Firefighters, I got some questions.

[Amianthus]

I wanted to ask those of you on a fire department, what air system do you use for refilling your SCBA bottles? We currently have a cascade system and it sucks. I am trying to get some ideas as to what equipment would be good and what would be bad as far as compressors go. Maint. , warranty, ease of use, capacity, safety, etc. are all considerations.

Second, we are also looking into a utility vehicle for fighting grass fires. Something like a John Deere Gator or a PUG or something. Anyone have a piece of equipment like this? Any recommendations? We would be looking for something that would be multiple wheel drive, winch capable, water capable, equipment capable. Does such an animal exist? Can one be modified for such a task?
Let me know what you guys think about these items. Or if anyone has any ideas or has seen something like I've described, please post it. Thanks.

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'99 2500 ISB QC SLT (No Leather!), 4x4, 5sp w/McLeod, 4:10, BD-II, PE, PE-EZ, 4"exh. , Pac-Brake, A-Pillar gauge pod w/boost and pyro, Line-X, V-1, lights, siren, lic. plt. frame says "Diesel Fumes Make Me Horny!", and much more goofy stuff.

 

[NVR FNSH]

Unimog, Unimog, Unimog... ... . #ad


Brian

 

[Jeff Clark]

We don't have our own system so we have to haul them to the next down to have the bottles filled. They have a cascade system that works good. The acadamy where I take some classes occasionally has a compressor that holds three bottles at a time. I'll have to check the brand next time I'm up there.

I have seen the type of vehicle you are talking about, I just can't remeber who makes it. I'll check some magazines and see what I can find.

 

[Skydiver]

Our VFD uses an older model Dodge 3/4 ton reg. cab long bed. Naturally 4X4. For grass type fires.
Tim

 

[Whitmore]

Amiamthus,Ther are many brands of grade D breathing air compressors out there,these days they are all good,all I have ever seen are 220v,We are currently using the newer system of 4500#, If you are still on the old 2215# packs than there are alot of good used compressors out there as most departments are going to the higher psi one for increased time before bottle change outs,If you are interested than get ahold of your venders and let them know to keep an eye out, alot of these lower psi units are going for 2 to 4 grand and well worth it.
We use the john deere gators at work, we have about 20 or so, we do have 2 that are the 4x6 they would be your best bet at around 8 grand,the only thing I see out of that deal is they would only be good for thansportation and light hauling,You may want to go with a 4x4 truck with a light package on it of 300 gallons of water,these units are quick and get the fire knocked down before they get too big, Kevin

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2001 eth dee,qc,lwb,3. 55,camper and tow pkg,driftwood,cummins e-brake,jardine 4" exhaust,dz alum checker run boards,bed rail,tailgate protector,better built alum checker toolbox with home made fuel tank under box,"CUMN" licence plates and captain vol fire dept plate too

 

[Mactruck]

We were in Jeff's shoes till about 6 months ago. We were using the 30 year old SCOTT 2. 2 (the ones with the elephant trunk #ad
) and went to a nearby town to get our cascade bottles filled (they were mounted in our equipment truck for use on scene and so we could drive them to get filled)

We took delivery last year of the new SCOTT 4. 5's #ad
and because we switched to high pressure bottle's we put in the budget for a new compressor w/ a cascade built in one. This unit could fill 3 bottles at a time.
The benifits of having the cascade w/ the compressor is that the cascade is a nice quiet way of filling your bottles as well as a little faster. You'll find a compressor noisy and takes forever to fill the bottles.
We run the compressor to top off the cascade when we are finished topping of bottles. It's a sweet setup and I'll try to post some pics of it when I go down to the Firehouse this evening for you.

In reference to a brush truck you just can't beat the old Military 4X4 Dodge's and Deuce and a half's. We bought one from one of our neighboring departments and they call us mutual aid all the time to run down some tree's for them because they bought two brand new Phord's and are afraid to get a scratch in the paint #ad

The only problem with them is Maintenence and a lack of parts but they run through ANYTHING!

You could try to get a HUMMER #ad
but they are a ton of Money and are to wide to fit in some of these back woods trails.

