This is what apparently is catching on - (reference page 101 of the latest TDR Issue 41) http://www.smokindiesel.com/Dodge/24_valve/FASS.htm
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FASS System
- Thread starter hammersley
- Start Date
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Looks to me like its supposed to replace the filter and lift pump on a stock truck. Sort of a filtering system/transfer pump all in one thats easy to mount and hook up. Gets rid of all banjo fittings and replaces the Carter transfer pump with something more reliable. Thats what it looks like to me.
I've already invested too much in my fuel system to get one. My Stanadynes and lift pump relocation cost me more than one of these... and that dont even count the time involved.
But I must admit... its interesting looking as well as durable looking. I like those spin on filters. I'd like to know how they address fuel heaters for cold weather gelling.
I've already invested too much in my fuel system to get one. My Stanadynes and lift pump relocation cost me more than one of these... and that dont even count the time involved.
But I must admit... its interesting looking as well as durable looking. I like those spin on filters. I'd like to know how they address fuel heaters for cold weather gelling.
Brad told me that there is a connection
for running a hot water hose from the engine - to and back.
for running a hot water hose from the engine - to and back.
Just installed
I just installed one a couple of days ago. My lift pump went out, and instead of replacing the lift pump and adding a pusher pump system I decided to try the FASS unit (for the same price). What appealed to me was the elimination of the lift pump at the motor,elimination of the fuel filter, and easy access.
This is a VERY beefy unit. I am going to guess that this unit was probably designed for larger trucks. It is also a very NICE unit, well made and simple. I like that I can just reach down behind the cab and change the fuel filter or drain the water seperator.
Install was alittle difficult because of the size. There is really only one place you can mount it where you get it up out of the way. Right in front of the drivers side spring shackle. I ended up welding a piece of 1/4" x 6" x 11" plate to the box mount and the parking brake mount and bolting the unit to that. That made it much easier and cleaner looking IMO.
So far I have had zero problems and pleased with the product. Also, I have a pusher pump system on another truck and the nose the pump produces is very loud. The FASS pump is very quiet, not noticeable. If anyone has any questions, I would be happy to answer them.
Chris WebsterOo.
I just installed one a couple of days ago. My lift pump went out, and instead of replacing the lift pump and adding a pusher pump system I decided to try the FASS unit (for the same price). What appealed to me was the elimination of the lift pump at the motor,elimination of the fuel filter, and easy access.
This is a VERY beefy unit. I am going to guess that this unit was probably designed for larger trucks. It is also a very NICE unit, well made and simple. I like that I can just reach down behind the cab and change the fuel filter or drain the water seperator.
Install was alittle difficult because of the size. There is really only one place you can mount it where you get it up out of the way. Right in front of the drivers side spring shackle. I ended up welding a piece of 1/4" x 6" x 11" plate to the box mount and the parking brake mount and bolting the unit to that. That made it much easier and cleaner looking IMO.
So far I have had zero problems and pleased with the product. Also, I have a pusher pump system on another truck and the nose the pump produces is very loud. The FASS pump is very quiet, not noticeable. If anyone has any questions, I would be happy to answer them.
Chris WebsterOo.
I suppose running a coolant isn't a bad idea at all as long as the engine is up to temps. That will surely keep it flowing. But if the temps get really cold, wax crystals will form early on and possibly clog the filter. Maybe they should seriously consider a 12V electric heat probe that protrudes into the inlet fuel flow path. As soon as the key comes on it will start warming up cold fuel. Just a thought on a great looking concept.
Ok, so as usual, a little more information brings up more questions.
1. As to cold weather and fuel gelling. If they have a way to run a water/coolant hose from the engine to this FASS unit, as long as the engine is running, seems like this would help. But I had always thought you need to be concerned with gelling when the beast has been sitting in the cold... Therefore, their ain't gonna be much hot coolant cirulating between the engine and this unit
2. Chris, you said the only realistic place to mount this thing is up by the engine... basically like the OEM lift pump... and this thing replaces the lift pump... So basically, this unit will be sucking the fuel from the tank all that way, just like the OEM design, instead of pushing the fuel from a location closer to the tank... I wonder how successful that will prove to be.
All in all, it sounds like this could be a reasonably successful and valuable product. I'll have to fully read up on it when I can.
1. As to cold weather and fuel gelling. If they have a way to run a water/coolant hose from the engine to this FASS unit, as long as the engine is running, seems like this would help. But I had always thought you need to be concerned with gelling when the beast has been sitting in the cold... Therefore, their ain't gonna be much hot coolant cirulating between the engine and this unit
2. Chris, you said the only realistic place to mount this thing is up by the engine... basically like the OEM lift pump... and this thing replaces the lift pump... So basically, this unit will be sucking the fuel from the tank all that way, just like the OEM design, instead of pushing the fuel from a location closer to the tank... I wonder how successful that will prove to be.
