High aluminum levels in '03 oil

[JFulford]

I've got an '03 2500 4wd 48RE HO. I just sent out for an Oil analysis on my second oil change(from 6500-14500) and noticed an above average aluminum level(8 ppm). I wasn't worried about this until a friend with a 2cnd Gen told me he had never seen more than 2 ppm on his. Has anybody else had similar results on an 03? I'm using premium blue and a stratopore filter.

thanks

jeff

 

[GHanna]

Wow, you sure went a long way on your first two oil changes. I don't care what Dodge says- it's a good idea to do the first oil change in short order to get all the break in grit and stuff out of there. I don't know if your oil analysis is high or just a result of breaking in. Good luck.

 

[GHanna]

P. S. I didn't mean to imply that Cummins purposely puts grit in the engine, just the inevitable bits left behind from manufacturing and what the engine makes as parts wear in.

 

[JFulford]

aluminum levels

Yeah, I was hoping to compromise between 3000-7500 and got distracted(well, the truck was in Arizona before I remembered!)

I probably should have done it around 500-1000(like the gasers I used to rebuild).

jf

 

[LightmanE300]

I think your intervals are fine. I also think the levels are just due to the engine breaking in, and nothing to worry about. You won't get any really meaningful oil analysis reports until you've hit around 20k miles. Keep on truckin!

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Here's a report on my last analysis on my old '91 truck - note both miles on oil, and aluminum ppm - as well as other numbers - virtually EVERY analysis I have had done has had aluminum down at 2 ppm, including this one on my '91, 'til I sold it at 120,000 miles...



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I wouldn't worry about 8 ppm at all - just keep checking at decent intervals... I did first oil change on my '02 at under 500 miles - second at 1000 miles, then at 5000 miles on Delo 400 oil, analysis, aluminum was... YEP, 2 ppm!

 

[Gauthier]

Gary - KJ6Q

What oil did you use on your oil analysis report? Very high boron levels.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

That particular sample shown was on Rotella T - all my Rotella samples were up in that area with Rotella, and Boron is supposedly a detergent/dispersent agent - or antifreeze inhibiter - but never was any evidence of antifreeze on the oil, and after switching to Delo 400, Boron has been at 1 ppm - so maybe a typical Rotella reading?

 

[Gauthier]

Is that the 15w-40 non-synthetic Rotella T? Why did you switch to Delo 400? Looks like very good wear levels on your report.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

This was on the old '91 - never used anything but Delo 400 in the new truck because various comparison reports give it a slight edge over the Rotella in terms of wear protection - and it was the plain dino Rotella...



I had used both Delo and Rotella on the '91, and the Boron bit only showed when ussing the Rotella - Blackstone never commented on it in their reports, but DID comment on the absence of antifreeze in the oil...

 

[BillGotthelf]

Don't worry about readings at 8ppm for aluminum as it probably is coming from the crankshaft bearings and crankshaft wear seals. New from the factory they are very rough and are designed to wear smooth as glass but it takes 20-30,000 miles for this to take place. After 30,000 miles it would be unusual to see that much aluminum in your oil sample and would neccessitate further inspection.

 

[Gauthier]

Gary - KJ6Q



I’m not insinuating there was an indication of a problem with your oil analysis, quite the contrary. The wear levels a very low for the miles indicated. I was just surprised at the boron levels. I didn’t realize Rotella had such high levels. Boron levels have increased during the last few years in oils such as Mobil 1 and Delvac 1. Even Amsoil is raising the boron levels in several oil series.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"Don't worry about readings at 8ppm for aluminum as it probably is coming from the crankshaft bearings and crankshaft wear seals. "



I don't recall aluminum as being a primary component of crankshaft bearings or various seals... I thought it primarily came from pistons...

 

[DwayneKelch]

You can find aluminum in bushings, some bearings (not sure if used in babbitt bearings in Cummins), pistons, turbo chargers, compressor wheels

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Well yeah, *I* WOULD worry if aluminum from my turbo compressor wheel was finding a way into my crankcase...

 

[JFulford]

Thanks!

Thanks for all the info, guys! I was hoping it was the breakin process, and it looks like it probably is.

Thanks again,

jeff

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Vaughn's aluminum

My first two samples on my 2003 gave me:



Miles on Truck: 9985

Mi. on Delo 400: 7775

Aluminum: 3ppm

Iron: 23ppm



Next sample

Miles on Truck: 16559

Mi on Delo 400: 6574

Aluminum: 3ppm

Iron: 19ppm



Vaughn

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

MY first sample on my '02 at 6000 miles was 2 ppm aluminum, 19 iron - second at 13,000 miles was 2 ppm aluminum, 9 iron - and THAT is with nasty 'ol Delo 400 as well... Lots of RV towing in there as well...

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

2 items that DO make me curious, is that my copper is a bit higher than I would think, at 7 ppm, and tin at 3 ppm - dunno where the copper might be from, bearings perhaps - tin is probably bearings, maybe due to lots of towing on an engine still a bit tight. My next sample will be at around 27,000 miles, with about 5000 miles on the oil - should be pretty well seated in by then, and an interesting analysis. I'm expecting good things from the Delo - but best analysis in the past have been with Rotella - but that was on a well broken in engine...

 

[amsoilman]

Gary,

I wouldn't worry about your copper at 7 ppm, or your tin at 3 ppm. Those numbers are low.



I have a general chart for the Cummins engines, and based on a

"Normal" Drain interval, which would be around 10,000 miles, Copper (Cu) levels of 40 ppm would be at the condemnation level. Tin (Sn) levels would be around 10 ppm to be considered condemned. Of course the longer time on the oil would change the numbers.



Also, If you had a high number of copper, and a low number of Chromium (Cr) the copper would not be coming from the bearings, as the last metal element to go on a bearing is Chromium (Cr). The copper is under the Chromium. High numbers of Copper in our trucks often come from the oil cooler located just behind the OEM oil filter.



Here is what the chart shows based on the "Normal" drain interval:



Iron= 50 ppm

Chromium= 10 ppm

Lead= 25 ppm

Copper= 40 ppm

Tin= 10 ppm

Aluminum= 10 ppm

Nickel= 8 ppm

Silicon 20ppm *



*Over oil Baseline

**Levels will also vary due to operating conditions, component age and manufacturing differences in.



Wayne

amsoilman