Like "rolling coal" ??

[JR]

Therein lies the issue. If the weirdos stayed in hollywierd, we’d be ok. JR, I was reading some of this hype, and one of these wierdos who thinks fairy dust comes out of electric cables comes from Rhode Island. It’s well known that great places like Colorado, western NC, parts of Virginia are being invaded by the demanding idiots.
No wonder the native inhabitants are reacting in some way.

My point wasn't very well articulated, there was supposed to be a slash in between millionaire/movie stars. And Hollywierd being pretty much every large city in America right now! Where politics and fame rule the land. Or at least the headlines for the day.

As a professional wrench of a few years—23, not many but not a rookie—and an avid racer of all things internal combustion powered, I sort of like the Tesla for what it is.

The invasiveness of the Telsa cloud I can do without, and currently they are being very difficult as far as DIY goes but if Musk can be trusted to be truthful he sees the cars as very open source and DIY friendly eventually.

Tesla charging stations are on property owned by Tesla, or on land leased by them. They are being installed 100% paid for by the company. Basic universal “EV charging stations” I’m not sure about but Tesla is footing the bill for their own.

We have a ton of electric rigs at work, from large diesel electric heavy machinery down to Polaris Ranger EVs, GEMs and little golf cart things. I embrace the knowledge to work on them.

If I could get one to last more than 1.5 days on a charge (150 mile daily commute) and could get over how connected they are to mommy I’d seriously consider one for commuting.

I have no problem with them either. In fact anyone addicted to the torque of a diesel would or should be at least equally addicted to the torque of an electric motor.
Just dont expect me to"chip in" on the cost of your new electric car anymore than I should expect you to chip in on my new oil burner. Thats where things run afoul in my book . If the tech is solid it will stand on its own.

 

[Dl5treez]

Just dont expect me to"chip in" on the cost of your new electric car anymore than I should expect you to chip in on my new oil burner. Thats where things run afoul in my book. If the tech is solid it will stand on its own.

I hear this a lot but haven’t seen it yet. The tax credits, HOV/bus lane usage, and other things are offset by rather large increases in license fees here in Washington.

 

[Wayne M.]

The other big lie/ coverup is the resources needed for the battery and electronics. The mining involved for the lithium and other rare elements needed to get this in every driveway is an eye opener! To compound, none of it is here in the US. I’m sure POTUS is thrilled about that!
Then once the car is done, the real problem will be realized. What to do with the wasted HazMat components. We’re starting to see this with all the hybrid batteries that are pulled from the 15 year old prius’ (priui in plural?). Yes there is a phone number to call to cart away that huge battery, just like any lithium ion or ni cad pack in your house.
THEN, JR, do you or anyone here have a solar roof? Unless you’re off the grid, or are using all of it, and own the system, you’re already helping the cause!

 

[JR]

The other big lie/ coverup is the resources needed for the battery and electronics. The mining involved for the lithium and other rare elements needed to get this in every driveway is an eye opener! To compound, none of it is here in the US. I’m sure POTUS is thrilled about that!
Then once the car is done, the real problem will be realized. What to do with the wasted HazMat components. We’re starting to see this with all the hybrid batteries that are pulled from the 15 year old prius’ (priui in plural?). Yes there is a phone number to call to cart away that huge battery, just like any lithium ion or ni cad pack in your house.
THEN, JR, do you or anyone here have a solar roof? Unless you’re off the grid, or are using all of it, and own the system, you’re already helping the cause!

Do you mean the mining that is largely done overseas by children, with the safe practices that would shut an operation down with the inspector simply walking onsite stateside?
I hear you Wayne, and don't disagree with anything youve said so far.
Again, if the technology is sound it needs to stand on its own. NOT through subsidies, and NOT by kicking the can down the road to let the next country deal with the aftermath.

I hear this a lot but haven’t seen it yet. The tax credits, HOV/bus lane usage, and other things are offset by rather large increases in license fees here in Washington.

What type of license fees?

Unless its substantial enough to offset miles driven in a year plus the tax credits most qualify for at purchase the general public is largely footing the bill for something they don't even use.
That's subsidizing.

 

[JR]

On a lighter note, Wayne you asked about my energy usage, mine (heat) comes from labor. Given it "makes" heat 3 times, it has to be the most efficient form available.... in spite of it being the oldest
At the very least, it builds some character in the younguns!
See how thrilled!

 

[Wayne M.]

Ha. I guess you have a external wood furnace? I grew up shoveling coal into a Vermont Castings Vigilant, until you couldn’t get it anymore around here.

