Getrag woes.

[MMiller]

Last night on the way to a truck pull(hauling my trailer and pulling truck) I thought my brother in law had left the passenger side door, or vent window cracked, as that is what is sounded like. We got to the pull with no problems. On the way home, we decided that the noise was coming from the drive train, possibly the transfer case. Today I checked the oil levels, all were fine. I found the transfer case shifter mount loose. Tightend them up. Took the truck to town with no trailer to get transmission oil and gear oil for the tcase. I determined the noise is only apparent in over drive. It is a new noise in this truck. I've heard a few other getrags make a noise like this and the owners said they always made the noise. I drained the transmission oil. It was sufficently overfull. The oil showed no signs of material out of the ordinary, not stinky or really burned. I pulled the covers found no obvious damage. I can move the 2nd gear back from the front synchro, but i think thats ok as its near another synchro. I looked at my book and found OD is at the back and can see nothing.



I'd like to go truck pulling tonight, the pull is 2. 5 hrs away, then of course home. And I kinda need the truck for about 8-10 hrs of driving Monday and tuesday. I need help deciding what to do. I know I should pull it down right now, and I won't go if James tells me not to drive it. I just want to know whats going on.



I sent James an email, I will post up what we decide.



Michael

 

[GIT-R-DONE]

Only one way to find out... ... go

 

[bgilbert]

Previous owner of my truck said 5th gear made that noise for 5 years. He pulled goosenecks, horse trailer, it was a real farm/work truck. I've had it now for about 4 years I think. Run it til you can get the funds for digging into it. . if you want to that is.

 

[MMiller]

Previous owner of my truck said 5th gear made that noise for 5 years. He pulled goosenecks, horse trailer, it was a real farm/work truck. I've had it now for about 4 years I think. Run it til you can get the funds for digging into it. . if you want to that is.

Its not so much the funds to do it. If I don't go truck pulling and I work on the tow vehicle, then I'll have the cash do rebearing/shim the trans, just really don't want to spend the $$ on a new clutch. Its against my upbringing and work ethic to pull a manual transmission in a truck like mine and not stick a new clutch in it.



Still haven't decided what to do yet. Got about an hour before I have to leave for Palmyra.



Michael

 

[CSchafer]

Mine makes noise in fourth and fith but only under hard accleration. But it's done that sinece I turned the pump up. doesnt make any noise just driving but I don't hual anything either. You could leave it out of overdrive if it starts getting worse on the way to the pull.

 

[pepecat]

Mine never makes noise, but put a cup on the end of the shifter and see what it sounds like. it will amplify the noise. It will probably give you some feeling of the severity or lack thereof

 

[ScottLowry]

I guess I have been lucky with mine it doesn't make any noise at all. I tow a decent amount with it. Pushing 26-28k total weight on some loads. I will have to try the water thing and see if i am missing something. Has anyone ever used the rebuild kit that is sold on e-bay? I thought about going through mine this winter. It's a complete kit with scyros, bearing and such for $239. Is that a good price for the kit? That might be a cheap option for you if it's any good. Clutches in these trucks seem to last a while under "normal use" I don't think it would be a problem to keep the same one in there if it looks good.



Scott

 

[1stgen4evr]

Called but no answer, I guess I missed you Michael. I just got on the computer. Stay out of OD if you think there is something going awry. As to the clutch, it is a long way in but I have had my transmission out four times for shimming and still using the original clutch at 500k. It may be time to do the floor cut mod so you can get the top off the transmission. You can see all the rest that you didn't already see.



geeezzz Good luck whatever you do.



James

 

[MMiller]

Clutches in these trucks seem to last a while under "normal use" I don't think it would be a problem to keep the same one in there if it looks good.



Scott

:-laf :-laf Anybody that knows me, has ridden with me, or went 4 wheeling with me knows that "normal use" does not apply to me. This truck has hauled loads of hay up to 29,900 across the scales, pulled OD for hours at a time with the cruise on, has been in rivers deep enough for water to start to come in the cab, its been hooked to pulling sleds, stuck in the mud up to the rocker panels, drag raced off the stop lights, smoking the tires in second, chirping them in third... ..... the list goes on, and on, and on... .....



James, I got your message. We went about 25 miles and it seems louder today then last night. Came home at 58 mph in 4th. I'm going outside to unload the pulling truck and pull the 93 back in the garage. I'm already looking for an old dodge floor hump to put in mine. Guess I'll start pulling the drivetrain out in the next couple days. I'll call you back here in a little bit.



Michael

 

[bgilbert]

:-laf :-laf Anybody that knows me, has ridden with me, or went 4 wheeling with me knows that "normal use" does not apply to me. This truck has hauled loads of hay up to 29,900 across the scales, pulled OD for hours at a time with the cruise on, has been in rivers deep enough for water to start to come in the cab, its been hooked to pulling sleds, stuck in the mud up to the rocker panels, drag raced off the stop lights, smoking the tires in second, chirping them in third... ..... the list goes on, and on, and on... .....

I never took you as a Cade Schafer :-laf. All calm and quiet like at SOPII.

 

[pepecat]

the military m880's all have removable/bolt in humps that you can put in your truck, you'll just have to cut the hole for the shifter. the xxfer hole is there already obviously. the large bolt in humps are in every 74-80 pickup EXCEPT for the 2x4 auto. older won't work and newer aren't bolt in

Good luck. There is a surplus shop in oregon I found my hump at $45 + shipping

 

[MMiller]

the military m880's all have removable/bolt in humps that you can put in your truck, you'll just have to cut the hole for the shifter. the xxfer hole is there already obviously. the large bolt in humps are in every 74-80 pickup EXCEPT for the 2x4 auto. older won't work and newer aren't bolt in

Good luck. There is a surplus shop in oregon I found my hump at $45 + shipping

That is interesting. Do you have a link? I called a dodge buddy that runs a body shop. He has probably had his hands on hundreds of old dodge 4X4's and he never has "seen" one with a bolt in center hump. I figured he had a pile of them, but he said he had none. I probably should get two, one for my 90, cause you know the 727 will have to come out of that someday.



