Front Suspension - bags only install?

[HoleshotHolset]

Anyone ever replace the OEM coil springs with a set of bags and call it a day?



How much lower than OEM could you get a 2500 4x4 by deflating the bags?



I'm not a suspension expert by any stretch of the imagination... . but would like to hear other folks' experiences.



I'm trying to figure out ways I can fit my truck into the underground parking where I now live... . There's lots of pipes and stuff down there that I wouldn't like to hit with the roof, etc. I *think* my truck was 6'6" (78") the last time I measured it... and that would JUST BARELY fit down there... .



It rides like crap now, so maybe bags would be a win-win solution...



Matt

 

[David Muench]

Yep, me. I have the Keldermain air ride front setup, but the 0-2" which doesn't involve control arms or a track bar bracket.



Just bags, bag mounts, and new shocks.



I haven't even put a compressor in yet - the air lines from my bags go up into the engine compartment and terminate with a valve stem type fitting. I add a bit of air every couple months to level the truck back out again.



This year I plan to put an air system in the truck (probably from Brad Kilby), and hook up the bags so I can inflate/deflate them at will. Maybe I can even get some of those valves from Kelderman that let it auto-level. .



Oh, and I haven't tried deflating the bags all the way. . But basically you could deflate it to your bumpstops, provided your shocks were the right length and you had the right amount of clearance in the fenders.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

David: Thanks for your input.



Interesting... sounds like I could deflate the bags and make the truck squat a bit so that it will fit in the garage.



Hrmmm... I like the sound of this so far... .



Keep the comments coming!!



Matt

 

[JIM S.]

no useable info..

just ttt cause it sounds like somthing I could be iterested in some time in the future... when I have piles of money

jim

 

[HoleshotHolset]

Kelderman gets 9-bills for 2 bags and some brackets for the 2nd Gen 4x4's... that's a bit insane, IMHO.



The bags by themselves aren't even close to 1/2 that price... and the brackets are very uncomplicated.



Back to the drawing board...



Matt

 

[nfox]

Front Air Bags

I just got done helping out a friend install a set of front air bags on a 96 4x4 ram ctd. The bags cost $200. 00 and the steel was $50. 00, and the end result is amazing on how much better it rides. My buddy runs his pick up setting level front ot rear and when he dumps the air out of the front bags it will drop down to the bump stops, and it really makes working on the motor really easy. When my air compressor shows up i am doing my front air bags very soon. Oo.

 

[mdivincentis]

Hmmmm.....



nfox, can you give up some P/Ns, pictures etc... ?

$250. 00 sounds pretty good.



Matt

 

[Snow man]

nfox,im very interested too,id love to see how the setup looks.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

nfox: Snag some pics of that setup!!!! We're all VERY interested!!



In the meantime... this should wet our appetites... and further strengthen my argument that $900 is too much for 2 bags and some brackets... .



Taken from this website.



#ad




Bear in mind that this pic is from one of the ATS dude's truck... and it is lifted a bit in the front... in which case, the bracket would be shorter for most of us that don't need a lift.



Matt

 

[Sticks]

Originally posted by mdivincentis

Hmmmm.....



nfox, can you give up some P/Ns, pictures etc... ?

$250. 00 sounds pretty good.



Matt

Ditto! I have firestone bags on the rear, and Ranchos were in my future. I would really like to see this setup for the $$$.

 

[jrandol]

Wow! For the $$ I am interested. I would like the Kelderman setup but I think it is a little rich for my blood right now. Have the air on the truck already, would be interested in this deal for sure.

 

[David Muench]

Honestly, I've been keeping my mouth shut so far. . But I don't think you're giving Kelderman enough credit.



$900 also includes a pair of RS9000X shocks ($150), air lines/fittings, and the bottom bracket that you don't have a picture of yet. Granted, none of the brackets, bottom included, are rocket science. But the bottom is more complex than the two tops.



Bottom line - I am happy with my kit from Kelderman and I think it was worth the price. I couldn't of fabricated the same thing in the less than a day it took me to install the Kelderman kit.



