CPavlic said:
Alright guys heres the situation,I just registered here and now I need some help. I have a 2002 six speed that I got in 03. When I first got it I knew nothing about diesels, but I knew you could get big hp gains pretty easy compared to gassers. So I invested in a superchips programmer and exhaust and intake. Well I started wanting more and I decided since I didnt know much about adding big hp without breaking stuff that banks was what I wanted. Well since then I have been able to get the quick turbo assembly and first a stinger plus box and now a big hoss box level 5. The problem I am having is that when I ran both banks boxes it doesnt seem to kick in until higher rpms. I dont get hardly any smoke( I got more from the programmer on the low end) but I have been able to get boost to about 38 at higher rpms and I can deffinitly tell a difference on top end on all three boxes. The only thing I can think of messing was when I first installed the stinger box I didnt have the pyrometer hooked up to it so it didnt work at all. Well I didnt know what was wrong so I tried stacking the programmer on it and it ran a little better than the programmer alone. Then I figured out to hook it up the the pyrometer and thats when it started working on top end only and when I tried to put the box back on it it would work. I just got a new stock VP( old one went out and warranty covered it) and it still runs the same. When I first put in my gauges I didnt know enough to get a fuel pressure gauge and now moneys tight so I cant tell you my fp. Any ideas?
CPavlic
CPavlic;
I own a Banks Stinger (Ottomind with the Stinger software) so I have some experience with it, but take what I say as a "helping notion" not as hard fast rules.
First off, a little background to help you get up to speed. There is two modes that you can electronically mess with engine performance using a tuning box. One is timing and the other is fueling.
Advancing the timing increases Hp. The high pressure injection pump (VP44) has a control solenoid on it that mechanically rotates. This relationship of rotation sets the timimg of the diesel injection pulse. If you rotate in one direction you can advance this timing and vice versa. By connecting the tuning box into the "Can Bus" connector on the left side of the engine is how the tuning box talks to the engine computer or the Engine Control Module (ECM).
A box that connects to the Can Bus is a timing box.
Increasing fuel increases Hp. The VP44 itself has a computer controller. Also, as with the timing solenoid, the VP44 has a fueling solenoid. This solenoid functions to open and dump the fuel pressure off of the injector. The injector requires a minimum pressure to open, but with a minimum pressure it opens fully and below that pressure closes fully. So opening the fuel solenoid earlier or later controls the amount of injected fuel. A box that adds fueling functions to hold the fueling solenoid closed longer, providing a longer fueling event and hence more fuel. This tuning box must talk directly to the VP44 computer and taps into a wire that comes from the ECM.
A box that taps into the wire for the VP44 is a fueling box.
Now for the Banks Stinger that I have. This tuner is for timing only. What it basically does is fake out the ECM into seeing something that does not really exist. In the process of doing that, makes the ECM perform as through it was operating under those conditions. Banks philosophy (I believe) is based upon maximum
sustainable power not maximum
attainable power. It limits maximum EGT. This means that if you reach a high enough EGT the box will downgrade itself in performance until you get right back to stock power. Boost is also monitored by the Stinger. The box will not allow fuel air ratios to get out of wack. Essentially this means that compares how much fuel you want (go peddle pressure) and compares that to how much air is available (boost) and won't really go beyond a stock setting unless it sees the opportunity to do so.
If you want to stay with reliable more or less safe power stay with the Banks. I you want more, go carefully and get informed about what you are doing to your engine.
OK now to answer your questions as best that I can.
I have a 2002 six speed that I got in 03.
The HO engine responds less to advancing the timing because it comes stock with more timing than a SO.
So I invested in a superchips programmer and exhaust and intake.
Where does this programmer connect to?
The intake and exhaust really add no Hp, but allow the engine to make more Hp with modifications.
Well since then I have been able to get the quick turbo assembly and first a stinger plus box and now a big hoss box level 5. The problem I am having is that when I ran both banks boxes it doesnt seem to kick in until higher rpms. I dont get hardly any smoke( I got more from the programmer on the low end) but I have been able to get boost to about 38 at higher rpms and I can deffinitly tell a difference on top end on all three boxes.
A WarninG Here To get 38 psi from a stock turbo the RPM is really off the scale. The performance curves that I have seen (hard to get good ones) shows that the stock turbo really likes to stay under 30 psi, but most people when admit that 35 psi is OK. You have to realize that more boost does not always equal more power. In your case at 38 psi boost I would assume you might be going backwards in your efforts. If it were me I would set that wastegate opening point back to 30 psi.
By adding your "Quick Turbo" you have essentially given yourself the potential to make more Hp, but you have do this at the expense of slower turbo spooling. At any rate you will find that a diesel does not have the off the idle acceleration that a gasser does. In my case I don't really feel a Hp hit until the boost pressure gets up to around 8 psi. This is a trade off. Think of it this way burning fuel makes exhaust and exhaust drives the turbo. The turbo must operate within boundary of xx amount of exhaust to make yy amounts of boost.
Banks boxes wait on air to fuel, this is why they don't smoke. Until you build boost you essentially have a stock truck.
To be able to tell the top end Hp you would need to put your truck on a Dyno.
The only thing I can think of messing was when I first installed the stinger box I didnt have the pyrometer hooked up to it so it didnt work at all.
Yes, the box limits EGT so it requires this connection. Other wise it just lets the stock configuration run.
I just got a new stock VP( old one went out and warranty covered it) and it still runs the same. When I first put in my gauges I didnt know enough to get a fuel pressure gauge and now moneys tight so I cant tell you my fp. Any ideas?
The new VP44 won't make any difference. Fuel pressure is supplied to the VP44 by a small electric pump that is prone to failure. When it fails it will often lead to a VP44 mechanical failure. The fuel pressure that is referred to is the pressure output from this electric pump. At idle you should see 14-15psi and wide open throttle (WOT) you should see 7-10 psi. On my truck I connected this downstream of the fuel filter right at the VP44 suction. Were I you, I would most definitely get a fuel pressure gauge when I could afford one.
OK, I'm done.
Keep in mind that reading stuff from a magazine can get pretty fuzzy. Thats how I started. TDR is a good start, learn to use the search function. Its hard to believe what you can learn, in a few hours of reading. Also you should list your current modifications, see how mine are listed below in my signiture. This will help others help you much better.
Just go slow at first then work up into a frenzy.
Good Luck;
Jim
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