Help Dodge-Tech

[DavidTD]

My truck, a 98 24v, is dead. I have tried to get help and welcome yours and anyone elses opinion as to what is going on.

Truck was running fine. Fueled up at a local truck stop I normally fuel at. Drove about 20 - 30 miles and shut it down. A few hours later when going to leave, the truck would not fire up. Finally it did and I headed home. Made one stop and left it running. As I eased the clutch out, it died. Took many more tries to get it going, drained some fuel from the filter etc. trying to get it to fire. It finally did. Truck ran fine once going and I was pulling about 8k. Next day truck would not fire. went through this same procedure and finally got it to fire. I ran it and could feel the truck surging as I accelerated. It also has a kinda miss at idle.

Today I put a fuel pressure gauge on the filter to check for lift pump pressure. It would peg 10 psi on both sides of the filter as the pump activated with the key on. I fired the truck up and it ran for about 5 secs and died. Has not run since. I changed the fuel filter anyway but it is still not running.

The only other thing I can think of that seemed a bit strange was when I would rev it up, the engine seemed to be much quieter than before and I tried another 24v and it didn't do it. Have I lost my injection pump?

Truck has 77k miles on it, has had the VA on since about 40k miles. Ideas??????

Thanks in advance... .

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David
1998 3500 QC 4x4 5 speed 4:10, 235-85-16, VA CPC via JRE, PS Boost Module, K&N air filter. Emerald Green w/tan leather. B&W turnover ball.
1/4 mile 18. 2 @ 74. 75mph
1999 Exiss 3 horse slant, 4ft midtack, 6ft shortwall dressing.
70k miles as of 6/21/00

 

[illflem]

Sounds to me like you're sucking air from somewhere. Could be leaking fuel hoses or a lose fitting.

 

[ralphr]

Did you notice the smell of the fuel? Could be contaminadated, (water or gas??!!). open the valve on the filter and drain some out into a glass jar. Let it sit for 10 - 15 min, then look at it, and smell it. Does it have the "look" of diesel? or is it cloudy?

If to much water, and/or gas could do serious problems to injector pump. good luck.

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1999 3500 quad cab, auto aero fendor trim and running boards,
bugflector II, K&N filter, Geno's monster tip

 

[Dodge-Tech]

What I would first do is take the truck to a person or shop that has a scan tool to read the cummins ecm and the truck's pcm. Have them check for codes in both. If there is an injector pump problem, there should be codes for the problem in the ecm. No codes in either controller would most likely indicate a fuel quality or prime problem. By the sound of your symptoms, it could go either way. Hope this helps,
Chris

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98. 5 24 valve clubcab custom dual exhaust w/5" tips, Autometer pyro & boost gauges, K&N filter, 3" lift kit, 33"x16. 50"x16. 5" Dick Cepek Fun Country Radials, Standard PE, PE-EZ, 275 injectors, no turbo silencer ring.

 

[MikeR]

David,I'd hate to say it,but it sounds like your injector pump is toast. Is the truck chugging out white smoke when taking a long time trying to start it? We had the same problem with Evan Becks' 98. 5 two days before he was suppose to trade it in,and it had the same symptoms as you. I work at an import car dealership,but our OBD II scan-tools work in everything. Plugging the scan-tool in told us what we needed to know.

One other thing to check is the small rubber fuel hose that connects the lift pump line to the injector pump line. Make sure it isn't split.

-Mike

[This message has been edited by MikeR (edited 11-12-2000). ]

 

[Ram_Kowboy]

Any chance you filled up with gasoline rather than diesel?

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98 Properly Valved 4x4 SWB QC ISB A/T Metallic Red w/ tan cloth interior, DC nerf bars, DC two piece mud-flaps, 275 h. p. injectors, Monroe Gas Magnums, Armor Tuff spray in bed liner, Goodyear Wrangler ATS 285/75r/16, BD Heavy Duty Valve body. Walker 21468 thru flow muffler,Cobra 29 NWST CB. American Racing Wheels. Power Edge EZ control modual.

 

[DavidTD]

Thanks for all of the replies. I have a couple of questions/comments.

First - it has diesel in it... . and lots of it right now. LOL

I looked at the hose you mentioned and can see no split or problem. I quess there could be a small split somewhere but would that cause it not to run at all or just poor?

