H&S dpf delete +xrt

[SmithMark]

I have been reading about installing the H&S performance DPF delete kit with xrt tuner for the C&C on another forum. The reports are showing 3-5 MPG improvement with noticeable power gains. H&S clearly states these are for racing/off road use only and not street legal in any state. No inspection required in my neck of the woods. Looks like the complete kit with exhaust and tuner is about $1350. I figure if diesel goes to $3. 00 this thing could pay for itself in under 20,000 miles.

I would love to hear the pro's and cons from this group. Before I did anything, I would talk to my dealer to make sure they would not give me any issues over warranty as I only have 4500mi on the truck.

 

[HBarlow]

I know absolutely nothing about the kit or manufacturer you inquired about, however... ... .

I think it is important to consider the fact that you cannot expect the same level of design engineering, testing, quality control, reliability, durability, or service life from a product manufactured by a small start up company producing products intended either for illegal on-road use by a very small market, cab and chassis trucks, or an even smaller if even existing market, cab and chassis trucks used for racing or off-road use as we do from Chrysler for our Dodge trucks or Cummins for our engines.

I'd also consider the political party that currently runs the government and their interest in "clean air" and related tree hugger favorite issues and also the fact that the party in power loves legislating behavior and prefers tiny gas sipper or electric cars.

And your state is also run by the same political party.

Are you sure your truck won't be subjected to testing in the near future or that you won't travel to other states that may test now or in the future?

I don't like the emission control crap on my truck any more than anyone else. I'd love to torch it off and dump it in a dumpster but the state and federal penalties could be severe.

Your truck, your money, your choice.

 

[Sasquatch]

I have been reading about installing the H&S performance DPF delete kit with xrt tuner for the C&C on another forum. The reports are showing 3-5 MPG improvement with noticeable power gains. H&S clearly states these are for racing/off road use only and not street legal in any state. No inspection required in my neck of the woods. Looks like the complete kit with exhaust and tuner is about $1350. I figure if diesel goes to $3. 00 this thing could pay for itself in under 20,000 miles.

I would love to hear the pro's and cons from this group. Before I did anything, I would talk to my dealer to make sure they would not give me any issues over warranty as I only have 4500mi on the truck.

Mark,



I would go for it, bro'.



Contacting Us



I know all the guys at H&S (Casey, Dave, Bentley), and I can tell you that they are outstanding people, dedicated to these trucks and to customer support.



Casey, in particular, is a gem. He spends a lot of time, on-line, trouble-shooting trucks owned by guys who bought his competitors' tuners. How amazing is that?



I have done all the deletes, (EGR, EGR-cooler, and Complete exhaust system), and I have installed H&S's 5" stainless steel turbo-back exhaust system. Their downloader (tuner), the XRT, includes software than enables code-free operation of your truck with all this stuff removed.



I have 35,000 miles on my '07, and the past 15,000 with H&S's components on it. There is no comparison in how the truck runs/performs now, vs how it did beforehand.



I get 18 mpg in rural driving (sort of "semi-city," with plenty of stoplights), and I get 20 going 75 in the interstate. If I want to go 60, I can get 22 mpg, and that's with a loaded, 4x4 dually, running Rickson wheels and tires, plus heavy winch, winch bumper, Leer topper, etc, etc.



The coolest part of all, is that my oil stays cleaner, because I'm not recycling sludge and soot through the engine's intake.



All of the components that I removed are sitting on shelves, neatly catalogued, in my garage. It would take me one day (or $750 mechanic's labor) to restore the truck to "factory" condition, if and when my state "gos green," and requires diesel emissions testing.



I live in rural Colorado. I can see Denver implementing testing, but not the county area (farms, ranches) where I live. In fact, I called the county DOT, and they said, "It won't happen, here!" before I did anything to the truck.



Finally, on the dealer level, I wouldn't worry about them at all. They will work on your truck, and they will be happy to have your business. Chrysler is hurting, bad, and they just closed 800 dealerships, nationwide, yesterday.

I have to drive to Grand Junction, now, to get the prepaid oil changes I signed up for when I bought the truck; that's 340 miles, roundtrip, and the local dealer is delighted to have my business, even though my truck IS VERY heavily modified.



Life is short: Do what you want to with your truck and enjoy the hell out of it while you can. You can always put things back the way they were. Save the parts and keep them stored, neatly, in boxes. Meantime, drive your truck without all that crap on it, and save $ on fuel and aggravation.



Good luck!

 

[HBarlow]

[/quote]=Sasquatch];... ... ... ... <SNIP> I have done all the deletes, (EGR, EGR-cooler, and Complete exhaust system), and I have installed H&S's 5" stainless steel turbo-back exhaust system. Their downloader (tuner), the XRT, includes software than enables code-free operation of your truck with all this stuff removed.

I have 35,000 miles on my '07, and the past 15,000 with H&S's components on it. There is no comparison in how the truck runs/performs now, vs how it did beforehand. <SNIP>... ... ... [/quote]

Do the emissions removal kits still set CELs and codes?

