Heard a Intercooler Rumor

[MBowser]

Need help with this one, heard that a intercooler from a 6. 4 powerstroke is bigger than the 5. 9's and they mount right into place if you wanted to swap.



Urban legend?

 

[AWeaver]

I wouldnt put anything from a powerjoke on my cummins... . just sayin. Also, on a more serious note, I had a buddy that bought the banks intercooler to replace his stocker on his 5. 9 and it didnt drop his egts one degree. NO HP gain either. Stock turbo and, with a banks power pda programmer and bigger injectors and a boost fooler. I think intercoolers are over-rated... especially aftermarket ones. IMHO. I dont think an aftermarket intercooler design can get radically more efficient than stock to warrant spending the $$$. Id rather get a bigger turbo or install a water injection system.

 

[JMarketos]

I can't confirm or deny the "swapability" of the ford IC into the Dodge- hopefully someone can respond directly to the OP original question. Imho, I wouldn't have any problem using a "powerstroke" intercooler in a Dodge if it swapped reasonably easy; I'd speculate good chance that the ICs are made by independent suppliers, might be same company that made production runs for multiple different automobile companies, who knows.

I can tell you first-hand that a bigger IC makes a positive difference. I installed a Banks pkg. on my truck and the truck has had both pre-turbo and post-turbo EGT gauges since before the Banks install. When working the engine a bit, I'd say the bigger IC results in EGTs that are a solid 100F lower than before. Sometimes I think it's more like 150 or even 200F less than before. I have stock turbo and injectors.

My truck also has a Gearvendors overdrive unit (w/ 48RE), which was installed before the Banks pkg. Presence of the Banks intercooler gave me an added benefit I wasn't thinking about... I originally installed the GV for towing (lock the truck trans in 3rd gear, engage the GV, results in much better highway RPMs than trying to tow without the GV, using 48RE 4th gear). I discovered with the truck empty, I can run the 48RE in 4th AND engage the GV, which results in highway RPMs around 1500. The engine has plenty enough torque to run that way, but on grades that are anything beyond shallow, the EGTs would reach levels that I wasn't comfortable with. After installing the bigger IC, that's no longer a problem so I'm absolutely sure the upgraded IC is cooling the charge better. It's a simple case of cooling volume, and you can compare the stock IC to the bigger ones and see there's much more volume. Length and width aren't that much different, but the aftermarket ICs tend to be significantly thicker than the stocker. I do agree with #2 regarding price, though... You pay an inordinate amount of $$ to get that bigger intercooler. I had some incentive to do that anyway, because my 05 was one of the "lucky" ones that came with the plastic intercooler tanks to begin with

Also with the bigger IC and pipes, turbo spool is noticeably quicker. It was expensive, but I haven't regretted making the upgrade.

 

[TCDiesel]

I wouldnt put anything from a powerjoke on my cummins... . just sayin. Also, on a more serious note, I had a buddy that bought the banks intercooler to replace his stocker on his 5. 9 and it didnt drop his egts one degree. NO HP gain either. Stock turbo and, with a banks power pda programmer and bigger injectors and a boost fooler. I think intercoolers are over-rated... especially aftermarket ones. IMHO. I dont think an aftermarket intercooler design can get radically more efficient than stock to warrant spending the $$$. Id rather get a bigger turbo or install a water injection system.

More efficiency does not translate to lower EGTs... its a myth. added density with cooler air will add HP, but you need the entire setup,Not just one piece.

 

[JExum]

I swapped out a i/c on my 99 Ford to a 04 Ford. It did help a little 50-75 degrees only paid 60 dollars for so that was ok. But the 04 had plastic end caps something you dont want to put on a Cummins because its plastic and the boost pressure might be to high and bust the seems. But I havn't checked out a 6. 4 powerstroke i/c to know what they are made of.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

I discussed intercoolers in Issue 60, p. 92, and in more detail in Issue 68, p. 90. A few comments could be added to those discussions. Several companies claim to have the best in the aftermarket industry. However, they may actually be using original equipment (OE) standards, and their intercoolers are suitable for OE replacement. They should do a good job at that level; but they may not be adequate for the temperatures and boost pressures seen in the high performance Dodge trucks.