I'll get that brand and send you some Pic's


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Kevin MacGranor
2001. 5 D2500 QC SLT 4X4,Auto 295/75r16 BFG AT's, Century Cap, Bedrug, SportComp EGT & Boost gauges, Alpine Head & Amps w/ Boston Acoustic speakers & JL Audio Stealthbox center cushion Sub.
ON ORDER: Reunel rear and Denver Offroad front Bumpers.

 

[Mactruck]

#ad

This is a Bauer Air compressor / Cascade system.
#ad

The left hand side is are the controls for the compressor. The right side is the cascade system. It works real easy.


These are our Brush trucks:
#ad

#ad


You can probably see why the can go through anything #ad




[This message has been edited by Mactruck (edited 04-13-2001). ]

 

[QRTRHRS]

Amianthus

Can't help you with the SCBA but have a suggestion for the other question.

My buddy has a gator 4x6 and his uncle has the Kawasaki Mule. When the going gets slippery, the mule will leave the gator perhaps due to 4x6 as opposed to 6x6. I like the Polaris Ranger 6x6 myself. They won't hual much or mash down trees like a Power Wagon but they would get you there quickly.

 

[HDH]

Hey what a Polaris Ranger? Or Kawasaki Mule.
I have a Polaris 500HO Sportsman ATV and Love it... As Far as the SCBA, I Dont know how the Plant where I work at gets them refilled. BTW Back when I was in USN, We used OBA's.....
Doug.

 

[Amianthus]

Ahh, the days of the OBA. Anything is better than those things. Better not hold on to your hose too tight, you might just run out of air.

Thanks for the responses to date. Mactruck, those are some great rigs you guys got. We are mostly looking into a similar air setup. Mainly for convenience. Is there anything special that you do for your compressor system? Air sampling, tear-down and rebuild, special oil, etc. Any help would be appreciated. BTW, thanks for the effort.

I forgot to mention that we currently have a brush rig. It's a '74 F250. It has been a great brush rig, but it is tired. Because of the trees around here, I was looking for a smaller rig to thread the trees rather than knock them over. Something that can squirt water when needed, at least until we come up with something better. A Unimog would do nicely, but parts would be hard to come by and the issue of going around trees and not over or through them would become an invalid point. A Hummer would be a good idea too, but the same problem would exist.

That compressor is exactly what I was thinking about. But I wanted to know about the different brands of compressors. We still have the IIA's (elephant trunks) and are now going to the 2. 2's (MMR). We still use the 2215 packs. Although with our current system we'd be lucky to get 1900 psi in a jug. Bauer was one I was looking into. Another was Draager. Are there any others? Keep these great ideas coming. You guys are really helping me out. Thanks.

 

[Mactruck]

When we were looking at compressors, One of the brands we were also considering was Poseidon. They are well known mainly for SCUBA tank compressors. But there is little difference between the two.
When you purchase a setup like this you are usually mandated by OSHA or one of these other agencies to have it inspected and tested. Are supplier comes out every year to service test it. If something fails they fix it. They also do the static and hydro testing on the cascade bottles. When they come out they utilize loaners so the system stays in service. In terms of breakdowns and rebuilds these things are designed to run forever. Most Volunteer Depts probably couldn't run the compressor so much as to need a rebuild.
Other than that they suck air from the outside of the building. They have an air filter so you don't suck up dust particles into the bottle and I think it works wonderful compared to our last system.

In reference to our brush trucks they both have 100 gallon tanks on the back. One has a foam injector for the pump and one doesn't. They are nimble enough to get around alot of the trees as well. But sometimes you have to lay a few down #ad

 

[David_VT]

I vote for the UNIMOG. You can get a european fire truck UNIMOG for short money or just a plain jane troop transport for even shorter money. Gas or Diesel.

Our local rescue guys have one of those 6 wheel hunting rigs that I used to see on saturday morning cartoon shows being driven by a bunch of gorillas many many moons ago #ad
#ad
. (very capable but funny looking)

 

[JAK]

Amianthus,
What's wrong with the cascade? The reason I ask is I prefer to fill airpacks with a cascade but if filling the cascade is a major problem then a compressor might be wise. We don't have any problem getting our cascade filled so we let the county worry about compressor maintanance.

For a truly capable off road vehicle check out the Max amphibious vehicle at http://www.maxatvs.com/
or you could try ARGO at http://www.argoatv.com/

Mactruck,
I think you must mean the Scott 2A. The 2. 2 is identical to the 4. 5 except for the pressure reducer.

