Ford and GM junk?

[Gary - K7GLD]

Interesting news...



http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/050505/automakers_debt_ratings.html?.v=9

 

[rbattelle]

Meanwhile Kirk Kerkorian is attempting to acquire 9% of GM by offering $31/share. And Toyota is now the #2 auto maker, with GM in their sights. GM's response to Toyota: "well, we've been #1 for 73 consecutive years and we can only assume that will continue". Brilliant strategy.



How long can a company pin their hopes on humdrum vehicles with questionable engineering and poor marketing before it begins to catch up? Certainly the auto market is cyclic, though, and GM and Ford are just in a trough. GM was close to bankruptcy in 1992 and they pulled out of it.



GM's got way too many models, and not enough "exciting" stuff that people really want to run out and buy. And how can you have any respect for a company that would allow things like "skip shift" to be installed on Corvettes and Firebirds?



I'm sure GM will be fine, eventually. It'll be interesting to see what Kerkorian does when he becomes the #3 shareholder in the company. All things considered, a very very interesting time in the automotive world!



-Ryan

 

[rbattelle]

A major shareholder who's name escapes me

I believe that was Kerkorian.



-Ryan

 

[rbattelle]

Check this out.

 

[rbattelle]

I have had the opportunity to work with many engineers. What Lutz says is absolutely true - most of them couldn't tell you what "1/4-20" means, let alone have any clue what Machinery's Handbook is all about.



I'm not saying anything about their character - I've known lots of engineers who were great people but didn't know muffler bearings from blinker fluid.



Real problems happen when they start thinking that some fancy-pants degree makes them somehow "smarter" or "better" than the machinists and technicians that are out there on the "front lines". I find it much more common with young engineers than with old.



Truly it is a shame that young folks aren't into tinkering anymore. I can only hope my kids take the same interest in tinkering that I have. It was a real shame back in the early '90s when everyone said "we don't need machine shops anymore, we can model everything on the computer! Toss out all the machines and stop teaching them in school!"



-Ryan

P. S. - yup, we're way off topic now!

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"P. S. - yup, we're way off topic now!"



'Twasn't that serious a topic anyway - no big deal - and ANY idiot KNOWS that 1/4 of 20 is 5... . :-laf :-laf



(now we'll see how many "engineers" we get in THIS thread) :-laf :-laf

 

[klenger]

Hey, I'm an engineer, and I know what 1/4-20 means. It's the thread used on all cameras for a tripod mount. Of course, I learned that before I was an Engineer.

 

[Monstar]

I am an engineer and every day I deal with engineers who haven't a clue when it comes to real life parts. They can make buitiful solid models but... .



A couple of weeks ago I had a guy who wanted to press a shaft into a hole. This 1. 5" dia shaft with a . 0005 interfereance fit was supposed to take 440 lb-ft of torque without slipping...



I would like to see more young people tinker too, but think about the cars that they have to work on. It is alot more fun to work on a classic car than one of our modern black box controlled trucks.



C

 

[DValentine]

I think we are heading toward a crash. American arrogance is to blame. The educational system generally does not support those who want to go into the trades. How do we turn it around? I fought the college VS vocational school with my family for years. Went to college for 6 years and came out with a 2 year associates in Diesel..... a long and expensive, winding road. Now I am in the world of welding... . where I run into engineers who are to smart for their own good. Not to bash engineers or smart people, but some of the guys who design things need to get out of the chair and see if they will really work in the real world. The smartest people I have be around are the guys who came from the ground up... teaching themselves the numbers from books and trial and err. Being handed information in class does not make one smart. Human nature has not changed, just technology. The youth of today might be thought of as lazy, but the technological world has allowed this to happen to a large degree. But again I ask, how do we change the path we are on? Europeans have had the right ideas for a long time... . kids are given a choice as to which way to go... college or vocation and then brought along the chosen path with all resources available. Vocation is not shunned like it is here in the states as a second rate, losers only take auto shop, kind of mentality. I have run up against some of the blue blood, white collar mentality and I ask them " do you what some punk working on your brakes or a guy who knows what he is doing, and is well trained for the job? I'll get off my soap box. It has just burned me for a long time. Vocational trades are not the ******* child.



I guess I am really off the topic.

 

[RGardner]

I have always said that an engineer should have to be out in the field working on the products that he designs for 3 years before he can design another one! I believe that would make them think a little harder before the next product snafu!

 

[MMiller]

I've got an open seat in my service truck for any engineers that want to ride around with me and just watch me work every day. Then they too will shake their heads and say, "why in the heck did we make it that way??"



Michael

 

[RDupree]

i have a friend that teachs machine shop/tool and die making at the local high school and at the same classroom at nite to collage students. hes a great teacher,been there 17 years and came here from P. R. where he was a professor. the school just closed his program down,no more machine shop school for our whole county,and now the collage has no machine shop course either. they told my buddy he could teach spanish or retire early. even though he can't afford to retire,he did. . too bad,we need hands on schools!