International 4300 DT466 quits while running and then will not restart

[DPForumDog]

We are having our 2006 4300 (DT466) towed for the 3rd time. All 3 times same problem: the truck will be driving fine and all of a sudden the truck dies and will not restart. " no sputtering, nothing ... Just quit" (more details below)

(1) August 2015 ... truck was towed back to our place. One of the guys here said that he drained water out of the fuel and the truck started, but then it didn't start next day so we called local mechanic and he checked electrical connectors and found that fuse in battery box was not making connection and shorted. He charged us $200.00. truck ran fine for about 2 months

(2) October 2015 ..... Driver said he driving about 50 mph on 2 lane road when he realized something was wrong because the cruise control stopped. He said the accelerator was slightly responsive a few times but the truck stopped and would not start (even after it cooled off). We had it towed back to the International dealer where we spent over $1000.00 According to the wording on their invoice they did 4 tasks (1) they cleaned the fuel filter system and installed prescreen, replace fuel filter, screen fuel strainer, regulator assembly (2) they "found fuse for IDM burnt need to hard wire the connectors in battery box, by starter and by firewall need to replace the EDM/IDM power cable in the battery box" they did note "hard wire and the truck starts good. (3) one of the fuses shorting out, (4) reinstall drive shaft , installed drive line aired up trucked pushed in shop KT strap kit u-jt strap

(3) November 2015 ..... (Today) Driver was exiting freeway on an uphill ramp when he intentionally disengaged the cruise control. This time the pedal was unresponsive. So we are having it towed back to the International dealer.

Anybody know what is wrong with our truck. Obviously the professionals are clueless.
Thanks,
Granny DP

 

[Wayne M.]

Still blowing fuses?

 

[mwilson]

There are techs that understand electrical troubleshooting and then there are techs that do not. If you get assigned a tech that falls in the latter category at $100.00 plus per hour then God help you....

Two visits to the main power harness in the battery box would make me follow the whole mess right to the ECM for starters. Sounds like a chafed wire. Or a loose pin at the ECM connection harness. They may have to load the power harness to catch it in action.

Ask for, no INSIST on their best electrical technician. On a third visit you certainly have that right.

 

[BDaugherty]

Newer Internationals have junk wire harnesses. The power and ground connections in the battery box as well as the 3 wire idk connector near the firewall on the driver side are the most common problem areas. If the dealer fails to figure it out, stop spending money on labor and replace the engine harness as well as the sub harnesses going to the batteries. Your description of the problem is not detailed enough for a full blown diagnostic, but I see enough of the trucks to feel comfortable guessing wire harness. The dealer really should have nailed it. Where are you located?

 

[Wayne M.]

I agree. Many OE harnesses leave a lot to be desired.

 

[mwilson]

I have seen wires with the insulation worn through simply.from contact with the plastic loom that surrounds the harness. They owe you a do over.

 

[DonFitzwater]

Do these turds have the same style FICM as Ford?

 

[Wayne M.]

Do these turds have the same style FICM as Ford?

The DT466E and similar- yes. Same HEUI injectors and ford type electronics. You can really see the Ford/IH love on this.

 

[DonFitzwater]

I had a slope truck that would quit. When it did, it would flash FICM in the odometer readout. It would almost always restart......until the last time when it quit at -20 during a blow about a mile from camp. Had to walk to camp literally from delineator to delineator.....tried radioing camp but the fat little Rosie odonnel look alike was watching Elen and couldn't hear the radio.......nearly got squashed by a 966 Cat that night...........any way, FICM failures seem to rate pretty high on those engines.

 

[DPForumDog]

Sorry, I didn't get to check out any of your suggestions because it was towed directly to the local international dealer. They just got it "fixed" today (hopefully)
They performed 1 task .... "found ipr faulty pigtail, , cut out old IPR pigtail and wire in new one"

parts $24.91
labor $260.00
misc 5.00
taxes 2.70
total 292.61


Would a bad IPR pigtail (pig tail) cause the problem we were having?
Thanks for all the suggestions and help!
Granny DP
DPForumDog

 

[Wayne M.]

The IPR sensor is important. A good connection is imperative! It may be in the oil under the valve cover, and subjected to lots of abuse. I hope it was the fix.

 

[BDaugherty]

IPR valve controls the high psi oil pump. If you loose the connection, the valve defaults to the open position which dumps all the oil back to sump and would most certainly cause the engine to shut down. The IPR is instaaled i to the high pressure pump on the front driver side of the engine.

 

[Wayne M.]

IPR valve controls the high psi oil pump. If you loose the connection, the valve defaults to the open position which dumps all the oil back to sump and would most certainly cause the engine to shut down. The IPR is instaaled i to the high pressure pump on the front driver side of the engine.

Yep, I was thinking about a 6.0 where the IPR is very hard to get to.

 

[Bill Stockard]

The DT466E and similar- yes. Same HEUI injectors and ford type electronics. You can really see the Ford/IH love on this.

HEUI injectors are an original CAT design. From Wikipedia: "In 1993, CAT introduced "hydraulically actuated electronic unit injection" (HEUI), where the injectors are no longer camshaft-operated. First available on Navistar's 7.3L /444 cu.in, V8 diesel engine. HEUI uses engine oil pressure to power high-pressure fuel injection, where usual method of unit injector operation is the engine camshaft."

Bill

 

[Bill Stockard]

The DT466E and similar- yes. Same HEUI injectors and ford type electronics. You can really see the Ford/IH love on this.

HEUI injectors are an original CAT design. From Wikipedia: "In 1993, CAT introduced "hydraulically actuated electronic unit injection" (HEUI), where the injectors are no longer camshaft-operated. First available on Navistar's 7.3L /444 cu.in, V8 diesel engine. HEUI uses engine oil pressure to power high-pressure fuel injection, where usual method of unit injector operation is the engine camshaft."

Bill

 

[BDaugherty]

Heui fuel systems were originally designed in a joint effort between Cat and Navistar hence the reason both companies produced engines using Heui fuel systems. In the beginning, 3126 Cats, 7.3 powerstroke/T444e, and Dt466e all used very similar fuel injectors running less than 3000psi high pressure oil and results were mostly good. As emission rules changed, so did injector and high psi pump design and max operating pressure with less favorable results. Add to that International's use of extra cheap wire harnesses, and it was all down hill from there. Although I've never worked on one, even Detroit used a Heui fuel system in one of their engines.

 

[mwilson]

I believe the Detroit Diesel HEUI engine is a Series 40, which is nothing more than a re-branded DT466E as I recall. A lot of Fire Apparatus has that engine. When you look one up in the Detroit Diesel system the part numbers are Navistar for the most part.
Kinda' of a strange deal.

 

[Bill Stockard]

I believe the Detroit Diesel HEUI engine is a Series 40, which is nothing more than a re-branded DT466E as I recall. A lot of Fire Apparatus has that engine. When you look one up in the Detroit Diesel system the part numbers are Navistar for the most part.
Kinda' of a strange deal.

Yes, you are correct. The Detroit 40 was a rebadged DT466E. IIRC that was during the time when Detroit Diesel was owned by Roger Penske.

Bill

 

[Wayne M.]

The thing I was trying to point out was that I believe Navistar used Fords help in design. I've seen a lot of Ford electronics such as sensors and ECMs etc. I think even Perkins had a version called the phaser or something of the sort. My main experience with the DTe was in a Crane Carrier chassis back in the 90's.

 

[DPForumDog]

Original Poster Update: We were told to replace the fuel tank and we did ($2800.00). It has been running okay since then...but who knows because it would go months at a time before without acting up.

Please see my new post on us replacing two rusted fuel filters.