From A Vendors Veiw Point?

[South Bend Clutch]

My name is Peter and I own South Bend Clutch. Some of you may know me and some of you may not.



I must say that the roasting that the TDR members gave Banks would have made Dean Martin proud.



Being a vendor and a part of a great forum such as this shows me that a great product does not sell itself. It is how the unavoidable problems are resolved that make the difference. Face it, as a vendor there are going to be some problems. Being a avid reader, sometimes I wonder if it would be unethical to reply to someone's experience with me and my company. Will it make the person feel as though I am watching over their every move? I have replied to some negative post about our company and it seemed to create quit a ster. It was not my intent to protect my image (good or bad) but to try and resolve the problem. As we all have experienced at one time or another, What you write has no expression and may not come out like you wanted.



To get to the point, as a vendor, would it be better that we just read and remain silent and correct the problem with the individual behind the scenes or bring it to the table for all to add their opinion?



This is important to me because it has weighed on me wondering if my presence is appreciated or does it intimidate.



Peter

 

[klenger]

It seems to me that it would be better for the vendor to work out the problems behind the sceens, and then let the member who posted the topic decide if they want to post the results. I expect that most members would give a fair report. My $. 02

 

[tntway]

???

i don't really know peter. haven't had any problems with any vendors, just the big brown truck. looking at it globally from both sides, however, probably the thing to do would be to post publicly

to the party to make contact. either them to you orvice versa. this would show the readers the you are attempting to rectify the situation. after the problem is resolved, let the other person post results or opinion. don't think it should be hashed out on the board tho'. sorry i was soooo long, but you asked...

 

[HeberRam]

Don't air dirty laundry

I agree with klenger. The problem or problems should be handled off-line. There usually are two sides to every problem. Most Vendors, who are businessmen, will try to resolve the problem quickly... Those that do, are sucessful. Often, large companies don't spend the time in dealing with problems which eventually hurt their business. I look at problems as oportunties, take the negative and turn them into postives. I know first hand in my business. . The faster you handle the negatives and turn them into positives, the more rewarding and sucessful your business will be. You can't please everyone 100% of the time, however, I put 110% into the 1% of negatives to try to achieve that goal. In addition, your employees will act only as you do. If your not service orientated, your employees won't be either. Constant monitoring and employee training is key to any business.



Peter, you and your company are doing a fine job, keep up the good work and you have nothing to worry about. .



P. S. A vendor should always respond to any on-line attack, by a dis-satistfied customer. True facts need to be brought out in the open. This provides a vendor an opportunity to turn a negative into a positive, even if he has to eat crow!

 

[Bob Beauchaine]

Maybe I'm not reading this quite right but it would seem to me that if a problem got posted the damage has been done by one side or the other. If a problem was not resolved before someone went on line with it - after working off line with the vendor - something is wrong with either the vendor on the consumer. To me this would give the vendor every right to respond on line. On the other hand if the consumer didn't try off line the same rules apply. If the vendor did not make a good faith effort to correct to problem then we as potential consumers need to know about these problems.

I have always tried to resolve a problem with a vendor one on one with a great deal of success. If I am not happy with a vendor, their product or their comitment to their consumers I won't buy from them or recomend them again.

Word of mouth can make or break a vendor.

Happy Trails

 

[BigDaddy]

From a Customers Viewpoint

Peter,



Although, I did not respond in the Banks post, nor do I have a clutch, I was touched by you concern on the subject and felt the need to express my opinion.



I have posted comments about different products and vendors in this forum with the sole intent to provide useful information to the membership. Whether, positive or negative and not as a way to vent, ridicule or promote sales.



I agree a great product cannot sell itself. It must be backed with a great price, warranty, customer service, and technical support. The product must be installed or shipped in an expeditious manner and meet or exceed the customer’s expectations as claimed by the manufacturer or its representative.



The days of great quality products, at high prices and no support are over. Today’s consumer wants a quality product, at a competitive price and the support to remedy any problems that may arise.



“Face it, as a vendor there are going to be some problems”, Peter said. It is the ability of the vendor to provide the aforementioned bits and pieces and handle the problems that determine their worth.



Peter, you said, “What you write has no expression and may not come out like you wanted. ” Well, forums/posts can be a funny thing. Unless you are a proficient writer, most people express themselves in a post, as they would speak in conversation. Lacking the tone and clarity one uses in conversation. This does not always reflect one’s true meaning and the forum reader should keep this in mind. However, if done tastefully and with discretion, I am sure all will get the idea of the writer. Is “roasting” really the term you wanted to use?



I would welcome a manufacturer or vendor’s response to any of my posts regarding their product, support, etc. Their response would provide useful information to the membership as well and should not be censored. Their response too would evaluate their worth.



Respectfully Yours,



Joseph Jahr

 

[Bob Wagner]

clap clap clap

Bravo BigDaddy well said...

