Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Fuel filter change... need some help...

[Behr]

Ok... . I did my first fuel filter change. Drained the canister... removed the old filter and O ring... cleaned the water sensor... but I could use some longer fingers for that. . partialy filled the canister with new fuel... . re-installed the new filter with new o ring... and was sure not to cross thread plastic cap.

Now I have cycled the lift pump about 6 times... . then the truck started ... ran for about 5 to 10 seconds... then died. I have cycled the lift pump about another 8 or 10 times... but still no go... .

Any hints... any advice... ??? or message me thru email...

 

[Fireman Dave]

Starting, then dying right after is normal. You probably need to crank it longer - it'll feel like a lifetime, but it will probably fire. In my case, I have to give it some pedal to get it to light. You don't want to crank it too long without rest because of the starter. But 15 seconds fells like forever when you're used to it firing after 1 second.



By the way, mine goes in for a new lift pump next week. Keep that in mind. I think that's why mine doesn't start very easily after the filter change. If you don't have one - get a fuel pressure gauge. My pump is bad - reads zero most of the time now. It runs fine though. Without the gauge, I wouldn't know it was bad. I say all of this assuming you have a 24 valve?

 

[24V-DSL]

Gordon.....



If you haven't already, read this, especially the starting part. Sounds like you're not "bumping" the starter correctly. If you're in a quiet place, you should be able to hear the lift pump running for ~30 seconds.



http://dodgeram.org/tech/dsl/filter/00fuel_filter.htm

 

[Behr]

Hi 24V - DSL... .



I did read the link you passed on to me... and I pretty well followed everything to the letter when I did it...



Should I just keep bump starting it ... ??? Just keep cycling... ??

 

[Fireman Dave]

Try cranking it longer without stopping - a good 15 seconds or more. Give it some pedal too.

 

[DarrellB]

WD-40

Sounds like you have some air in the injector lines. You can crack an injector line or just give her a shot of WD-40. Take a can of WD-40 and while someone turns the engine over spray a little into the air intake, this will get her running again.



Don't worry, the truck's not going to explode or anything just give it a few squirts and it will fire up, may run a little funny for a few seconds but once the air is out of the lines she'll pur like a kitten again.



DB

 

[24V-DSL]

Defining terms is difficult... .



Did you, have you "bumped" the starter as described in the link?



Can you hear your lift pump "running" for ~30 seconds after the "bump"?



Are you saying that you can't get the truck to run at all... . even for a few seconds before dying?



If these are accurate, and you've done this 3-5 times and it still won't start, you might have air in the lines.



Cycling... . to me it means you are just turning the ignition key to the "on" and then "off" position a few times and then firing the truck. If that's what you're doing, the lift pump won't push enough fuel to keep you running beyond a few seconds. You have to have that "millisecond" bump to make the lift pump do it's work.



Not intending to insult your intelligence..... it's just hard to be clear with this kinda communication.....

 

[Behr]

Mission Accomplished.....

Hi 24VDSL... .

Ok... . its up and running... . Phewwwwww.. .

Actually I will admit the first two times I did just turn the key to the on position..... when I realized the lift pump was only running for about 5 seconds ... . then I turned it to the off position then bump started... just enough to hear the starter click on the flywheel... then released the key... pump cycled for about 20 seconds or so. Did that for about 5 times... . then turned the key to start the truck... . it did start... ran for about 5 to 10 seconds then died. It appears that it takes anywhere from 10 to 20 bumps after that before she did finally fire up... ... ...

I appreciate your help and advice.

I did drop you a quick email... .

 

[HC]

By now it's probably all over, but just in case, did you use the schrader valves to bleed any air? I found that bumping the lift pump helps, but it helps a lot more if after each bump (and I mean just turning the key off and then on), if I removed the schrader cap and pushed in on the stem I could bleed some air. There is one near the fuel filter; a second near the injection pump. You could just bleed the one near the injection pump several times, until instead of air it's squirting pure diesel.



Edit: Yep, you posted "success" as I was typing the above. I'll leave the post for others to consider when it's their turn.

 

[Behr]

Hello everyone... .



Just want to thank all of you... .

Fireman Dave..... DarrellB..... 24V-DSL ..... and HC...

for your help , comments and advice.

I was hoping I would not have to crack an injector line...

was just hoping air lock would find it own way out...

Sure can not beat the sound of a Cummins when they

fire up... .

Thanks again everyone.....

 

[Fireman Dave]

Glad to hear you got it going. I know the feeling. Now get that fuel pressure gauge - a must-have for 24 valves!

 

[24V-DSL]

Gordon....

You're welcome... . and, welcome to the TDR. Hope you don't have to build your post count like this again



After seven fuel filter changes, I still hold my breath when trying to start.

 

[Behr]

Well... when I do my next change..... I will know what to expect... .



I did notice on the side of the fuel filter housing ... . the side closest to the firewall a stem sticking out with what looks like a valve cover off your car tire. Little larger though... it seems to be only on finger tight.