The fees are license and road use fees and other similar fees. The issue is that the gov has realized that since these folks aren’t pumping fuel/ paying tax, it’s another way to generate revenue. There was a thread on this topic. It’s a problem out in Arizona.

 

[JR]

Ha. I guess you have a external wood furnace? I grew up shoveling coal into a Vermont Castings Vigilant, until you couldn’t get it anymore around here.

The fees are license and road use fees and other similar fees. The issue is that the gov has realized that since these folks aren’t pumping fuel/ paying tax, it’s another way to generate revenue. There was a thread on this topic. It’s a problem out in Arizona.

Yes, outdoor burner. She eats the fuel (wood)!
The pictures I posted are from a giant oak on an acquaintances property that was damaged during a microburst 2 years ago. I generally don't mess with stuff this big (32"+ 16 ft up) but it is so straight and true it was too good to pass up. I'm going to have some of it milled into boards for something in the future. The wifes been bugging me for another project.

 

[seafish]

Yes, outdoor burner. She eats the fuel (wood)!
The pictures I posted are from a giant oak on an acquaintances property that was damaged during a microburst 2 years ago. I generally don't mess with stuff this big (32"+ 16 ft up) but it is so straight and true it was too good to pass up. I'm going to have some of it milled into boards for something in the future. The wifes been bugging me for another project.

YES!!! make some lumber out of that giant...WAY too nice to simply burn it up!!!
If your wife doesn't have enough ideas already (JK/LOL) how about a large plank trestle farm table???

 

[Dl5treez]

Do you mean the mining that is largely done overseas by children, with the safe practices that would shut an operation down with the inspector simply walking onsite stateside?
I hear you Wayne, and don't disagree with anything youve said so far.
Again, if the technology is sound it needs to stand on its own. NOT through subsidies, and NOT by kicking the can down the road to let the next country deal with the aftermath.

What type of license fees?

Unless its substantial enough to offset miles driven in a year plus the tax credits most qualify for at purchase the general public is largely footing the bill for something they don't even use.
That's subsidizing.

Like Wayne has already stated before I got back online here, the States are ramping up the license tabs on electric and hybrid vehicles to offset what the owners aren’t paying in gas/fuel taxes.

The mining for the raw materials thing is a real issue and so is the disposal.

Just like corporate America, the “experts in government” haven’t developed a ‘metric’ to pie chart it with in PowerPoint, or come up with a way to tax the process yet, so until then it doesn’t exist. lol

 

[petersonj]

“Rolling Coal” – all these stories remind me of a time that could be considered as one of the earliest “rolling coal” incidents – I just didn’t know that’s what it was called back then. And, it was not intentional.

In June of 1988 I installed a 4BTA 3.9 liter Cummins engine in my 1984 Ford E-150 full sized van. I lived in Leadville, Colorado at the time (elevation, 10,200 feet)

Later in the summer, my 16 year old daughter was in the driver’s seat and I was in the passenger seat. She had her learner’s permit and we were out for a driving lesson. She was doing well with operating the manual 4 speed overdrive transmission.

We were on a quiet country lane heading back to town pulling a slight grade. Seeing a bicyclist ahead riding near the edge of the road, I mentioned that she should slow and move over, which she obliged. At the time, the transmission was in third gear and I suggested that she should shift into second gear since she had slowed considerably.

She made the shift, but unknowingly to her (and to me) she connected with fourth gear.

Timing is everything. When she let out the clutch and realized there was no power, she just stepped on the throttle. I learned then that this engine was a very efficient smoke producer, especially at 10,000 feet. Unfortunately, the bicyclist learned the same thing, but I don’t think he was impressed.

As hindsight, I should have had my daughter stop on the shoulder and I should have walked back to the bicyclist and apologize to him. Then again, if he saw me walking toward him after that incident, he might have just turned around and rode off.

- John

 

[Wayne M.]

Yes, outdoor burner. She eats the fuel (wood)!
The pictures I posted are from a giant oak on an acquaintances property that was damaged during a microburst 2 years ago. I generally don't mess with stuff this big (32"+ 16 ft up) but it is so straight and true it was too good to pass up. I'm going to have some of it milled into boards for something in the future. The wifes been bugging me for another project.

I’m no judge of lumber, but those look like 100 year old trees, and yes, pretty straight!

 

[Wayne M.]

“Rolling Coal” – all these stories remind me of a time that could be considered as one of the earliest “rolling coal” incidents – I just didn’t know that’s what it was called back then. And, it was not intentional.

