Getrag is dead

[dusthomps]

After the worst sounding 10k I've ever put on my truck, the Getrag is now dead. Lost 4th gear last night while pulling 35k. Maybe not the best thing for it, but hopefully the rebuild will make it to 223k like this one did. A bit of info that I know Bill G. is waiting to hear. Getrag ran on ATF from roughly 35k until 211k when I made the switch to Mobil 1 5w-30. After switching to 5w-30 small problems began showing up. Dropping out of 5th gear while going down the highway, excessive grinding in 4th, and howling in 4th and 5th. Makes me wonder if I should have stayed with ATF. I also doubt that ATF hid all these problems, never know. I'll begin putting in a rebuilt transmission on Monday or Tuesday, but I'm currently undecided whether I'll go back to ATF with this one, or stick with the Mobil 1.





Dustin

 

[Paychk]

Dustin



I would ask the company that is rebuilding your trans for they're suggestions for the lube. Especially if there is a warranty on it!

 

[bgilbert]

Dustin, I'm sorry to hear about your transmission. Yes, I was waiting for an update on the switch from ATF. I can get ATF for nothing from brother in laws shop, after hearing this, I'm going to try some ATF probly Monday. My getrag isnt getting any better, howling at the moon in 5th. Can't hurt to try. I will post after I switch and tell if there is any changes good or bad. Bill

 

[AMikonis]

Bill, I don't think think changing to ATF is going to help if your Getrag is howling in 5th gear. My current truck was howling in 5th when I bought it. The rear bearing in the trans was shot. It was about $12 for the bearing and 3 or 4 hours labor including the r&r, no special tools required. The rest of the trans looked fine and I've been driving it for two years since. Have had similar experiences with two other Getrags. It's more expensive if you wait for them to go "boom"...

 

[dpuckett]

While you guys have them apart, dont forget to help the trannies out by overfilling them a bit. That helps quiet noise, or it has in the 3 or 4 I've had.

Daniel

 

[drives mopars]

nv 4500 go

nv 4500 is bestset up period i did it





trust me it works



bill

 

[bgilbert]

Well, I drained it and refilled with ATF. About 5 quarts. Figured I'd overfill by 1. 5 qts instead of 1. Didnt really notice any difference in shifting, maybe a little quieter through the gears, but as AMikonis said it did not change the howling or noise in 5th gear. Took it on a 15 min test drive - 10 minutes city driving and 5 on interstate at 75 mph. No transmission temp guage and I never felt the transmission with 5W30 in it, but I did after my test drive and boy was it hot. Almost too hot to touch. Hmm, maybe I should get a temp guage for it... ? I probly wont ever have the $ for the 4500 swap, so I would like to keep this getrag going. The ATF was free so, I can always go back to 5W30, just wanted to try something different. Bill

 

[DJP]

dusthomps,



My Getrag locked up in second gear yesterday morning, just after I stopped at the end of the highway exit ramp. I went to hit second gear, and it just world't shift, in fact it would not go into any gear. When I released the clutch, I found that I had second gear, however, the shift lever felt like I had neutral. I completed my commute to work in second gear, luckily I only had another 500 feet to go. After work, I called AAA for a tow home. The wrecker was one of those new Ford powerchokes, and after talking with the driver on the trip home, it sounded like he was already having his share of problems with his new rig which had less than 20K miles on it. Among the problems was injectors cracking, and filling the crankcase with fuel. After talking with him, I felt much better about my own rig, since I now have over 250K miles, I guess things like transmission problems should be expected. Yesterday evening, I pulled the transmission out, but I figured I better leave the transmission repairs to a professional who has the Manuals, Tooling, Parts, and most of all knowledge of what the hell he is doing. Today, I dropped the transmission off at Lester's Transmission in Tulsa. After calling several different shops, who flat out turned the work away, they all referred me to the same shop. I figured they must be pretty good, if not, at least they are well known in the Tulsa area. Unlike the problems you have described with yours, my transmission was pretty quiet, unless I was pouring on the coal in fifth gear. I was running Valvoline 5W-30 synthetic for the past 160K miles. When I purchased the truck used in 6/95, the previous owner was running gear oil, and it shifted terribly, until I changed it over to the lighter weight synthetic oil.

I'll let you know what the verdict is from the transmission shop, hopefully, tomorrow.

 

[dusthomps]

List of Repairs

Well, the Getrag is finished. Not in the truck yet, still waiting for my new clutch. I ended up taking it to Zumbrota Bearing and Gear in Zumbrota, MN. This shop was recommended by three people I know and they said they do very good work. Gears were all good but the following was replaced: bearings, seals, synchros, shift forks, and slides. Because I had a "repair" done and not a complete rebuild, the warrenty will be limited to three months vs. one year on a rebuild. Final cost for parts and labor: $950. Clutch is supposed to be in tomorrow so hopefully by Wednesday or Thursday I'll have the old girl on the road.