All in all, it sounds like this could be a reasonably successful and valuable product. I'll have to fully read up on it when I can.
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2. Nick, you said the only realistic place to mount this thing is up by the engine... basically like the OEM lift pump... and this thing replaces the lift pump... So basically, this unit will be sucking the fuel from the tank all that way, just like the OEM design, instead of pushing the fuel from a location closer to the tank... I wonder how successful that will prove to be.
I do not think you would have the room to mount this in the engine compartment. The weight of the unit necessitates (sp?) a very solid mount, and I don't see where you could find a suitable place in the engine compartment. Really the only place to install is where I noted in my earlier post. Which, maintains the concept of pushing the fuel and also makes the filters very accessible. I have some digital photos, but I am having a hard time finding a way to post. I tried creating a readers rig album and posting there, but the picture size is still to large. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know
Chris
I do not think you would have the room to mount this in the engine compartment. The weight of the unit necessitates (sp?) a very solid mount, and I don't see where you could find a suitable place in the engine compartment. Really the only place to install is where I noted in my earlier post. Which, maintains the concept of pushing the fuel and also makes the filters very accessible. I have some digital photos, but I am having a hard time finding a way to post. I tried creating a readers rig album and posting there, but the picture size is still to large. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know
Chris
I re-read my post and wanted to clear up the mounting location. I meant right in front of the drivers side, rear axle spring shackle. If you look under your truck at that location, there is enough height to tuck the unit up, right behind the front of the box and right in front of the spring shackle. I think that some mount the unit right to the frame, but I could not see how this was accomplished, hence the 1/4 x 6 x 11 plate. Also, if it is mounted to the frame, you will have a hard time getting the nuts between the frame and fuel tank. With the plate, I was able to punch the hole pattern for the mounting bracket and, once welded on, had easy access to the nuts and bolts. The pictures really do clear things up, but I lack the ability to get them posted. Sorry if there was any confusion.
Chris
Chris
Thanks for the clarification Chris. Man, you caught me in mid-edit of my last post, before I realized it was you instead of Ncostello that had talked about actually having mounted the FASS system on your truck. Sorry about that...
Well, since I have the TransFer Flow OEM replacement fuel tank, there is no longer even 1" of room between the fuel tank and rear axle on my truck, so I couldn't mount anything there... I'm still planning to someday revamp my entire fuel delivery system, and this is certainly something I'll keep my eye on.
Well, since I have the TransFer Flow OEM replacement fuel tank, there is no longer even 1" of room between the fuel tank and rear axle on my truck, so I couldn't mount anything there... I'm still planning to someday revamp my entire fuel delivery system, and this is certainly something I'll keep my eye on.
TomGolden... I'm pretty sure CWebster is talking about mounting this unit outside the frame rail. If you look at your drivers side rear leaf spring... the shackle mount on the front of the spring bolts to the frame. Theres tons of room in that area between the frame and the body panel (rear fender). You'll also be directly across from the fuel module ports... at least on a stock tank that is.
CWebster... I'll agree its tough getting stuff inbetween the tank and frame. I had a heck of a time removing my stock steel supply line. The line was obviously installed "before" the tank was put in at the factory. But with the right tools and a dremel cutoff wheel... anythings possible!
CWebster... I'll agree its tough getting stuff inbetween the tank and frame. I had a heck of a time removing my stock steel supply line. The line was obviously installed "before" the tank was put in at the factory. But with the right tools and a dremel cutoff wheel... anythings possible!
OK... I've read the website ad as well as the ad in TDR41 (page 101). I've got a few questions I'll throw out here cause I don't know if I exactly "agree" with what this thing can and/or will do for us.
First its called the Fuel Air Separation System (FASS). I dont really know if we have a air-in-fuel problem. If you do its because of a leak or something. Perhaps this is more suited to PSD's with aeration problems in the return line as it dumps into the tank. But its only the name so thats OK. Maybe its talking about microscopic air or something. I'd be afraid some people might not give it much of a look because of the name.
The Advertisements header says "Gain Performance". Fair enough if that means fuel delivery performance. But then it goes on to list the benefits.
1) Consistent performance - Thats great!
2) More Power (20+ HP) - How is that possible with filters???
3) Increased Fuel Econ. - Perhaps if your OEM setup is having problems and causes rough running.
4) Better Throttle Response - I could see that... OK
5) Quicker Starts Cold Weather - True only if you just shut down and the coolant is still hot inside the unit. Sitting all night without electric in-unit heaters could prove otherwise.
6) Less Cab Noise - Thats great too since some report LP's on the frame make noise.
7) Lower Turbo Temperatures - How's that???
8) Consistent/Even fuel flow to injection pump - Great!
9) Consistent/Exact Fuel Injection Timing - How does a transfer pump and filters affect the fuel injection timing?
Lastly the ad says "All of the above without voiding the manufactures warranties!!" I could almost bet what a Dodge dealership would say if you showed up with a VP44 failure and you had this setup as the fuel transfer/filter system. That statement alone sounds kind of misleading to me.
