Made in China

[TRpolk]

I work for a small manufacturer (150 employees). One of our divisions designs & manufactures OEM parts for the barbecue

grill industry. The question I have is; how do we compete with China? It seems most of current customers are going to start buying from China, because the Chinese can deliver what appears to be fair quality product for less than we can buy the raw materials for. Then we have to add on for little things like Overhead (Taxes, Taxes, Taxes, Building rent, Insurance, Utilities) Employee wages and a little profit to keep the stock holders happy. Our problem is not unique, it is happening all across America and we as the buying public are the problem. The only solution I can come up with is, lay off all of our employees, sell our equipment and become broker for Chinese made products.

That last sentence made my skin crawl as I wrote it. We as TDR members are an intelligent, like minded group of individuals that should be able to come up with ideas on how to address this problem.



Best regards,



Tim

 

[Deezul1]

I ask if a product is made in China and if it is I explain I dont buy made in China if at all possible. Sometimes its unavoidable as they seem to have such low prices that vendors cant compete with China so have to carry China stuff or go out of business.

I seem to rember at some time in the past that there was a big stink about Japanese products coming here with very small tariff added but we couldnt export anything to them without huge tariffs added. Is there something like that going on here?

Also what happens 10 years from now when China has all those American dollars to support modern armies and weaponry and their overcrowding problem becomes unbearable. I sure dont know but it makes me stop and think a little.

 

[illflem]

Sorry to hear about that

One of the disasters that occurred before I got out of the apple growing business was when the Chinese started exporting frozen apple juice concentrate here priced cheaper than we would have to pay for just the freight. A lawsuit was filed and won accusing the Chinese of dumping but not before it helped many growers go bankrupt. After the lawsuit a tariff was levied that made US concentrate competive, the Chinese lost the edge and quit exporting here. It might be worthwhile for you to investigate if they are selling at a loss, it violates free trade agreements. Good luck convincing buyers to buy American, contrary to all the hoopla about it they will still buy the cheapest product.

 

[rrausch]

This is all very sad. "Made In USA" used to mean so much. It still does, to some extent, but is getting harder and harder to find, due to situations like TRpolk's. I try to buy American made whenever I have a choice, but often there is no choice.



About 6-7 years ago I went out to buy some jack stands for my truck, and

the American made ones were almost $100 while the Chinese ones were less than $20. OK, I backed off and bought the Chinese ones, the brand name was Larin. Just a few months later I read in the paper of the many shell corporations the Chinese People's Liberation Army uses to manufacture goods with slave labor and sell them to make money for the P. L. A. , and sure enough, Larin Co. was one of them. I felt like such a fool. I had supported one of the biggest killing machines in the world.



Does anybody besides me know that the Red Chinese murdered over 30 Million of their own people in the 1960's during the cultural revolution?

 

[Champane Flight]

We

We as a nation have gone from a manufacturing based nation to a service based nation. Having said that, how about you get rid of all your tool dies and turn your factory into a warehouse? Keep your employees and turn the company into a warehouse/shipping company for these Chinese products? Or you could go into a high end barbecue manufacture or just assemble theirs. I know it isn't the ideal situation. But how do you compete with slave labor?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

THIS is a tough subject - and one for which there is NO solution for the ordinary citizen in this country - it was crafted by socialist liberal organizations with the vigorous help of many elected officials. It has been done under the guise of "humanitarian policy", as a means to redistribute USA wealth among poorer nations, while giving our domestic manufacturers a way to make more profit by exporting American jobs and dollars offshore - NAFTA and GATT come most pointedly to mind...



As we become more dependent upon foreign products - and virtually sacrifice our jobs and sovereignty - we are ALSO creating and subsidizing an entire WORLD who hates us, and will use our own dollars to subdue us!



As jobs and incomes of the vast majority of our society continue to fall, how can we possibly expect them to continue to pay top dollar for various USA made goods, when they can buy a Chinese made equivelant for 1/4 the price? Our FIRST and most *immediate* responsibility is to feed, clothe and maintain our family as best we can, and at the lowest cost - usually, the luxury of "buying American" isn't really an option, even if it IS available!



Look at our dodges - remove all the foreign built, assembled or supplied stuff from them, and how much do you think would be left? NOT MUCH! But as high priced as these trucks are, how much MORE expensive do you think they would be if they WERE ALL American? And have we REALLY made any new friends in places like Mexico where they were mostly built and manufactured - or in various Asian countries where the REST of the trim and stuff came from?



Has our grand liberal/socialist efforts to spread wealth and goodwill to foreign countries WORKED? Do we have more friends abroad NOW than we did 50 years ago?



