HO vs. SO?

[mike r]

I'm not usually on these pages but have a few questions about the '03 engines. What are the differences specifically due to HP no's? I have a dealer that has been sitting on a 2500 4x4 4-door and it has a SO auto 47RE. I thought the 48's took over back around the first of the year. Do all the upgrades to my old 47 still work on this trans? Do all of the engine upgrades provide similar results? Thanks, Mike.

 

[SRadke]

I'm a little confused at your question. Are you looking for the diffrences between 03 HO's and SO's or are you looking for the diffrences between the 03's and your 99? Also, are you looking to put 47RE transmission upgrades from your 99 on a new 47RE? I'm trying to understand your questions so we can offer better answers.

-Scott

 

[mike r]

Differences in Engine and Transmissions

First Engines 1) Do the comp or ez boxes produce similar results between the SO and HO '03's. If not, how much difference in HP. 2)Are the injectors the same or different? Is the pump the same? Is all the HP difference made with electronics? Second Transmissions: 1) is this the same piece of trash that I got in '99. 2)How is it that a 47RE is still in production? I couldn't find a build date on the sticker. Thanks, Mike

 

[Benson]

If the transmission on the '03 is the 47RE, yes, it's the same transmission as on the '99. The 48RE came into production last December so that must be an realy '03. I think the injectors are the same on the HO and the SO on the 3rd gen trucks. I believe the HP difference is due to different ECM. If I"m wrong about that I'm sure someone will correct me.

 

[DBVZ]

About the 47re, I understand it is the same transmission as prior years with some minor upgrades. The change to the 48re happened in late January, but they used up the remaining 47re's on SO 2500 trucks until a month or two later. After that they put the 48re in trucks with the SO or HO CTD. Sounds like you are looking at a truck produced before April, 2003.



About the SO and the upgrades, everything with the new common rail injection will function differently than the 2002 and earlier CTD's. The Edge for the 2003 is different than the Edge for the 2002 and earlier 24 valves.



That truck has two strikes against it. The 47re and the SO are both going to limit the resale value, and produce performance you may be unhappy with over time if you do any towing.

 

[rlittle]

I guess I have about the same problem trying to figure out what engine to get. Here in Phoenix they are treating the 2003 HO equipted trucks like gold and not discounting them at all. But they are discounting the SO trucks even with the 48 series trannys.

In my case I am looking at a stick so the transmission is not a big deal but they want at least $5000 to $7000 more for a truck with a HO engine. Same truck but 20 % higher if you buy a HO truck with the same goodies. Hard to justify the HO engine.

I understand a 50hp increase but I only pull a 8000 pound fiver so I may not need the extra HP especially with a stick.

Any suggestions or experience would be helpful in deciding what to get.

Rollie

 

[JohndeereG]

Originally posted by rlittle



In my case I am looking at a stick so the transmission is not a big deal but they want at least $5000 to $7000 more for a truck with a HO engine. Same truck but 20 % higher if you buy a HO truck with the same goodies. Hard to justify the HO engine.

I understand a 50hp increase but I only pull a 8000 pound fiver so I may not need the extra HP especially with a stick.

Any suggestions or experience would be helpful in deciding what to get.

Rollie

I have an HO 6-spd and my brother HAD a SO 5-spd (which I think the 5 speed is a step above the old auto). In the 5,100 miles he had the truck, the empty performance was disappointing. His mileage was 4. 5 mpg less than my truck. I fell that he would have needed to chip his truck just to achieve an equal performance rating a my stock HO.



I my opinion, I would consider traveling whatever distance needed to find an area that the HO are more affordable or accept that you are going to spend at least $1,000 to kick the SO in the butt.



BTW, the piston/piston-oiling system is upgraded in the HO and the electronic controls

 

[RankRam]

If you want a good deal on an HO come to Carson City, Nevada. I can tell you it is very easy to get them down to 500 bucks over invoice before rebates! I worked and got them down to invoice.



If you are willing to travel they have a very large inventory and it's well worth the trip.



I'm not affiliated with Carson Dodge, Just a very satisfied customer.

 

[DPKetchum]

H. O. has a heavier flywheel also and bigger/different exhaust manifold.

 

[Elite1]

Rollie, I got my 2003 HO from a guy named Rollie (fleet manager) in Phx. , Avondale Dodge. He gave me a good price, 100. over original invoice. I contacted every Dodge dealer in the state and let them bid for my business, then ordered it from the factory. That way I got it set up just how I wanted it. You may consider a 2004, as all of them are HO models in Arizona, anyway. I sure like the power of my HO ! But either way you will get a good truck.