Also says installation in About 1HR. If you add another two or three to that I'd say it would be right.
I'm not trying to cut down the unit at all... I think it looks like a great answer if it solves dying lift pumps and thus VP44 failures. It also looks very high quality. I just kinda question some of the ad claims. Personally, I think an ad claiming this unit will eliminate the factory lift pump and work for the life of the truck... all the while providing cleaner fuel, would speak volumes about what it can do.
First its called the Fuel Air Separation System (FASS). I dont really know if we have a air-in-fuel problem. If you do its because of a leak or something. Perhaps this is more suited to PSD's with aeration problems in the return line as it dumps into the tank. But its only the name so thats OK. Maybe its talking about microscopic air or something. I'd be afraid some people might not give it much of a look because of the name.
The Advertisements header says "Gain Performance". Fair enough if that means fuel delivery performance. But then it goes on to list the benefits.
1) Consistent performance - Thats great!
2) More Power (20+ HP) - How is that possible with filters???
3) Increased Fuel Econ. - Perhaps if your OEM setup is having problems and causes rough running.
4) Better Throttle Response - I could see that... OK
5) Quicker Starts Cold Weather - True only if you just shut down and the coolant is still hot inside the unit. Sitting all night without electric in-unit heaters could prove otherwise.
6) Less Cab Noise - Thats great too since some report LP's on the frame make noise.
7) Lower Turbo Temperatures - How's that???
8) Consistent/Even fuel flow to injection pump - Great!
9) Consistent/Exact Fuel Injection Timing - How does a transfer pump and filters affect the fuel injection timing?
Lastly the ad says "All of the above without voiding the manufactures warranties!!" I could almost bet what a Dodge dealership would say if you showed up with a VP44 failure and you had this setup as the fuel transfer/filter system. That statement alone sounds kind of misleading to me.
Also says installation in About 1HR. If you add another two or three to that I'd say it would be right.
I'm not trying to cut down the unit at all... I think it looks like a great answer if it solves dying lift pumps and thus VP44 failures. It also looks very high quality. I just kinda question some of the ad claims. Personally, I think an ad claiming this unit will eliminate the factory lift pump and work for the life of the truck... all the while providing cleaner fuel, would speak volumes about what it can do.
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Personally,
I am trying to figure out why I would want to run coolant through the unit. I thought cool fuel was better than warm fuel any day, including the winter. The fuel retuning to the tank seems like it would be plenty warm enough to keep the fuel warm (especially by the time the engine came up to temp, it seem like the fuel would be warm enough too).
It has a built in electronic fuel pre-heater so the cold start gelling should not be an issue.
I am trying to figure out why I would want to run coolant through the unit. I thought cool fuel was better than warm fuel any day, including the winter. The fuel retuning to the tank seems like it would be plenty warm enough to keep the fuel warm (especially by the time the engine came up to temp, it seem like the fuel would be warm enough too).
It has a built in electronic fuel pre-heater so the cold start gelling should not be an issue.
Our heater cores in the fire trucks have simple shutoff valves inline to keep heat out of the cabs in the summer. The cores remain cool as long as there is no flow. This could easily be installed and turned on when it gets cold. Just an idea.
I think Illflem said even on cold winter days his fuel would get nice and toasty after running. I cant exactly recall but I thought he said nearly 100 degrees after a while (or maybe even more). That was with some very cold ambient temps outside too. I sure hope I'm right with that number.
I think Illflem said even on cold winter days his fuel would get nice and toasty after running. I cant exactly recall but I thought he said nearly 100 degrees after a while (or maybe even more). That was with some very cold ambient temps outside too. I sure hope I'm right with that number.
Ncostello- I agree with you on the "advertising claims". My reasoning on purchasing the unit was that I did not want to replace the factory lift pump and/or add a pusher pump. I want a one time fix that is also an upgrade to what I have existing. The other benefits are better filtration, easier access to the fuel filter and water seperator, plus the ability to pretty much move as much fuel as I will ever need. The other claims of increased horsepower, lower turbo temps, etc. , I have not, and I am not expecting to, see. I do believe that this, by virtue of the capability and quality of the unit, will be my last, needed, upgrade to my fuel system *crossing fingers*. I also believe that I will have some time spent in fine tuning my setup, but I am o. k. with that. Time will definitely tell, especially come winter time. I will definitely keep everyone updated on any issues, good or bad, that I may have.
ChrisOo.
ChrisOo.
I have too many bucks tied up in my fuel system upgrade but am very happy with the results but if my system were stock I would go with the Fass in a heart beat with the addition of larger lines say -8an thruout and I would definatly mount the Fass as close to the tank as possible, I would also try to get the large line clear to the pickup, it is a good rule to follow to have 2 times the size suction line as the discharge .
Cheers,Kevin
Cheers,Kevin
. But for stock trucks it looks like a deal.
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