However, I am not saying you shouldn't try to build your own. There are pictures in my album that may help you out, but they don't show everything since there are no pictures of the brackets uninstalled.

 

[nfox]

Front air bags

The bags we ended up using are firestone #5401, they are rated at 3000lbs a piece, which is more than enough for the front of our trucks, for brackets we used a pipe that was was 3/8 thick by 6"id, it was just enough inside diameter to fit into the spring pocket were the coil used to set. , We cut off a piece of that 6" id pipe, 3" tall and then we cut a piece 3/8 flat steel, the same diameter as the bottom of the air bag and drilled two holes into the flat that lined up with the holes in the bottom of the air bag and then we centered that piece of flat onto the 3" tall pipe that was cut earlier and welded it to the pipe, bottom bracket done. For the top we did the same as the bottom, but flipped it over,so the pipe fit up into the spring pocket and the flat was cut the same diameter as the top of the air bag and two holes drilled into the flat that lined up with the holes in the top of the air bag bolted to the top of the air bag, then in the side of the top pipe was cut a small opening for the air line to go through the the round pipe into the air bag fitting. Then on the top piece of pipe we welded three tabs to the inside of the pipe that lined up with the shock tower bolt holes and bolted the top piece of pipe to the shock tower. The bottom pipe we are doing some testing, we are just letting it sit on the axle bracket and we have not fastened it down ,yet!!!, no problems so far , but we going to fasten it down when we get more time in the shop, My buddy doesn't drive his truck in the winter time, no salt or snow on this truck since it was new in 1996. For our shock brackets we went to the front side of the axle, and did some fabrication of a couple of brackets and the original top shock tower bracket was modified and reused, i hope i didn't confuse you to much with my long explaination, i will find someone with a digital camera and post some pictures, so you can look at our bracketry, and see what you think, it is pretty simple to do if you got a day and and a welder and away to cut some pipe and flat and a drill. Feel free to ask any other questions. , I am almost positive that pipe was 6" id, it has been two months ago since the install, my memory is a bit foggy on this measurent, you may want to measure your spring pocket make sure that this is the correct size. Later!!Oo.

 

[Sticks]

Nfox,



You said that you were going to do yours right? Take REAL good notes on measurements and steps, and have your wife/girlfriend with a camera looking over your shoulder all day. Lots of interested people want to see the results and the "How to"

 

[Snow man]

David , i was thinking the same thing as you. The time invloved bulding your own setup would be better spent on overtimr at work,and get the right setup ,bolt it on and dont worry about it. I have blizzard 810 snow plow its around 1000lbs do you think these bags could handle that load,my front axle is about 6000 loaded.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

I can't get any overtime hours where I work... so there goes that idea.



6" pipe and some flat stock..... seems simple enough.



Too bad my welding equipment and fully equipped garage is back in MA!!! Grrrr!!



The explanation is good, but just like the old saying... . pictures are worth a thousand words. Sounds like you added 3" to the top and bottom of the airbag? That's where I kinda lost you...



Matt

 

[mdivincentis]

Seems we're onto something good... .

If I can get a good idea of what works and what everybody wants, I'd be interested in fabricating some kits. I could get them powdercoated too.



Matt

 

[HoleshotHolset]

That's the spirit!



Matt

 

[HoleshotHolset]

Here's a good pic I snagged from the Readers Rigs gallery:



#ad




Matt

 

[Sticks]

I tried to make a post this morning about the above picture. That is exactly what I was looking for.

[iThs mornings attempt to post[/i]

Anybody know what the solution is if a bag ruptures while you are on the road? You can't exactly put a tire patch on it.



Carry a spare bag in the tool box?



I would be up for the bracket kits after a little more testing for wear. Any possibility of basically making an adapter to mount the bag to the OEM spring tower with the shock mount as the attachment point on the top and bottom, or are the dynamics of the whole unit going to change to much with the leverage? Like the top and bottom plate sitting where the spring sits, and the mounts would be where the shock mounted up to keep it attached, then just the outside brackets for the shock, preferably for the same size as OEM?