Archived Help! 24v dead won't start

[DieselTim]

Started bucking/sputtering yest. changed fuel filter, finally got it restarted and limped about 50 miles. Anytime I stepped on it, it would buck like crazy. Read lots of post today, added fuel psi gauge. Have about 8-10psi at Idle and 4-6 at 1800-2000 rpm. Everything is stock on this truck but the airfilter. I took it to Advance Auto to read the OBD II codes. After they cleared the codes, now it will not start. I thought maybe it got an air bubble from adding the fuel gauge so I bleed out 1,3,4 injectors and it still will not start. The guy reading the codes says one of them is a 16** and that means a bad computer. Help me out guys, I know some has the right anwser.



Thanks, Dieseltim

 

[DieselMinded]

Only 4-6 @ those RPM's useing stock fueling ..... What about WOT wouldnt that be 0 psi and inturn Hammering your VP ... maybe shes hurt ??



If the Codes are bad computer Why dont you think thats what it is ??



DM

 

[DieselTim]

ok went back to the truck to get the codes, because I dont really belive he knew what they were, he called someone to read the codes from another book. I am not really sure they knew much about diesel truck.

The codes are



p0463 fuel level sensor a circuit high input ( bad fuel sending unit, I already knew that one)

p1693 Manfacurer Contrl. Aux input / Aux output. ( this is the one that he says is a bad computer)

p0234 Eng overboost condition

Yes I think 4-6 is low but I still think it would start with 10 or so. I am not real sure about how accurate this gage is as the only one they had was a 0- 100 psi oil gage, so it is in the low part of the gage so, maybe not that accurate.



Tim

 

[DieselTim]

Ok as per a post from Marco, I am going back to the truck to remove the neg. batt wires to reset the emc. I found this in another postin and figure it cannot hurt. be back in a few min.



Tim

 

[DieselMinded]

You wouldnt think it was a VP problem with those codes.



Over boost is no big deal



P1693

Companion Code (CODE SET IN ECM)



You would have that code for anything



there wrong



P0463 is your problem



DM

 

[DieselTim]

I would think the p0463 was talking about the fuel gage.



I did get it to start after I removed the batt. cables but it still stumbled even at idle so i shut it off and unpluged and repluged all 3 of the cable connection at the firewall on the pass side (with the batts disconnected of course). After that it will not start again, so wait till tomorrow to see if I can find a pump that will put out 20#or so.



Tim

 

[tractorface]

Air

Dead VP's do not always put out codes. Are you sure your not getting air in the system. Sounds like air to me. When you changed the filter did you install the gasket? Maybe two gaskets thick by accident? Check the old filter for a gasket, if its not there where is it? Remeber you can suck air without leaking fuel

Good luck.

 

[tractorface]

One more thing

Forgot. Check the MAP sensor also. Overboost code may be due to bad MAP sensor. You really need a manual, or a good diesel shop. Codes are a nice tool but not the end all beat all some think they are.

 

[DieselTim]

Ok took off 1/2 day from work, added carter black pump. Now I have 15-20psi. but still no start. It will hit some but never runs for more then a few sec. Where is the Map sensor? how do I check it?

Tim

 

[Azhuskcarr]

Might want to check your injector lines off your mkvA

 

[DieselMinded]

Here This May Help

 

[DieselTim]

Ok at the risk of sounding lost what is a mkva? I have tried to bleed the injection lines at 1,3,4,5. I do get fuel at 3,4 and a bit at 1. But still no starting more than a few seconds every now and then. I am searching the post for info on location and how to check the MAP sensor.

Tim

 

[Azhuskcarr]

I screwed up, i mean vp44. sorry!

 

[DieselTim]

Ok, guys I am at a loss. It seems that it will start for just a few seconds after it has sat for several hours, after that it will crank and crank but not hit a lick. I have 15-20 psi fuel pressure and it turns over with plenty of speed so I know the batts are not low. It acts like this is some kind of electrical problem that warms up after just a few mins and then stops it from fueling, because when it does start it runs smooth for the short time it runs. Can a MAP or any other sensors make it shut down if they are bad? Is it possible to have the injection pump and ECM tested while they are still on the truck?



How hard is it to change the front timing cover over to run a 12v pump and get rid of this electronic junk? Can a 24v block be made to run with a 12v pump?



Tim

 

[DieselTim]

Ok, finally got a big enough trailer to get it home on. Went to get it up on the trailer and it started right up, and ran just long enough to get it loaded up. 2 hrs later it had cooled down enough with the temp in the upper 50f that I guess what ever it is that is causing the problem desided to work again, because it started up and ran long enough to get it off the trailer and into a parking spot here at home. I am now very suspect of something electrical that is breaking down as it gets warm, because when it dies it is just like I shut off the key, it is dead instantly. Some times it will start again for a few seconds but most of the time it will not, after it runs for about 3-5 mins it will just crank and crank and not hit again until you wait for several hours for it to be ice cold. I removed the computer box from the pass. side firewall, I know where there is another 98. 5 24v that I am thinking of putting my box in it to see if it will work in that truck. If it doesn't then I guess I will be looking for another one for mine. If it does then I wander if the injection pump electronics is the probelm.

Can anyone tell me if there are any sensors that will make it shut down like this?



Thanks, Tim

 

[acook]

As strange as this may sound unplug your lift pump and try starting the engine. it should start and idle. if it runs like this then the vp44 is bad. this info came from a cummins engineer on a problem we were having with an engine when i was working for a distributorship. has something to do with the lift pump pressure holding something closed internally in a worn vp44. can't remember the technical term he used

 

[DieselTim]

Ok, found a post about location of ECM, so tomorrow I will check it and maybe remove it for testing also.

Tim

 

[tractorface]

Hope I am wrong but my money is on the injector pump.

Good Luck

FWIW there is some kind of tester that connects to the pump and if the truck runs with the tester installed the pump is ok. Read about it on a website just can not remember who. Maybe someone else will chime in.

 

[CObst]

My 2003 is doing the same thing so I hope some one can help. If the truck is stone cold it will run for a few min less time if I try to drive it hard at all. If you let it cool for 10 min it will run about a min. Less you let it cool shorter time it will run. My truck started this after a weekend when I installed TC,VB, input shaft, and 80 hp injectors. So the air leak thing might be the prob. I am going to the dealer monday post what I find out.

 

[Dieseldemon]

Does the tach work when it runs if not it is the crank pos sen. it is right behind the starter it will shut it down because the computer does not know the crank is turning