 

[DieselB59]

Well, being a vendor and a customer at the same time, I know how both feel. I own my own truck and at times, buy things for it without going through the shop. If a service doesn't do what it's supposed to do, I try and make ammends person to person. If that person who is supposed to be a customer service representative forgets that the words "customer service" are in his title and that he "represents" his company and can either make them look very good or very bad, I'll take my issues to that person's immediate supervisor. If the trail of communication that I must make an effort to escalate keeps running into doors being slammed in my face, then I have no choice but to let the public know that John Q Vendor is not a reputable business to spend your money at and that he is not the only store on the block who can fulfill your needs. Sometimes a whole lot of good comes from some bad. I used to work for a major retail establishment that dominates the east coast. Their stance on customer service is take care of the customer's needs, no matter what they are. Never leave a customer unsatisfied. It takes years to build a customer following, but only seconds to lose one. Take a customer and do what it takes to make them happy and even if they were intially unsatisfied, they will still tell people about how you resolved their problem. Let them leave and they will trash you all over the place, wherever they go. This, in the dawn of the twenty first century includes the World Wide Web. It's something that every vendor has to keep in the back of their mind when dealing with a delicate situation. And there really is no right way to do things ever time. Each customer and situation requires a unique solution and each person will respond differently to different treatment. Whether you are a one person operation or a staff of a thousand, each person holds the weight of the company's reputation on them while acting as a member of the company.

 

[Archive]

Originally posted by South Bend Clutch

To get to the point, as a vendor, would it be better that we just read and remain silent and correct the problem with the individual behind the scenes or bring it to the table for all to add their opinion? Peter

First, your presence is appreciated by me.



Second, to read and remain silent would not tell the whole story. That would not be fair to the vendor. There are some people that will never be pleased with anything you do. You should be able to post what you have tried to solve the situation... as you have done in the past.



Another factor is that once a person gets something in their mind, doesn't really matter what you post... they may read it, but not really see what they have read. We all have our quirks in life!



Post away!

 

[OILBRNR]

long soap box rant

I started out on this forum (when it was FREE, and Rob was in charge) and TST's mailing list back in '97-'98. Banks name popped up now and then, and always by the newbies. Those with knowledge alway chuckled, 'YOU PAID THAT MUCH FOR XXX GAIN!!!" The positives for Banks were few compared to the negatives. And I don't think that this was always centered on the results, as much as it was the cost for the performance. Bottom line, they sell or have sold items to guys at high prices that were never really justified for the results received. I'm not saying that the items didn't add a few HP or FT/Lbs, but the ROI is just not there. That bothers me #1.



#2, I have read several post over the years where Banks telemarkets their customers and tried to sell them more stuff. Hmm... Now if Bill K called me and said, "Look we've got a better TC then the one you have now, and I'll give you a trade in on upgrade," or "We have a new mod for our VB, that will really fit your application," I'd appreciate it and listen to what he had to offer. But the posts I've read on Banks, it was always to sell more of their product, at a premium price, that really didn't add that much more output. And aggressive selling tactics at that. Sorry, that doesn't fly with me, nor did it with the posters' threads.



#3 Does a small vendor like South Bend, Edge, VA or DTT have a place on this forum. Yes. Esp. if they have true value added benefit to the TDR membership as a whole. However, if a customer has a unrealistic gripe, take it off-line as much as possible.



#4 Did Banks deserve the flame that it got here, um yes it did from what I've read over the years. I'm really suprised it didn't happen sooner. Don't get me wrong, their products are not junk, but those that I have met personally, (4, not a large sampling set granted) have all admitted that they could have gotten more for their $$ out of TST (12v) or Edge/DD (24v) than what they paid Banks.



Our Cummins engines are an annomaly (sp?) in that they really only need more fuel. Not more PSI (generally), or a better intake/exhaust (towing with +fuel, yes), or intercooler (sans the pre '94's). That left Banks with few items to market that really count (a dual ram intake, gimme' a break!), but a huge untapped and LOYAL market. That market is now bitting them on their collective butt, and so be it. Welcome to the free market.



If you give customers good value for their hard earned money, and top notch service to back it up, you'll be rewarded. Do the opposite, don't be suprised when your burned at the stake. Members of this forum do not have some sort of hidden agenda, we're just supporting one another the best we can. At least I hope.



Sorry that this was so long, but this comes after YEARS of reading posts on this type of topic.

 

[DAWG-1]

Peter keep up your comments

With the knowledge you have given on this forum, don't sit back and read. Thanks for the very fast response to my info request. That also helps keep customers at eaze .



I personally have a gripe with a vendor, not living up to there advertised warrenty, or 60 day money back guarrenty, not getting back to me after 5 days and counting. There more but all I wanted was to exchange it for a more powerful one and I am willing to pay the difference. I will warn members of their business practices if it is not resolved by the first of next week.