Michael

 

[ScottLowry]

It sounds like you are a lot harder on your transmission then i am on mine. I'm happy to hear that. It makes me think mine will live a long happy life.



Scott

 

[MMiller]

It sounds like you are a lot harder on your transmission then i am on mine. I'm happy to hear that. It makes me think mine will live a long happy life.



Scott

Lets just say, my truck is "experienced". I firmly believe any other make or model truck would have fallen completely apart by now, as long as I have had this truck. I figured out that the transmission has about 160,000 miles on it, and the truck in total has 228,000 miles on it. Anything that has failed on the truck I take full respondsibility for. I try and maintain the truck as good as possible, and repair it as necessary. It has never left me stranded, and always gets the job done. That being said... .



James and I talked today, and he believes that the OD gear set is probably damaged. He is talking me into a heavier oil after I get this failure repaired. I'm going to start looking at the fast coolers, and making something up to make fillups easier. I'm also going to thread the "breather" hole in the top cover, put in a 90* pipe threaded fitting and run a hose up into the engine compartment for the breather. This will hopefully keep the transmission from slobering down the side. It never leaks enough to leave a puddle, just enough to make a mess. Kinda like the crank case breather.



I'll update this thread later this week, when the drivetrain is on the floor.



Michael

 

[RPA]

Michael,



Look at the bright side, at least it was somewhat close to home and not on your trip up north to get your buddy's broken 6. 0L Ford.



On a lighter note, the pulls in Palmyra were good, several trucks in all classes, wished you could have made it down. I got wooped by a 3rd gen from Farmington, MO. Only downfall was another late night.



Good luck with transmission.

 

[MMiller]

Michael,



Look at the bright side, at least it was somewhat close to home and not on your trip up north to get your buddy's broken 6. 0L Ford.



On a lighter note, the pulls in Palmyra were good, several trucks in all classes, wished you could have made it down. I got wooped by a 3rd gen from Farmington, MO. Only downfall was another late night.



Good luck with transmission.

Yeah, his dad came today to get my trailer to go after the dead 6. NO... ... . I probably could have made it to Palmyra and back, but it would have been at a slow 60 mph in 4th. I was bummed, but Oh well, its not all junk yet.



So, what did the 3rd gen have hanging on it? Did Brock's duramax show well? Hopefully we'll be back online by Donnellson on the 20th, then Osky on the 26th. Do you have a transmission jack I can borrow?



Michael

 

[CSchafer]

Hey Michael, that may of been a mistake saying you do somthing other than drive and dyno your truck, Bill will never let up on you now :-laf

Good luck with the trans.

 

[RPA]

Sorry I don't have a transmission jack.



Not sure what the 3rd Gen had but, it ran hard. he put 20+ feet in me And I was another 18+ feet ahead of everyone else. Brock ran well but seemed to run better a few weeks ago in Donnelson. There was about 15 trucks in both classes mostly the same ones. I could not run in what they called the open gas diesel class because my fat pig of a truck would not make 7500.

 

[MMiller]

Hey Michael, that may of been a mistake saying you do somthing other than drive and dyno your truck, Bill will never let up on you now :-laf

Good luck with the trans.

Oh, I know. I actually use the 4X4 truck, as imagine this, a 4X4 truck. I can't help it that I get a little rambunctious from time to time. When a guy owns a the same truck from the time he's 18 until he's almost 30, the truck is going to get "experianced" I can't imagine owning a smoking 4X4 diesel TRUCK, and only driving it to church on sundays, and saturday dyno events



Update to the thread. Thursday I drained the t-case and transmission oil, pulled the bent skidplate, and removed shifters, drive shafts. Today I made up an adapter plate for the transmission jack I borrowed, and pulled the unit. I removed the shifter cover and found three good looking shift forks, and not much damage. I found one gear tooth that was a little boogered up on the OD set, but not much else. When I put it in OD, and turn the input, you can hear a noise. Put it in any other gear and not so much. Is there any bearings that only turn in OD, James??



Tomorrow I'll finish cleaning the mud off the transmission, and separate it from the t-case. Then I guess I pull the getrag apart and inspect it closer. Imagine that, there was mud, and dirt on the trans and t-case. I can't imagine where that came from.



Michael

 

[1stgen4evr]

any bearings that only turn in OD, James??



No but there is a greater difference in the relative speeds on the bearings when you are in OD. Fourth (direct) is the only hookup that isn't on the cluster but still, all the bearings, except the pocket bearing, are rolling. First second third and OD all go off the input to the cluster and then back to the appropriate gear on the mainshaft and with each the pocket bearing is working. The speed bearing under the small OD gear could be going and allow the mesh of the OD set to be too wide. As could the cluster shaft bearing at the back. Now that will be the simplest and cheapest fix if the problem is at the rear cluster bearing. Does the cluster have much fore and aft slack on the bearings?



one gear tooth that was a little boogered up on the OD



A tooth with a chip out leads me to think that the mesh is too wide allowing the tooth (teeth) to be loaded at the upper portion (above the pitch line) of the tooth. And this will almost always pull a chip off the smaller gear in the set.



Clean and smooth on the top side is good. You may get lucky and only have to do a bearing kit and that OD gear. I have seen another OD (smaller) gear that had a chip out of one tooth.



But look real good, the Getrag can fool you.



James