 

[Steve M]

I have a SO with 47RE. It'll only pull my 10,400 lb high profile 5th wheel 85mph. I ran it up there once on I-75. Not going down hill with the wind either. It pulls the hills 70mph with steeper ones dropping us to around 60mph in O/D. If I lockout O/D I can run about 65mph but it's getting close to redline with the 4. 10.

Running empty it'll rip the tires loose but won't smoke 'em. I'm very happy with the performance and mileage. The only reason I'd want a HO is for the novelty of more power but I don't need it.

This is my third Dodge Cummins truck with a 47R transmission. Maybe luck or the way I drive but I haven't had any transmission trouble except for a shorted governor pressure sensor. The dealership was honest... I'm sure a local transmission shop would have said " Oh my gawd! You need a new transmission and TC!"

 

[RodneyNichols]

Best Prices on Dodge's in the North Western

If you are looking a new H. O. call Dave Smith Motors in Kellogg

Idaho 1-800-635-8000 It's the home of hassel free buying. It's like $150 over factory invoice. then if you want centain options then it goes from there. or www.usautosales.com



example.



I called on an fully loaded H. O. with everything except leather.

Tow pkg.

snow plow special (bigger Alt)

over head comp.

ect. ect.



and it was 33,500. 00



Sometime it's even cheaper buying a plane ticket and flying to Spokcan Wa. and they will come and pick you up and take you to Kellogg 50 miles away. and you still save thousands...



just my thought. . I bought 4 trucks from them. .

 

[JohnSS]

From the Cummins web site. Their faq has a question about the difference in the HO engine vs the SO. Here it is:



What is the difference in the HO engine versus the Standard Output engine?





What did we do to make the HO engine 305 horsepower and 555 lb-ft torque? First we beefed up components such as the pistons to handle this power level. We use gallery-cooled pistons which receive an oil spray to for cooler temperature and longer life. Then we modified software to create the greater horsepower and torque, while staying within all engine and driveline parameters.



the link:

http://www.cummins.com/na/pages/en/....cfm?uuid=00036766-DA2C-1E30-8DDB80C4A8F00000

 

[DBVZ]

Originally posted by rlittle

In my case I am looking at a stick so the transmission is not a big deal but they want at least $5000 to $7000 more for a truck with a HO engine. Same truck but 20 % higher if you buy a HO truck with the same goodies. Hard to justify the HO engine.



Rollie

That kind of price difference is abuse by the dealer. The dealer cost difference for the HO vs the SO is only about $600. Build the truck at Edmunds.com and see. If you order the truck, instead of buying off the lot, you should be able to get exactly what you want at or near dealer invoice less incentives and rebates. If you shop, and are willing to travel to pick it up, you should be able to get it for about $200 under invoice less any incentives and rebates in effect. If you are a business owner, or if you join the local Farm Bureau for about $50, you get an extra discount.

 

[DBVZ]

I went to Edmunds to check, and this is what I found:



2UG Quick Order Package 2UG (N/A in California) info $6,320 $5,562 $5,685

2FG Quick Order Package 2FG (California only) info $5,720 $5,034 $5,145

2FG Quick Order Package 2FG (N/A in California) info $5,720 $5,034 $5,145



The 2UG is the HO, the 2FG California and the 2FG N/A California are both the SO, but with a lower HP for the California version (235 vs 250) The three prices are MSRP, dealer invoice, and what Edmunds calculates you should actually pay. MSRP is exactly $600 for the upgrade to HO, but you ought to be able to get the HO for about $550 over the SO price. Hope this helps.

 

[mike r]

The Deal

Here's the deal. Sticker:39,476 and change. The price out the door:32,749 and change. This is a better deal than I got on my '99 and the wife hasn't said no yet. The Problem, I can't bring myself to part with my '99. It fits my fat rearend too good. FWIW, the '03 has more options too. It has the adjustable pedals in it and would like to know how many guys have these and what they think of them? Dilemas, Dilemas. Mike

 

[ttreibel]

What are the options on the SO are you getting everything?



I got almost everything I wanted and got out the door for 31,600 including sales tax just before Christmas last year.



I got mine at Dave Smith in Kellogg.



From your Sig you seem like you are going to BOMB the SO or HO in either case. For BOMBing I would recommend going with the HO you will probably regret a SO purchase, guys who want more power should only look at the HO option. Try another dealer I drove to Kellogg from the Seattle area I bet I save 3K on that weekend trip.



I am not a BOMBer I upgraded from an old 1990 F-250 7. 3 idi so I was already getting like 75 more ponies. My brother thinks I need more power but I have already got a warning for speeding while pulling the travel trailer from the Washington State Patrol in April.