Jim

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Y2K Driftwood 2500 4X4 5spd

 

[Mactruck]

Your absolutely right I stand corrected. #ad

Got my letters and numbers confused #ad

 

[Amianthus]

I am interested in the UNIMOG idea. Since it appears that ATV's would be overwhelmed by what we would want. Does anyone know where I can begin to look for a UNIMOG that is outfitted as a brush rig? Or one that can be converted without too much expense?

I asked about compressors because the last couple of fires have been brutal to our cascade system. We go through around 16 bottles per fire. We're out of shape, I know. What do you expect in the land of Bratwurst, Beer and Cheese! #ad
Most of our bottles will only get filled to ~1700# of the 2215# (1900# if we're lucky) they are supposed to be. Not to mention, getting refills on the weekend is difficult at best. I agree that the cascade is the way to fill bottles, but a compressor would help immensely. That way we wouldn't have to worry about getting refills. BTW, Mactruck, what did your system cost? It is almost exactly what we are looking for. Thanks.

 

[ClydeJr]

IMHO Bauer is the way to go for SCBA/Scuba cascade/compressor systems. Most of the dealers that I have talked to over the years say the Bauer unit will out last the other brands. As for old systems, my question is why can you only get 1900 psi fills? Do you have a cascade w/o compressor? I have a 3 bottle system at the station and fill bottles like crazy during the summer(d/t diving on my days off) and unless we have a big fire I can keep all of my scba and scuba bottle filled to pressure.


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2001 Dodge 2500 SLT Ext-cab
1985 Ford 250 6. 9L IDI

[This message has been edited by ClydeJr (edited 04-14-2001). ]

 

[Mactruck]

How many bottles do you have in your cascade system? We had four and were always able to get our bottles to at least 2000 PSI. Hopefully some members in your dept. are using it correctly. They might be trying to fill some of their bottles off of the highest pressured bottle. As you may know, that will reduce the amount you are able to put in the bottle. Sometimes you see it happen because members are lazy #ad

I'll get the cost for you. I can't recall right now but $50k sounds right #ad

 

[Amianthus]

We have a four bottle cascade system right now. But we don't have a compressor. So when the bottles get low (after about 4) we are only able to get 1900# if we are lucky. And yes, that is doing it the right way. But the biggest pain is when you go to fill bottles, run the system low, and can't get refills until monday morning. That is why I'm pursuing this.
Bauer sounds like a good brand. I have heard the same about Bauer's reputation also. $50K as in fifty grand??? #ad
#ad
#ad
That was a little more, okay, alot more than I thought they were supposed to cost. WOW! But I must pursue this to it's end. Mactruck, let me know how much it was. Thanks.

Anyone else have any leads on the Unimog?

 

[Fireman Dave]

Aron,

We have a cascade on our command truck, and one in our station. When I first got on, we had nothing and all 2216 bottles. Then we got the portable cascade which we filled at an FD 10 miles away. We got the new cascade in the new station, and now we have all 3000 bottles. The cascade works great for us. We just have to keep out brains refreshed so we don't use it wrong.

We just got our used 3/4 ton Chebby diesel brush rig from the DNR in service. We haven't gotten to use it yet on a wildland fire (too wet). Speaking of which, are you guys sand bagging the Mississippi over there? Just saw it on the local news.

Dave

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2001 2500; SLT; 4x4; QC; LWB; Auto; 3. 54 LS; 265s; Camper; Tow; Sliding Rear Window; Travel Convenience Group; Cab Clearance Lamps; BedRug; Forest Green; Isspro Pyro, Boost, and Trans Temp Gauges; 27' TT

 

[Amianthus]

Nope, not sandbagging. I've asked if we would be asked. Apparently not. But the flooding isn't too bad. I mean it isn't great but there really isn't much fuss about it. Not yet anyway.

We just took delivery of our new combination "jaws". With the 55 lb. "portable" pump. I think I like the old setup better. It's much lighter. But the new jaws are pretty quick and it does do a good job for our backup unit. We also got our new Defib. today. Now we have two. Just in case one is busy or dead or whatever.

BTW, we're doing an extrication demonstration for prom at the High School. Anyone with any pointers?