If the injector pump leaves a code in the ecm, would it not trip the check engine light?

Finally, when it quit yesterday it did it with a puff of smoke, not sure what color though.

Thanks again,



------------------
David
1998 3500 QC 4x4 5 speed 4:10, 235-85-16, VA CPC via JRE, PS Boost Module, K&N air filter. Emerald Green w/tan leather. B&W turnover ball.
1/4 mile 18. 2 @ 74. 75mph
1999 Exiss 3 horse slant, 4ft midtack, 6ft shortwall dressing.
70k miles as of 6/21/00

 

[MikeR]

When Evan's pump bit the dust,it NEVER set the check engine light,but the code was sure there. He drove it 20mi to my work,where it died and stayed the night. It puffed a white/very light grayish smoke while we cranked for a long time trying to start it. After it sat for several hours,it would start,but run bad and stalled alot. We managed to put another 10mi to get to the Dodge dealer,where it died and wouldn't restart at all. His engine was bone stock.

-Mike

 

[Dodge-Tech]

This is exactly true-a code in the ECM may or may not set the light off. I recently replaced an injector pump on an '00 that would shut off going down the road. The check engine light never came on, but there were two codes in the ECM indicating an injector pump failure.

 

[DavidTD]

Well, I guess from everyones comments she'll go to the dealer this week if I can get her there. We'll see what they say... .

David

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David
1998 3500 QC 4x4 5 speed 4:10, 235-85-16, VA CPC via JRE, PS Boost Module, K&N air filter. Emerald Green w/tan leather. B&W turnover ball.
1/4 mile 18. 2 @ 74. 75mph
1999 Exiss 3 horse slant, 4ft midtack, 6ft shortwall dressing.
70k miles as of 6/21/00

 

[strick]

Boy that's bad news. If you have problems getting the truck to the dealer I can bring my big flatbed and haul it. At least it would be pulled by a green dodge like yours and not a power joke! Let me know. I hope everything works out.

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'99 3500HD flatbed, 5 spd 4:10 Posi, homebuilt underbody toolboxes & cowcatcher, 4" down w/straight stack(speak-up! I can't hear you!), K&N filter, what silencer ring? mudgrips, banks pyro & boost guage, sw fuel guage, 50% 3 wire BlueBox(HOLYSMOKE), Psycotty air, thinking about 1/2" fuel lines(real hard)

 

[DavidTD]

Thanks Strick,

You know I wouldn't let my truck on a Ford wrecker. We had our Ford wreckers towed to many times themselves... #ad


I'll just have to load her up on the GMC 6500 and let the CAT 3116 haul her in. #ad


Now I may need to talk to ya about hauling a John Deere 450C loader for me though. #ad




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David
1998 3500 QC 4x4 5 speed 4:10, 235-85-16, VA CPC via JRE, PS Boost Module, K&N air filter. Emerald Green w/tan leather. B&W turnover ball.
1/4 mile 18. 2 @ 74. 75mph
1999 Exiss 3 horse slant, 4ft midtack, 6ft shortwall dressing.
70k miles as of 6/21/00

 

[Dave Fritz]

Those of you with 98-01 Rams with Anti Theft system (LSA) should be aware of these TSB's in case your truck does not start, or it starts and dies:

TSB 08-24-00
Part of "No Start" diagnosis on vehicles equipped with VTSS should include a verification check of the power supply to the Central Timer Module (CTM). The CTM provides the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) with an "OK To Start" message via the CCD bus. If the message is not received by the PCM, the PCM will not allow the engine to start. Initially, the engine may start and stall but will eventually not start at all. http://www.ece.vt.edu/~dfritz/technical/TSB00/08-24-00.htm


TSB 08-26-00 (applies to 00-01 Rams)
Strong electromagnetic fields or devices that transmit signals in the 315 Mhz range may cause the Central Timer Module (CTM) to intermittently lock up. CTM lock-up may cause a variety of customer complaints including Engine Will Not Start (if equipped with Vehicle Theft Alarm)
Note: You may be able to get the truck running by temporarily removing power to the CTM (pull fuse 13 - power door lock fuse or disconnect the battery)
http://www.ece.vt.edu/~dfritz/technical/TSB00/08-26-00.htm