Keep up the great service Peter, I will be buying a clutch in the near future. Sam

 

[RottnDogue]

Originally posted by klenger

It seems to me that it would be better for the vendor to work out the problems behind the sceens, and then let the member who posted the topic decide if they want to post the results. I expect that most members would give a fair report. My $. 02

\



I agree with Ken, deal with it behind the scenes, let the customer tell the story which I think they will do truthfully. The best thing about TDR and Other boards like it, and there are others... ... (That don't come across all high and mighty) is the consumer has a voice. Remember there is strength in numbers... . Some vendors (not saying Banks because I have no experience with them) that would ignore you, but once you are not 1 but 3000 then all of a sudden they want to hear what you have to say. If you have a bad experience, or good one with a vendor I want to know. A lot of people make similar quality products... . And I work hard for my money so if product is similar, price is similar, then customer service wins. I actually don't mine spending more if the customer service is good. Piss me off and you could have the best product for the cheapest price, and You'll DIE before I give you any of my money.



P. S. I joined TDR so I could post and ask questions of the members here... ... . Not so I could pay $9. 00 per issue of a magazine I can get for FREE when 3 people I know are done with it.



Darren

 

[BIG BOB]

Peter and all venders,



There is always 2 sides to a story or problem, If one person post on a topic that accuses some else, I feel you should have a chance to respond and defend yourself. This is not a one way forum. I don't think it matters if you are a vendor or not. Vendors are a very valuable and important part to this forum, and their input is alway appreciated by me!



Peter, keep up the good work!

 

[ACoyle]

This website is for all of us to exchange information. Both good and bad. We use it to share knowledge, both technical and purchasing. We have developed a sort of frindship with each other. Strange term, because, most of us have not met each other.



I have seen vendors agree and disagree with each other as well as members. Also across lines, (Vendor to customer). This is all in the family, so to speak. Frineds sometimes get out of hand and that is when moderators come into play.



I greatly appreciate being able to post a question and get good, fast, quality answers. I appreciate knowing if a product or vendor is good or bad for my truck.



I operate a computer consulting business, so I am a vendor in that world. I would say that I would appreciate it if my customers came to me with problems. It it then up to me to resolve them. If I do not, They will most surely go "public". This is the way of business. I have seen members post here before they have attempted resolution with the supplier / manufacturer. I would disagree with that.



As to vendors being here. In our situation, many of our vendors are also manufactureres and customers themselves. Thye have more experience than we do "Pushing the envelope". I for one welcome their experience.

 

[Expat]

Peter,



I certainly appreciate having you and other vendors on the board (although I agree with the rule that all vendors should identify themselves). Vendor presence brings a much greater level of expertise than we would have otherwise.



Personally, if a post has an identifiable complaint and is written with at least a minimum of respect, I would prefer to see a vendor comment. The recent post about Banks sounded pretty legit to me. If a Banks rep wants to disagree, I'd be more than willing to listen. Fair is fair.

 

[John]

Very well said BigDaddy and especially DieselB59! Chris, you really have a handle on how to effectively deal with customers and keep them for life.

 

[RottnDogue]

Originally posted by BIG BOB

Peter and all venders,



There is always 2 sides to a story or problem, If one person post on a topic that accuses some else, I feel you should have a chance to respond and defend yourself. This is not a one way forum. I don't think it matters if you are a vendor or not. Vendors are a very valuable and important part to this forum, and their input is alway appreciated by me!



Peter, keep up the good work!

Ok, What I wanted to say and what I said where two different things..... Huh who da thunk it. I don't think the vendor should use this board as a place to air a problem they are having with a customer (unless it's anonymous, or just plain funny) but should definitely respond if they feel they have been wronged by a customer. I just think if the vendor is the one to air the problem first, even if they are right it just wouldn't look professional of the vendor to do so. JMHO



Darren

 

[South Bend Clutch]

BigDaddy,



What you wrote was very elegant. You definitely have a flair for putting words on paper.



One of the things that you wrote stuck out to me.

The days of great quality products, at high prices and no support are over. Today’s consumer wants a quality product, at a competitive price and the support to remedy any problems that may arise.

One time I saw a plaque on a wall at a reputable business that stated-----



Price, Quality, Service, Pick Two



As I drove away I thought long and hard about that. I quickly ran the sequences through my head and came to the conclusion that if a company tries to provide all three, they will just exist. There will not be money for growth. You did say a competitive price but a company can not provide quality and service and then get into a price war. Someone will lose, either their company or their customers.



I loved the phrase and made my own plaque





Peter

 

[BIG BOB]

Darren,



Excellent point and example. I agree with you completely! Sometimes what we say or type is not always what we mean.



Thank you for pointing that out.

 

[Sled Puller]

If a customer has a Major problem with a vendor, and DOES NOT post his dissatifaction, his he not being a traitor to the TDR Members? Not warning his club of a pitfall?



Gene