 

[Sasquatch]

Do the emissions removal kits still set CELs and codes?[/QUOTE]



Great question, and hard to drop a butterfly net over.



I guess the short answer is "Some do; some don't. "



My H&S kit (exhaust) included "sims" (resistors) that plug into the OEM wiring harness ports at the transmission, etc. These simulators tell the trucks ECM that all is well, and they prevent most codes. Some trucks still had pernicious "soft codes" that had to be "cleared" on start-up with one the aftermarket in-line programmers (e. g. , "Edge Juice w/Attitude").



I used my Edge w/ Attitude, for about a year, before going with H&S's "XRT," which actually writes new software to the truck's "brain" (ECM).



The XRT is a "downloader," and it -- in addition to a suite of other software options -- allows you to tell the truck to "turn off" its monitoring of the EGR and DPF system. In fact, it resets the "Regen-Counter" to zero each time the truck starts up, so your truck will never go into regeneration again.



The XRT downloader also comes with a USB cable, and you can actually go on-line and download the latest "tunes" from H&S, directly, then download them to your truck. My XRT shipped with a 60 hp "towing tune," and a 120 hp tune. Casey and crew are putting the finishing touches on their latest tune, a 175 hp tune, which I can download, Monday of next week, for free.



They will be following that with a 225 hp tune, which I WON'T be downloading!! :-laf



My truck has been completely code-free for many months. I love driving it, and I love being able to choose different options that alter my driving experience. The XRT allows you to reprogram your tire diameter (to keep your speedo accurate), to increase your truck's top speed (stock setting defuels your truck at 105 mph), to keep your fog lights on with your high-beams, and so on.



The guys at H&S also can download (to your XRT) all the latest flashes from Chrysler/Dodge. In my case, my '07 has the old AZ flash, but Bentley at H&S will download the latest factory flash (BA) for my truck on Monday, and this will save me a trip to the dealer, plus keep the dealer from looking under my hood (where he'll be scared witless by what he sees).



I can't possibly answer your questions as well as Casey can. My real understanding is pretty thin, when it comes to being able to explain how all this stuff works.



I just know that my truck is a hell of a lot more fun to drive, and it's gone from being a 13/15 (mpg town/highway) truck to an 18/20 truck.



That's a HUGE difference.



Good luck, man.

 

[HBarlow]

... ... ... ... ... ..... [snip] I just know that my truck is a hell of a lot more fun to drive, and it's gone from being a 13/15 (mpg town/highway) truck to an 18/20 truck... ..... [snip]... ... ...

I have no doubt about that. The new ISB6. 7 is probably capable of an easy and reliable 400hp and 750-800 lb. /ft. torque with the crap removed.

But in some states, and possibly more in the future, if a smog Nazi sees a newer truck blowing black smoke, or, worst case, pulls you in for an emissions check it could actually result in your truck being redtagged and towed to a storage yard and you handcuffed and hauled in in a cruiser.

The fed DOT can and does intrude on interstate and US highways occasionally. When I was transporting a fellow transporter told me of being pulled over loaded on his trip from IN to west coast and being inspected by state DOT and feds with dark blue jackets and gold letters DOT watching. He was ticketed for having improperly secured tools in the bed of his pickup.

I trust the new socialist government absolutely to go against the wishes and best interests of the population in every single endeavor they "attack" and I do mean attack.

 

[JGamble]

Bottom line... ... ... . I know of none of the new DPF deletes kits. BUTTTTT... . I can tell you, as Mr. Barlow has said, do you wanna risk sending your rig to the impound and the embarrassment of a ride in a bandit car? Hmmm..... I wouldn't. Personal opinion though. Remember though, with this new administration, there could be the day that: you delete the DPF, throw in the tuner, go out for a drive, and someone, maybe not a cop, DOT inspector, just a tree hugger who knows his/her laws, sees that black poof of smoke, calls in your tags, and BAM... ... its over. Remember, as some manufactures claim, you can put "their" chip in the 6. 7 and get power gains without delete and smoke. Something to think about.....



Kind Regards,

J Gamble

 

[SmithMark]

Well, I just found out my dealer I bought the truck from voided a warranty on a durango with just a cold air intake added. Since dealers may be few and far between in the near future, and the threat of big brother, I better stay stock for awhile.

 

[HBarlow]

Wise decision. I am confident that at some time in the next three years you will learn of an event related to auto emissions testing that makes you very glad you resisted the temptation.

I think I read somewhere that the new ISB6. 7 engines have greater ECM capacity and improved ability to detect and record tampering. I haven't had any problems at all with my '08 C&C and don't think you will either but I think it is certain that with Chrysler in financial trouble as they are they will be watching warranty claims even closer than they once did. If a truck with no DPF, no EGR, and shadetree modified emissions wiring or add-on sensors shows up at a dealer with a sooted turbo I wouldn't expect the visit to go well.