When John Todd of BD Power was looking for a cooler core suitable for the higher boost levels afforded by their compound (twin) turbochargers, he only considered the extruded core design (Type C in Issue 68) that was used in high pressure industrial applications. These cores are more expensive than the ones used in stock type trucks, at moderate boost levels and inlet air temperatures. The extruded cores are a necessity for high pressure boost air cooling. They are also very efficient and fail safe. Standard cores will work great initially but over time when using high temperatures and pressures the owner may notice a rise in engine operating temperatures; and blame injectors or turbochargers when the problem is loss of intercooler heat conductivity because of stuffed fin separation from the tubes. The stuffed fins are shoved into the tubes, and can move or bunch up later under high boost levels.

 

[TCDiesel]

USF Holland has trucks with 1. 6 million Miles and still running on 3rd engine running factory (CAC) with turbolators that look the same as NEW. . Please POST some Facts form info other then TDR articles... USF Holland has documentation on all company Vehicles. I alway thought (CAC)s were to do Just that CHARGED AIR COOLERS not Boost transmitters. Stationary unit call for different (CAC). I will agree I have seen Many collapsed (CAC)s that have been over Boosted and beyond the manufactures MAX PSI . Our Race Truck is running BANKS Techni-Cooler and has record boost pressures over 90 PSI MAX EGTs 1496* this truck is well over 1000hp. . it will be at Indy this weekend.

 

[steved]

Need help with this one, heard that a intercooler from a 6. 4 powerstroke is bigger than the 5. 9's and they mount right into place if you wanted to swap.



Urban legend?

I read this a week or so ago also... seems the inlet and outlet are about 1/2" bigger (3" versus 2. 5"?). I wasn't interested in the swap, so I really didn't read it closely... in fact, I don't even remember where I read it?

 

[Bob4x4]

I had the operunity to see Afe's test set up

Before they released their cac.

They Were applying more than 3 times

Normal max pressures in surges non stop,

Around the clock for a very long period of time

I would have no worries running one on

My truck

I think the big issue is the cacs are hard to

Show before and after results due to so

Many variables.

The goal may be max flow with one company

While another's may be max cooling

I am somewhere in-between and want max cooling

And improved flow

 

[cerberusiam]

More efficiency does not translate to lower EGTs

Hmmm, what is the CAC's main function? Oh yeah, cooling the air. So if CAC B is better at coolig the air, given all other things are equal, than CAC A it follows its efficiency is better because, well, that IS its job.



So given that IAT's are lower it DOES follow that EGT's will be lower given all other things are equal. The laws of pysics remain immutable, no matter what the myth busters WANT us to believe. :-laf



The 3rd gen CAC is a pretty good piece in its operating range. As Joe pointed out, when you step outside its design criteria there are other things to consider, but, in its effective range a more efficient CAC is probably not going to give a measurable benefit.



Now, if one wants to see an measurable impact a 1st gen is needed. A CAC that is designed to run with the stock boost and power tends to suffer just a bit when the engine is brought up to current power level equivalents. The difference is VERY noticeable and the impact easily measured.



Without a doubt, a more efficient CAC has benefits but there is a range where that benefit is quantifiable. However, if any one wants to put a better CAC go for it, it ain't hurting nothing.

 

[TCDiesel]

WOW Cerb You and I Agree on ... . Woopeeee. At any rate this the formula I came up with it May need correction ,3gens have sensors that pickup Boost, Baro,temp,load,APPS,So take all these and come up with XXXX,OK Cooler air is more dense so it holds More O2 Now more O2 + Boost XX = More fuel. . More Fuel= More Hp... More Hp = heat. . At some point the cooler air will add hp and may drop Cylinder temps. . I don't know the math were it would be at,or at what point the conversion would take place.