectors than ETC's. In the end, the ETC is the better engine for PEAK power.



Our injectors for instance:

• Stage 1's make 50+hp on an ETC, 65+hp on an ETH
  
• Stage 2's make 75+hp on an ETC, 90+hp on an ETH
  
• Stage 1's make 100+hp on an ETC, 115+hp on an ETH
  

And the boxes:

• TTPM's make 50+hp on an ETC, 35+hp on an ETH
  
• UPM's make 115+hp on a stock ETC's, 95+hp on a stock ETH
  
• With big injectors, the UPM will make over 150hp on an ETC, while only making around 115hp on an ETH
  

We have had an ETH with SuperMentals, HX-40 and our modified fuel pump over 550hp on #2 only, yet the same setup on an ETC only makes about 530hp.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

We have had an ETH with SuperMentals, HX-40 and our modified fuel pump over 550hp on #2 only, yet the same setup on an ETC only makes about 530hp.

Once this is done the only real difference in the motors is compression ratio. A higher compression ratio should yield more power.



It looks like the ETH VP44 is just different enough to not respond well to identical programs on a fueling box.



It looks like someone needs to tweak the curves for the ETH

 

[Sixspeed]

luck of the draw

I know that up here in the great NW. There are a couple of guys with ETH's that are in the 240 rwhp range stock. My ETH (see sig) has 238 rwhp . Just to compare these same guys are over 300 rwhp with the setup I have.



Les

 

[Diesel Freak]

240 HP stock? Who's dyno was this on..... BD's? (I have a suspicion about their dyno)



238 sounds about right for an ETH with a VA



I had 233 HP with my 275's on a local dyno in Hillsboro.



Now I am at 358 (see sig)



ETH's really respond well to injecors!