What do YOU think...

 

[rrausch]

Well said Gary! I wish it weren't so true.



9-11 was a wake-up call for many of the hand-wringing "one-worlders". The reality is that there are a lot of bad countries out there who are trying to make sure the US is destroyed. Why we are still giving those countries a lot of foreign aid is a very good question.



Personally I feel we should take a tiny little step backwards and only allow land-owning Men the right to vote. It would solve a lot of problems.

 

[jpolston]

I am currently a Production Superintendent in a large manufacturing facility, I have also consulted Internationally; with this experience, I will share my following opinion. I believe Americans in general are short sighted and only concentrate on thier short term wants and needs. This is evidenced in the me/now society and supported by the fact that many empolyees will not do the "extra" that is needed to keep our country on the leading edge of quality and production. Take a casual survey at your work place (include yourself), how many people over extend breaks and lunch, start late, quit early, miss days, and surf the net ( you know who you are) while sacrificing your work ethic. These people are the first to complain about "Managemant", lower wages, and shrinking jobs. Every major undertaking is accomplished by smaller task... . so if you're trully concerned about the state of our nation, do something about it. If needed, change your own behavor, encourage your peers, we all can make a difference, we've done it in the past. Don't blame other countries for struggling for survival, meet them head on with competition. If I've offended anyone, remember, " The truth only hurts if it's supposed to"

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

WE can produce as well - and better - than most of our competition - but we CAN'T do the job properly when the deck is stacked AGAINST us - and THAT is a large part of the equation where products made inside the US competing with stuff being made at slave labor wages outside our country!



This isn't about senseless whining - I'd put my own work ethic up against ANYONES - but HOW can *I* or my company compete, when the SAME work can (and IS!) be done in a foreign country where the company can hire *4* or more people for what *I* must earn in THIS country to support my family - and in that foreign country, relaxed or non-existant EPA and similar controls FURTHER reduce the cost of manufacture! Is that "work ethic", or stacked-deck politics?



How many Mexicans do you suppose now have inside plumbing and drive new vehicles to the many auto plants in Mexico because of the "humanitarian employment" DC, Ford or GM provides? Where do you suppose the increased profits from reduced labor costs goes?



THAT was one of the biggest reasons for this country's refusal to join the big recent multi-nation environmental conference - it required US to greatly EXPAND our environmental policies and expenses - and at the SAME time, allow foreign countries to RELAX theirs, or for US to PAY for THEIR upgrades! The expected cost for the USA was *BILLIONS* of dollars!



In this mornings paper, the World Trade Organization (WTO) has voted to impose *4 BILLION DOLLARS* in trade sanctions against US companies as penalty for what THEY call "unfair tax breaks" given to US companies operating abroad as they try to remain competitive in a world market - is that "work ethics", or just plain POLITICS?



The more we in the USA propose to "help" raise the standard of living in foreign countries, the richer their top politicians get - the more belligerant and abusive they become towards us - and the POORER and WEAKER our OWN country becomes! And WAY too soon, they stop ASKING us for additional considerations, and begin DEMANDING them - and THREATENING us if we don't comply!



Early in GW's term, he promised to supply Taiwan (I think it was), a dozen or so submarines - in earlier years, no problem - we had the capability of total manufacturing and outfitting of those subs... NOW, due to our increased shipping of technology and manufacturing overseas - and reliance upon foreign countries for many of the major assemblies we need, the UN opposed that decision, and as a UN member, Sweden, the country we NOW rely on for the big diesel engines used in those subs said - "you may want to sell those subs to Taiwan - but WHERE are you gonna get the ENGINES? *WE* sure aren't gonna make 'em for ya!"



The very countries that USED to rely upon the US for support and assistance are NOW no longer ASKING us for support, or respecting us for our past assistance - but rather are DICTATING what we can or cannot do thru organizations like NATO, the UN, and WTO... .



"Work ethic" has little to do with it - POLITICS and big $$$ has EVERYTHING to do with it!

 

[Doubleclutch]

WE are the problem. Example- American flag waving from new KIA. Mc Fly's of America, WAKE UP!!! I don't think I can argue with either one of you guys, even though you're coming from different directions. The bottom line IS a problem. It controls my wages, my boss' decisions, and the CEO's directions. Who's watching the bottom line... WE the stock holders. How much R&D goes on due to bottom line constraints? Costs too much and doesn't add short term money. How long until America is a service only nation? The folks that kiss babies every four years need to start making the hard call, because they are the only ones who control the playing field. How China ever got to be a most favored nation is an abomination. How-a-bout we put our prisoners to work making chop sticks... Enough. Only gets worse the more you think about it.