Archived Help, she cranks but wont start

[kurtperry]

I recently let my 96 pass to my Daughter, she called from work the other night to say the truck was cranking but wouldnt start. I responded and popped the hood. after looking around a bit, I noted that the gauge on the air filter box was in the red so I removed the air filter and the truck started and she drove it home. I replaced the filter early next morning but now the truck still wont start so that wasnt the only problem. It has 204k miles on it and has never had an issue with the lift pump or injector pump. I did have a problem a couple years ago with the return line rotting and allowing the fuel to drain out on the ground which I fixed. I know she is overdo for a new fuel filter and that is next on the list. if that doesnt correct the problem, where do I look next????

 

[CrosbyJ]

try fuseable link

 

[EKlem]

It is probably worth taking a look at the fuel shutdown solenoid. These engines should fire as long as they get fuel. To check the solenoid, locate the solenoid on the back of the injection pump. Note the position of the plunger coming out of it. Then have someone turn the ignition to the on position and bump the starter. When they do this, see if the arm moves and stays in the new position. There are a couple of things that I can think of but this would be the first one I would check. Good luck getting it fixed.

 

[Joe G.]

If the fuel solenoid does not pull up unless you pull it up by hand. The most probable cause is the fuel solenoid relay. It is the larger of the two relays on the fire wall between the engine and the master cylinder. The blue wire on the positive post of the driver's side battery is a fusable link. It could have failed or it could be corroded or lose.



If the fuel solenoid does pull up then the most probably cause is the fuel hoses leaking air. There are other things that could cause this problem. Read this:

http://dieselram.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=45;t=000007

 

[kurtperry]

Ok, I replaced and primed the fuel filter, the solenoid is working properly and the fusable link is intact. Still cranks but not starting... ... ... return line is intact and not leaking as far as I can tell.

Any other ideas?????

 

[Joe G.]

Did you read the link I posted above? It's all about the fuel system. How it works. What can happen to stop it from working. How to find the problem and how to fix it.

 

[kurtperry]

Tried that link, it wont open!!

 

[Joe G.]

I get a time out now when I try to access that web site. I'm not at my computer or I would e-mail you the article. Sorry about being slow to answer. Just got back from trying to catch some salmon in the Umpqua River. Skunked today.



You need to realize that you cannot see an air leak in a fuel hose. So just looking at it means nothing. If the hoses are the original then they must be replaced. The originals are just plain no good. If the hoses have been replaced with gasoline fuel hoses they will fail even faster than the originals. If you need to get on the road new fuel hoses from a parts house will do that if the problem is a fuel hose air leak. Then you will have to get some diesel rated hose to finish the job.



If the fuel hoses are ok, then the next place I would look is the fuel heater. It's a black plastic thing that looks kind of like a hockey puck. Take it out, you don't need it anyway. A 17mm socket will remove the pre-filter. Then an 8mm allen wrench will remove the fuel heater. Then put the pre-filter back in place with one of the two gaskets and leave the fuel heater out. If the truck still does not run let me know.

 

[kurtperry]

Hey Joe,



It finally cooled off enough for me to crawl under the truck and take a serious look. I had already replaced the hoses once with parts house hose..... didnt know any better then. yes, on closer inspection, they are cracked and are now on the floor board of my 2000 dodge. for a parts run tomorrow. I dont have a diagram to work from but after looking around under the truck, is the pre heater on top of the fuel tank??????



Where oh where can a person get some diesel rated hose, I tried asking for it at Napa last time and they looked at me like I was a nut job, swore there was no difference, and sold me the **** thats on the floor board now.



Where is the screen that was mentioned as needing to be cleaned in one of the entries on that other sight???



-- email address removed --

 

[kurtperry]

Oh yeah, sorry you got skunked... . story of my life lately. Had a chance to do a bit of fishing in Maui a couple weeks ago..... no joy for me either!!! But hey, a bad day in Maui is still better then a good day in Arizona this time of the year!!!!

 

[Joe G.]

I complained and now they have changed their "how to" forum. It works now at

http://dieselram.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=45;t=000007



If it gives you any trouble about logging in or something like that just join the forum. It's free.



You can get very good thick walled diesel hose at:

http://www.fostertruck.com/dodge/default.htm



If you can get access to the dieselram link I have some pictures of a bad fuel heater and how the fuel heater/pre-filter assembly looks like without the fuel heater.



In AZ you probably could use a fuel cooler instead of a fuel heater anyway.



I'm going to be off line until late tomorrow. Maybe the next day.

 

[kurtperry]

Thank you Joe,



The pictures really help!



I will check a marine supply tomorrow and see if I can locate some of that hose locally, I need to get my Daughters truck back on the road. It would never have occured to me to look at a marine application hose but now it seems pretty obvious!!!

 

[kurtperry]

Hey everyone,



It turns out that almost any Marine supply store carries the correct grade of fuel hose for our beloved Cummins engines... ... . Who Knew!!!! Just in case you were wondering, this is a triple ply fire resistant alcohol/Diesel rated hose with an inner lining approved by the US Coast Guard for use in maritime applications!!! I am in the Phoenix metro area and located more than 7 stores, the closest of which was 10 miles from me that had it in stock at about $2. 50 per foot..... West Marine on the Northwest corner of McClintock and Southern Avenue.



I am about to step out into the 109 degree heat that is Phoenix at this time of year and install the new lines..... I will let you know how it turns out!!!



2 hours later... ... . I have changed all the rubber that can be changed, removed the fuel heater from the pre filter and it still wont start. Do I need to somehow bleed the air from the system at the injectors and if so, how????



Its hot, I am tired, and I could sure use a helpful hint if anyone has one!!!!

 

[Gene Arnold]

There is a hand primer on the delivery pump. Push it madly a lot of times until you hear the fuel pressure relief valve on the injector pump. This worked for me. Hope it helps.



Gene

 

[kurtperry]

Success!!!!



Ok, here is what I think was the problem and why I had such a bad time with it. I started this whole thing assuming that it couldnt be the rubber fuel lines as I had previously repaired them... . Bad Assumption but now they are correctly repaired with USCG approved fuel line.



I assumed there was fuel in the tank..... Maybe there was, maybe there wasnt, couldnt tell due to the 12% grade of my driveway and the fact it was parked nose up. I poured 10 gallons into the tank today, rechecked all my new lines and the connections on the banjo fittings. I then took the advice of the previous post and fabricated a handle to operate the primer button and spent 10 minutes pumping. Keep in mind the aforementioned 12% grade and the trucks nose up position. after 10 minutes of pumping, it caught and ran smoothly.



I surmise that due to the nose up attitude of the truck, I probably never sufficiently primed the system following the initial hose replacement. Reference this link and read the description in the fuel hose replacement kit they sell,http://www.fostertruck.com/dodge/default.htm, "especially if parked facing uphill with low fuel"



I didnt have this trouble last time I did the line replacement but then, the truck was parked on level ground and had an almost full tank of fuel, i maybe pumped the primer 50 times and it started right up. sometimes our previous experience can lead us into a bad place with the assumptions we make.



Thanks to all of you who offered your help and thank you to Joe G for the excellant article and pictures.