Higher GCWR on '97 3500

[rwilliams4]

Hello!

I have a 1997 3500 with 3:54 rear end and an automatic. The GCWR on this is 16,000 lbs. The truck weighs 7,000 lbs. so that limits me to 9,000 lbs of fifth-wheel to pull. That is not much of a fifth. Could I beef up the transmission in order to raise my towing capabilities? I would like to be able to pull about 13,000 lbs. I have an exhaust brake (Pacbrake) so I hope I have the stopping covered. We have a 7,000 lb. fifth that we pull now, but want larger. Would appreciate any opinions or suggestions on this. Thanks.

 

[rickhans]

There have been several lengthy threads on this exact topic over the last 3 or 4 months. They discuss the legal issues as well as the practical issues of going over the gcvw. Try going back and looking for anything with GCVW in it.



To sum it up, however, it seems that everyone ignores the GCVW because the actual capability of the 2500 and 3500 with a Cummins exceeds that. I tow a 16k load with mine. I weigh in on the scales at 24,400 lbs, just below the legal max of 8800 + 16,000. You will also find that the rules vary depending on what state you are in.

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by B'Gate

I tow a 16k load with mine. I weigh in on the scales at 24,400 lbs, just below the legal max of 8800 + 16,000.

I think there's a misunderstanding here about GCVWR. The GCVWR of 16,000 lbs means that is the maximum that the truck and trailer combined can weigh. If the laden curb weight of the truck is, for instance, 7,500 lbs, the trailer cannot weigh more than 8,500 lbs for a truck with a GCVWR of 16,000 lbs.



As an example, we are ordering a 2002 3500 ETH/DEE 4x2 with 4. 10 rear axle. In 2001, this truck had a GCVWR of 21,500 lbs and a "trailer tow rating" of 14,700 lbs - therefore, Dodge is estimating the curb weight of the truck to be 21,500 minus 14,700 lbs, or 6,800 lbs. By my reckoning, this curb weight may be light, but even if it is 7,500 lbs, we should be able to pull our 13,500 lb GVWR 5ver with it (21,500 - 7,500 = 14,000 lbs maximum trailer weight).



Rusty

 

[rob10858]

for this month anyway.....

on a dually, take the gvwr on the inside doorpanel 10,100 combine this with the gvwr on the trailer. that will give you your true combined gvwr. keep the gvwr on the truck registration at 10100. but make sure that the cgvwr equals the combination of everything on that part of your registration. we have our cgvwr at 25999 to stay below comm limits, but you can hear from a lot of hotshot drivers that their cgvwr is much higher. as far as the legality and warranty issues are concerned, this is what weve been preached to for many years by both the state and federal dot's. the #'s will never add up to a logical person. the towing capacity set by the mnf of whatever weight [on our 2100 3500's i think 14500 is right] take the 10100 of your one ton , then add 14500 of max trailer wght and you should legally never cgvw of more than 24600. that would be about right since all of our 5th wheel plates read a max cgvw of 27500. this way it appears to me that dodge is being smart and not allowing their trucks to be considered commercial off the showroom floor. take a 550 psd, and even the 450 and 350, and the gvwr on the truck is gradually higher. this is a good selling point as far as "heavy duty" trucks are concerned, but all it does is throw the driver of a company truck into a higher liscence class [ unless their pulling a rv or not business related] and that leads us back to some of the original posts on this subject, how can those of us that pull for business do so legally when the private guys have to worry about being over by 1000 lbgs or so ? the first thing that seems evident is the insurance issue between private and business related vehicles. when i see a one ton pulling a car trailor wtih three luxury vans up the road, i have to wonder what would dc think of that cgvwr?

 

[rickhans]

Packman, it seems like I keep seeing something new pop up on this subject. You say your 5th wheel plates read max 27500 GCVW. Do you mean GVW? If not what is GCVW on a trailer. My GN is registered at 16k GVW and my truck at 8800 which keeps me below the 26001 req'd for commercial, although I am over DC's GCVWR. As has been said before, Texas DPS does not look at GCVWR, only the GVW of the truck and trailer combined.



Does this mean that your GCVWR is 27500 + 10,100?

 

[RustyJC]

OK, fellows, I know that I'm opening myself up for flaming by even mentioning this, but I think that each individual should have all the information possible before making his/her decisions. In that spirit I offer the following:



I'm fully aware that some states (Texas included) will license a rig at weights far in excess of the manufacturers' ratings - I have a cousin who runs a hotshot rig consisting of a 2001 F350 dually pulling a 40' tandem dually gooseneck, and his Texas apportioned plates are good for 40,000 lbs combined. Nevertheless, if he or any other individual is involved in an accident (regardless of fault), a sharp lawyer is going to look at the manufacturer's ratings for GVWR and GCVWR and then go into the full attack mode if any of these ratings are exceeded. Also, some insurance companies will attempt to refuse to take liability if one is knowingly exceeding the manufacturer's ratings for a vehicle.



That's why we've made the decision to purchase a new truck with a 21,500 CGVWR - pulling our 13,500 GVWR 5ver, we're running about 800 lbs over Dodge's rated 19,000 GCVWR for our 96 3500 dually. We decided the potential financial risks are just too great running what a court might decide is an overloaded rig (i. e. , exceeding the manufacturer's ratings. )



Please don't take this wrong - I'm not preaching at anyone. Everyone must make their own decisions on this matter - I just wanted to point out what I consider a critical factor that should be part of that decision.



Rusty

 

[rob10858]

gates, your right and im wrong on the hitch specs, "do not exceed 27500 lbgs gross vehicle weight" see, it can always turn around and bite you. okay, i drive a 3500 with a reese hitch, exhaust brake aux 90 gal tank etc. etc. the trailer that i pull is a 24 ft tandem axle [ 8 wheels] with a gvw of 20000 lbs. we have it registered at 15000 gvwr and 20000 gvw. i got tired of my 10000 lbd load constantly blowing tires and bending axles on our 4 tire [ two 8000 lb axles. every sign pointed to overload] i love the fact that the heavier trailor has twice the stopping power and rubber on the road. i still dont gcvw over 25000 at the scales, so how can this be unsafe? if you read between the lines , im right on the edge of being considered overloaded. as far as the heavier rigs are concerned we have a couple of 6500 gmc cat's that are commercial and a couple of 550 psd's that sadly are about to become commercial. we all pull the same weights across the same terrain, but i am still strongly resisting the idea of our dodges being overloaded, mainly because weve had them for 12 years with no safety or overload symptoms . common sense always will tell most towers when they are overloaded, but some times that is a hard lesson learned. ive learned more than my share over the years, and feel more comfortable with my current setup than anytime in the past. just my opinon . again this is with a constant weight on the trailers.