What is it... ?? Is it some type of bleeder for removing the air out of the fuel system... . ??



Also... is it recommended to put in a fuel guage. . ??

and should it be a permanent installation... or temporary and only to be used on filter changes... ??



I should have joined TDR when I first got my truck... . there is a wealth of info on here... .



Gordon... .

 

[Fireman Dave]

Put in a permanent fuel pressure gauge. 24 valve lift pumps are notorious for failing. If it's bad long enough before you know it - the injection pump will be next - that's the expensive one.



Also, I hope you aren't buying your filters from the dealer. Fuel filter at the dealer = overpriced by 4-5 times what you can get it for from Geno's or a local Cummins dealer.

 

[EricBu12]

Gordon,

Welcome to the lift pump Fiasco !

Go to the search area and search under Lift pump and read for an entire weekend!! no kidding.



The thing is, depending on how many miles are on your truck, the lift pump wears out and pre-maturely at that... . Electrical pumps are made to push, not pull. . and the distance this pulls, wears out the contacts for the elec. motor too soon.



SO, what to do?... ... I did a pusher pump back near the tank and a "rock catcher" 30 micron filter and water separater before the pump to help keep the pumps clean. The rear pump is a 7# 100GPH. pump to aleviate the need on the forward pump.



A guage is very, VERY well recomended. alot of us have the pillar mounts for guages. I have boost, pyro, (for Exhaust temp) and Fuel Pressure. I mounted the FP guage sensor after the second Pump (by top filter) and use it as a guide for when things go wrong. so far, (knock on wood) everythings good.



you don't want too much PSI at the inj. pump and not too little.



I have 13 idle, 10-12 cruise, and no less than 8 WOT. (I have power mods as well).



That thing you saw that has a dust cap is the schrader valve for bleeding air when priming. when the pump is running for the 30 sec, go quick to it and bleed it to see if air gets out.

here is my setup of the filter and aux pump



<img src=https://www.turbodieselregister.com/user_gallery/sizeimage.php?&photoid=1086&width=2/src img>



Good luck

 

[Behr]

Hi Fireman Dave...



Well line me up in the firing squad... I bought this filter at the local Dodge dealership... . I got hosed.



Spent 64. 90 Cdn / 42. 00 US...



When I got back to the shop I check with Cummins up here and was told $18. 00 Cdn / 12. 50 US...



I would have taken it back... but Cummins were not going to have any in till mid week... and I really wanted to get this done.



Trust me... will not be going back to the dealer for that.



Oil filters are not to bad... Mopar run me about 9. 00 Cdn / 6. 00 US... .



I did not notice any dirt as such in my fuel canister... . the fuel I did drain out looks real clean. I only buy from major oil companies... Sunoco... Esso (Exxon) and Shell ... . etc.



Does the lift pump run continously once the truck is running... ??



Have to admit this is one great website to post comments and views and great place for people to get help when needed... .





Gordon...

 

[EricBu12]

the hoses you see is the routing for incase the pump fails.



The top left is a one way check valve so the front pump can pull around the rear pump if needed but doesn't allow fuel to be pushed back to the filter from the rear pump, just goes straight to the front.



the top hose going to the right to the filter is from the tank and I have a bal valve to close off when changing the filter so no diesel gets on me. also serves as a theft deterant, close it and truck don't run!



the pump was wired to the front pump through a relay. the wires from the filter which has a water sensor and a filter restriction sensor goes to a warning guage that is on my dash.

 

[EricBu12]

Heres another pic of where I put it. I have a shortbed. if you have a longbed, then you have enough room on the frame to do this



<img src=https://www.turbodieselregister.com/user_gallery/sizeimage.php?&photoid=1085&width=2/src img>

 

[DarrellB]

Don't get too scared

Behr, Don't get too freeked out. I still have my stock lift pump on my truck 75,000 miles and still pumping strong. I use a temporary gauge set up to test mine. You can go here Black Mountain Diesel.com and they can hook you up with the gauge set up I'm running. It's called the Briar Hopper Test Gauge. I test my fuel pressure at every oil change. I just take and tape the gauge to the windshield and go for a quick drive. The gauge works great and it keeps me form having to clutter up my truck with more gauge pods. When you do test the lift pump just make sure the fuel pressure doesn't drop below 8psi at Wide-Open-Throttle, and you'll be in good shape. If it does go lower it's time for a new pump.



You can also PM Briar Hopper and ask him about the gauge, he's a member right here on this site, and one heck of a good guy.



Have a good weekend.



DB

 

[24V-DSL]

Gordon....something else

It will possibly be helpful and time saving in the future if you'll create a truck profile in your regular profile. All anyone knows tonight is that you're posting in the 24 Valve forum. Some problem solutions are sometimes model yr. specific. I just keep mine in the profile 'cause it's now too long for TDR parameters. I could shorten it, but I use it as a reminder of how much $$$$$ I've dumped in this truck:-laf