 

[Cattletrkr]

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
Thomas Jefferson

I will not base my truck mod'ing decisions on whether or not Big Brother will lock me up for it. That's going too far. Warranty is another issue. I don't worry about my truck needing any major warrranty work in under 100K but if you do, then stay stock. Aftermarket companies will still be around when you're out of warranty.

 

[Bob4x4]

I think I read somewhere that the new ISB6. 7 engines have greater ECM capacity and improved ability to detect and record tampering. I haven't had any problems at all with my '08 C&C and don't think you will either but I think it is certain that with Chrysler in financial trouble as they are they will be watching warranty claims even closer than they once did. If a truck with no DPF, no EGR, and shadetree modified emissions wiring or add-on sensors shows up at a dealer with a sooted turbo I wouldn't expect the visit to go well.

You are right about that there are literally pages of data stored on just about everything including how the truck has been driven. The fuel useage,load over time,idle time. idle fuel and on and on.

 

[HBarlow]

You are right about that there are literally pages of data stored on just about everything including how the truck has been driven. The fuel useage,load over time,idle time. idle fuel and on and on.

Is that information available to the owner? What I mean is, could I pay a dealer service department to have a diesel tech download all that operational history from my engine and maybe print it?

The information would be helpful for making informed decisions about oil change intervals, for example, and would be valuable to a seller and buyer as an indication of how the truck had been driven and whether it had hundreds of thousands of service miles left in it or had been used hard and abused.

 

[Bob4x4]

Is that information available to the owner? What I mean is, could I pay a dealer service department to have a diesel tech download all that operational history from my engine and maybe print it?



The information would be helpful for making informed decisions about oil change intervals, for example, and would be valuable to a seller and buyer as an indication of how the truck had been driven and whether it had hundreds of thousands of service miles left in it or had been used hard and abused.

That would be up the individual holding the scanner. I have never seen any publications blocking it. I have shown some of my interested customers their data.

Funny story... ... ... . I hooked up the scanner on a LEO customer of mine,we were both interested in seeing what his particular add on software would show while driving. We proceeded down the boulivard with him driving and me telling him what to try. He was having a good time and watching the road while I was relaying what I was reading real time under a varied drive cycle.

Whoops... ... ... ... . out of nowhere another LEO on a scooter pops up in the mirror and was not pleased. The rest of the story... ... ... . well lets just say it was good he was behind the wheel and not me.

 

[dlmetzger]

What is an "LEO customer"?

 

[JMetzger]

As i have stated before on here when I was at 1000 Trails in Palm Springs, CA I talked to a man that had a 6. 7 & was pulled over by a CHP because it put out smoke. I saw all his reciepts & it was over $10,000 with all the fines, state & fed, towing & lot storage+ they towed it on the spot plus putting the truck back to stock & Dodge told him that he kissed his warranty goodbye even though he went bach stock. $10,000 fines woul buy a lot of fuel. If it were me I would leave it stock as the Feds & State boys are looking, they need the money. Just my opinion.

 

[HBarlow]

What is an "LEO customer"?

LEO usually refers to Law Enforcement Officer. I think his customer, whose truck he was working on, was a LEO.

 

[HBarlow]

As i have stated before on here when I was at 1000 Trails in Palm Springs, CA I talked to a man that had a 6. 7 & was pulled over by a CHP because it put out smoke. I saw all his reciepts & it was over $10,000 with all the fines, state & fed, towing & lot storage+ they towed it on the spot plus putting the truck back to stock & Dodge told him that he kissed his warranty goodbye even though he went bach stock. $10,000 fines woul buy a lot of fuel. If it were me I would leave it stock as the Feds & State boys are looking, they need the money. Just my opinion.

I remember when you posted this story a few months, maybe a year ago. It's worth reading and remembering. The smog nazis are serious.

The environmental wackos and tree huggers own the federal government now and that gives them increased power and increased confidence to tell the rest of us how to run our lives. California is one of the worst plus the state is bankrupt and still spending beyond their means. The CA legislature wants your money.

When you consider the new ISB6. 7 ECM has increased detection capability and memory and some states are getting more serious about smog enforcement it seems foolish to me to risk modifying or removing the smog crap.

 

[AHarris]

I find this (and similar threads) pretty sobering. I'm thinking I'll probably leave mine stock. I've never had even a single CEL or problem in the 2 years I've owned the truck, and 18. 5 MPG at 77mph is pretty acceptable fuel mileage for a 7000# truck.

It's just not worth it, but it's a sad day when the government dictates to me what I can do with my own vehicle when the modifications don't pose a safety risk. I might just get an old 12 valve to play around with.

This country is going to $ hit.

 

[Bob4x4]

LEO usually refers to Law Enforcement Officer. I think his customer, whose truck he was working on, was a LEO.

You got it... ... ... .

 

[RVTRKN]

The EPA now have devices that detect the actual pollutants, just from you passing by. I have seen these check points, and the most popular spot is to sit at the end of an On ramp when you are accelerating. eek: They are watching and you can be assured they will catch you eventually. For those who drive commercial, just one inspection at the Chicken Coupe will have you plucked in a heartbeat.