Dave
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1994 2500HD 4X4 modified for off-road camping
2001 2500 ETH/DEE QC SB 4X4
Fritz's Dodge Ram Tech Page

[This message has been edited by Dave Fritz (edited 11-14-2000). ]

 

[DavidTD]

We'll she's been to the dealer for an injection pump. She came out running fine. 200 miles +/- later she stalled/quit running just like the last time. Towed it back in and the dealer said they had no codes but would change the transfer pump. This one was not under warranty and cost be BIG bucks. Took the truck home and it still is not right. The truck has a miss at idle still. It has had it for 40k or so miles but now after I drive it it gets much worse. Worse meaning much more consistant and noticable. It did this both times just before it would quit so I took it in today BEFORE it quit. Spoke to the tech and he does not have a clue. (His words not mine) Said it can't be sucking air because it would be hard to start, said it cannot be the ECM, and said it possibly could be an injector but doubtful. Said it wasn't valve adjustment either for the miss. I wonder if I have had a bad injector pump at all. I did not test pressure since it got back but from what I was told I am still putting out 10psi fuel pressure at idle AFTER the new transfer pump.

So what gives. I don't think an injector would stop the truck from running. I think the ECM could. I also showed the tech where the truck was missing badly at idle. I then shut it down and fired it back up. Smooth as silk. I figured maybe the ECM reset something when you restart. He says no way. I have a truck that I don't trust to drive far and a tech/dealership that has never seen this. Been two weeks since it first went in. Man, I need my truck bad!!

Anybody have a clue?

David

 

[Jetson]

The 98's had the injector tubes that couldn't be re-used. Maybe one developed a leak, which would account for the miss. The dealer may have loosened the lines to the injector tubes and not replaced them. Did the dealer find any codes set?

 

[WCrovo]

Jezzzzz. These new vehicles are to complicated to repair without proper tools and knowledge. I have a VW, Porsche and Audi independent repair shop and have worked for dealers all over the west. Most shade trees cause more problems than they solve. If the dealer you are takeing it to is shrugging their shoulders and scratching their *** get your bucks back, have them put your old parts back on (4 free) and take the thing to someone that knows what they are doing. Sounds to me like you need to find a good wrench. DodgeTech I salute you for giving us help on your own time. Most techs are so burned out they could care less after hours. You must be young or new to this.

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2001 2500 tow, camper, SWB, ETH, Bright white.

 

[WCrovo]

Jezzzzz. These new vehicles are to complicated to repair without proper tools and knowledge. I have a VW, Porsche and Audi independent repair shop and have worked for dealers all over the west. Most shade trees cause more problems than they solve. If the dealer you are takeing it to is shrugging their shoulders and scratching their *** get your bucks back, have them put your old parts back on (4 free) and take the thing to someone that knows what they are doing. Sounds to me like you need to find a good wrench. DodgeTech I salute you for giving us help on your own time. Most techs are so burned out they could care less after hours. You must be young or new to this.

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2001 2500 tow, camper, SWB, ETH, Bright white.

 

[WCrovo]

Jezzzzz. These new vehicles are to complicated to repair without proper tools and knowledge. I have a VW, Porsche and Audi independent repair shop and have worked for dealers all over the west. Most shade trees cause more problems than they solve. If the dealer you are takeing it to is shrugging their shoulders and scratching their *** get your bucks back, have them put your old parts back on (4 free) and take the thing to someone that knows what they are doing. Sounds to me like you need to find a good wrench. DodgeTech I salute you for giving us help on your own time. Most techs are so burned out they could care less after hours. You must be young or new to this.

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2001 2500 tow, camper, SWB, ETH, Bright white.

 

[WCrovo]

The 2nd two don't count... ... .

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2001 2500 tow, camper, SWB, ETH, Bright white.

 

[1tuffram]

Seems to me I was recently reading one of the many threads posted about poor running 24 valver. Long story short was after much trouble shooting the owner finally convinced the dealer to replace ECM. Problem solved. Can't remember what the thread specifics was about so the ECM may how no relavence to your situation.

When we started to hear about the up-coming ISB and all the great electronics I was skeptical about the reliability and not to mention the added difficulty to trobleshoot problems and repair them. The more I read about the ISB the more hesitant I am to trade-in my '95. There is beauty in simplicity.