Dustin

 

[bgilbert]

Oouch, $950 that hurts just thinking about it. Seems like alot when I hear you can upgrade to the 4500 for about another $1100. Did the transmission shop tell you what type of fluid to run in it? ATF, ATF?? Bill

 

[DJP]

I got the bad news from the transmission shop today. There is a chipped tooth on the fourth gear, which I'm told is part of the input shaft, so I need a new input shaft, bearing kit, synchros, seals, and possibly some other gears, which he has not looked at yet. I have been quoted $1,045 parts and labor, and the price could go up another $440 from there, depending on whether I need some additional gears he mentioned. I did not get an answer as to why the shifter locked up on me. After hearing that, I told him to put this job aside for now, and I will give him an answer Monday if I decide to proceed with the repair. After spending several hours combing the yellow pages and calling every wrecking yard in the Tulsa area, I found that the best price I could find on a NV4500 transmission is $1,000, for a used 97 with 140,000 miles on it. I was interested, until I was informed of an additional $400 charge for the core that I would not be able to provide, and my Getrag would not be accepted. I also found a 91 Getrag with 130K miles, for $1,200. I told the junk dealer I could get a NV4500 for less money, however, I would be willing to give him $800 cash, or he can just sit on his greasy goldmine of inventory if my offer wasn't enough money for him. I was told he would check with the owner, and he would get back with me. I have not heard from him, perhaps he was insulted.

After looking on e-bay, I found two overhauled NV4500's for around $1,000 each, however, they both require a $400 core charge which I would have to eat, plus the cost of a bell housing, and the other parts required to do the conversion.

It looks like I will be paying around $1,100 - $1,400 to get mine overhauled. :{

 

[cfarrar]

I couldn't help noticing something about the description of the failure in the last post. Fourth gear in these transmissions is "straight through". The gears do nothing but spin when it is in fourth. If they meant the fourth gear from one end of the shaft or the other, that would mean something completely different.



Clark

 

[AMikonis]

Yeah, I don't know about this 4th gear thing, either, but a brand new Getrag input shaft is only $145 now...



I dunno, guys, it looks like we have learned you can have someone rebuild your Getrag for you TWICE for what it costs for the parts for a NV4500 conversion.



Don't forget, I think you "D" truck guys have to have the driveshaft shortened, too. Also, I watched someone have problems with the rear X-member adapter on a 4x4 conversion (think he bought the "wrong" kit. )



If we're getting 100 to 200K+ miles each time that's not so bad. You can save a lot more if you DIY.



That junkyard NV4500 isn't going to last forever, either, so don't forget to factor in eventual rebuild costs for it, too...

 

[dusthomps]

Recommended Oil

Bill,



I asked what the recommended fluid was for the Getrag and this is what he said almost exactly without me even mentioning what Dodge recommends. "I know Dodge wants you to run a 5w-30 motor oil, but the best thing for this transmission is a 10w-30 synthetic motor oil. The oil needs to have a little bit more base. " Looks like I will be giving Mobil 1 10w-30 a try now.



I got the clutch set yesterday and when I showed it to one of my friends he asked me, "Are you putting a new clutch in a dump truck?" Told him it belongs in my 91, he couldn't believe it. On a side note, I decided to put in a new Sach clutch. Pilot bushing, throwout, clutch, and pressure plate came to a total of $520.





Dustin

 

[DJP]

I called the transmission shop last Monday, and told them to just repair what is broke, and not to go ahead with the overhaul. The shop told me they will not be able to give me any warranty for the repairs, but then again, I didn't expect them to give me any kind of warranty on a transmission with over 250K miles on it. I found out the cause of my problems was a shift slide that was bent, and mushroomed on one end from wear. The repair cost me only $225, for parts and labor. I picked up the transmission yesterday and purchased a new transmission jack from Harbor Freight Tools for $70. 00 on my way home from the shop. Since I did not spring for the overhaul, I figured the jack would be a good investment. I installed the transmission yesterday, and realized how easy it went in when you have the right tool, instead of performing the balancing act with the floor jack. I should have bought a transmission jack years ago. I Completed the installation today, which basically involved servicing it with 4 quarts of Valvoline 5W-30 synthetic oil through the shifter port, and then installing the shifter. Took it for a test drive, and everything works fine, ... at least for now. The transmission is quiet, and only growls when you lug it in fifth gear while mashing the go pedal.

I'm going to look around for the best deal I can find on a NV4500 and bell housing. If I can't get one at a good price, I will probably just sell this truck, and move on up to either a '97 or '98 12 valve 2nd generation.