In June of 1988 I installed a 4BTA 3.9 liter Cummins engine in my 1984 Ford E-150 full sized van. I lived in Leadville, Colorado at the time (elevation, 10,200 feet)

Later in the summer, my 16 year old daughter was in the driver’s seat and I was in the passenger seat. She had her learner’s permit and we were out for a driving lesson. She was doing well with operating the manual 4 speed overdrive transmission.

We were on a quiet country lane heading back to town pulling a slight grade. Seeing a bicyclist ahead riding near the edge of the road, I mentioned that she should slow and move over, which she obliged. At the time, the transmission was in third gear and I suggested that she should shift into second gear since she had slowed considerably.

She made the shift, but unknowingly to her (and to me) she connected with fourth gear.

Timing is everything. When she let out the clutch and realized there was no power, she just stepped on the throttle. I learned then that this engine was a very efficient smoke producer, especially at 10,000 feet. Unfortunately, the bicyclist learned the same thing, but I don’t think he was impressed.

As hindsight, I should have had my daughter stop on the shoulder and I should have walked back to the bicyclist and apologize to him. Then again, if he saw me walking toward him after that incident, he might have just turned around and rode off.

- John

Where’s this van today ??!!

 

[PBJ2500CTD]

I have no problem with them either. In fact anyone addicted to the torque of a diesel would or should be at least equally addicted to the torque of an electric motor...

The torque of an electric motor is awesome. However, a few "light to light" amazements will result in a couple hour stopover at one of those Tesla charging stations, as well as a slightly reduced $battery$ life.

 

[jgillott]

Has anyone here driven a Tesla or other electric vehicle? I haven't had the chance to. Of course, they aren't very common in this area.

 

[petersonj]

Where’s this van today ??!!

Well, I drove it for three years and 84,000 miles (202,000 miles total on the odometer). I found the guy who I had sold the removed gas engine to and bought it back from him - it was still setting in storage. I removed the Cummins and put that original gas engine back into the van. Then I sold the van.

Since I was living in snow country in the high mountains of Colorado, I bought a new 1991 Ford F150 4x4 extended cab with a 300 CID in-line six cylinder in front of a 5 speed manual transmission. A nice combination for a 4BTA 3.9 Cummins, I thought. I brought the new truck up from Denver and with only 120 miles on the odometer, I pulled out the engine. My friends thought I was nuts.

So I put the Cummins in that truck and drove it for seven years and 212,000 miles. The engine made the truck outstanding in regards to performance. I sold the gas engine a year later to a high school in Denver for a student project.

I finally sold the truck to a friend in Redding, California and have lost touch with him. At some point he had 280,000 miles on the odometer, so that means the engine had over 360,000 miles on it. He finally had to replace the water pump because it was seeping.

That truck might still be floating around somewhere, or maybe the engine has been pulled and is being used in something more fun.

- John

 

[Wayne M.]

Has anyone here driven a Tesla or other electric vehicle? I haven't had the chance to. Of course, they aren't very common in this area.

No. But they have a trick screen and trick door handles that break.

 

[Dl5treez]

I’ve driven a Model S. Couple different ones. They’re a pretty cool car to drive. The interface is always connected to the mother ship. Always. Not in a way that I like.

The torque even from the low end Model S is fun. The P100D I drove was nuts.

The Seattle store let me take two of them out with the salesman of course, in my dirty Carhartts and work boots. He knew I wasn’t a buyer but said let’s take them out anyway so you can experience it.

 

[jgillott]

Do they have any sound to them when you drive or do they sound/feel like an electric golf cart?

 

[JR]

YES!!! make some lumber out of that giant...WAY too nice to simply burn it up!!!
If your wife doesn't have enough ideas already (JK/LOL) how about a large plank trestle farm table???

Funny you mention this, a table of sorts is "on the table". Alot will depend on condition of the tree whebwI cut into it .

 

[Wayne M.]

Has anyone here driven a Tesla or other electric vehicle? I haven't had the chance to. Of course, they aren't very common in this area.

I have some experience with electric powered forklifts and small golf cart “GEM” type vehicles, and honestly they are great for getting around the larger facilities and doing lighter work, but once they die, they’re useless. I much prefer hybrid tech if I HAD to choose an alternative. The Nissan Leaf was a total flop, the Prius and Escape/ RAV4 hybrids are a success. We’ve tried electric 12’ box trucks, the small Ford Transit with no so great success. Trying a Hybrid street sweeper now.
My job has an entire alternative fuels office where the head guy there has to bang his head against the wall looking for groundbreaking ways to get off fossil. Most recently, I heard about this project-
http://www.columbia.edu/~ja3041/Ele... by J Aber Columbia University - May 2016.pdf
And there will be an all electric garbage truck to follow this.